This was an upgrade that I was going to make next year, but winning a 1st place in the WM Personal Best speeded things up.
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With our soft earth, outriggers will gradually sink and constant readjustment becomes necessary. This becomes a chore, because the outriggers under the rail are a bit difficult after the mill is set up.
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This outrigger has sunk 5" due to soft wet ground and log weight.
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Two of my three new FAO's
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The WM speed wrench is good for setup, but I have found that I like the T Handle for making quick adjustments.
lookin good.
if it sinks that much have you thought of welding a larger piece of metal on the bottom to spread out the weight a little?
MM How old is that mill anyway? It's pink!
I deal with the soft dirt also. I just carry some 2X6 boards with me and put a chunk under every jack and the tires. The reason for putting it under the tires is so that I don't have to dig under the boards so the the jack is not sticking up to high.
Magic, I have always though they would be better than OEM style. tell us the pro,s and con,s of them so far. do they adjust down eough or do you just add blocking when out of adjustment. is it a pain in the back to pull the pin on bottom vs top. and the most important question is how much per jack?
Quote from: DR_Buck on December 09, 2011, 11:04:55 PM
MM How old is that mill anyway? It's pink!
Buck,thats Salmon not pink :D Tim
I carry a milk crate with me filled with 1 and 2 by 8 squares to increase the footprint on those little tiny feet. It sure helps alot and at the moment is alot cheaper than those QA stands. WM wants gold for those things. Maybe one day when the coffers are fuller.
Don
That is a sunburned WM. ;D That old '98 model has never been under a shed, but I do have covers for the engine, degarker, setworks, seat, & fuel tank.
I have jacked or pulled the mill up on 2X12's or dug in those outriggers for the last time. Although I do still have 3 manual outriggers, those are the easy ones and do not sink in as badly anyway. The new FAO's have a very large footprint but I can easily slide a board under them. They do not and can not stick up above the saw deck.
Those FAO's are pricey, but there is a lot of hardware in them. About $250 each for the ones under the rail fore and aft the axle. $210 for the front (hitch) one. I bought mine while the 10% sale was on and stretched my Personal Best $$$, and popped for an additional Logrite.
Winning was just a bonus for me. I had already made the decision to replace the two under the rail.
MM I put 1x8 or 12 of hard wood 2' long under the legs, works good for me. but I put on the locks so they don;t loosen :D :D :D :D
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I marked the nuts on mine and so far they have not turned while I was sawing, but I haven't sawed any large jobs either. Time will tell.
The ground is very soft where the mill is set up now. I did not put down boards and I have screwed them into the ground. Of course, all that I have to do is to unscrew them and then lay a board down. ;D
Winning this year's Wood-Mizer Personal Best Goodwill category and also the People's Choice award netted me some credit on my WM account.
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I ordered my last three FAO's and they got installed this afternoon. Two on the loader side and also the back end. :)
I really want some of those I love my LT 35 but those jacks suck! They are hard to deal with while setting up as well as taking the mill down! I had a customer call my jacks a s***** set up! >:(
They look very nice on your mill MM and they have to be a huge improvement. So far I have been getting by with the stock ones and placing a short /wide block with large wedges to fine adjust mine and it works for me but next time I will get all that good stuff and an extension also.
You will like them a lot Magicman and don't out stretch the spring that's inside them . Lift the handle push the leg down with your foot an 1" or two let go of the handle push with your foot and the leg pin will click in . If you hold the handle and push the leg down to far the spring will stretch out .And the leg won't go back up all the way without your help :) ;)
None of mine have springs, so I guess WM changed the design. ???
Or maybe they send out different ones for payin' customers. :D
No springs in mine either. The only one that can possibly stick up above the deck is the one in the back. Usually it doesn't. It's also the only one I'd bother with a speed handle for. I prefer a ratchet for all the other ones. I don't even carry a speed handle any more; it's not worth it to me. :)
Apparently there were several changes because Peter Drouin also commented about having to use a locking thingy on top to keep the nut stationary. Mine have never turned.
No question, I will enjoy now having all six FAO's.
So with the new ones you pull a pin, only my front and back ones do that
Quote from: Ga Mtn Man on September 23, 2013, 07:53:05 AM
Or maybe they send out different ones for payin' customers. :D
are you trying to say something
I believe that Paul was reminding me that mine were paid for with the WM Personal Best award. smiley_thumbsup smiley_thumbsup
You know what they say about a joke you have to explain... :-\
A belated congratulations to you Magicman on a much deserved win. smiley_clapping smiley_clapping
Quote from: Magicman on September 23, 2013, 09:00:05 AM
Apparently there were several changes because Peter Drouin also commented about having to use a locking thingy on top to keep the nut stationary. Mine have never turned.
No question, I will enjoy now having all six FAO's.
WM sells a plate to fit over the drive nut; prevents it from turning. Making your own would be a piece of cake. I never bothered 'cause as far as I can tell mine have never backed off on their own either.
Are the fine adjust outriggers slower, faster, easier, harder to setup?
I move my mill a lot, so speed and ease are both important.
I have worn out a few legs and holders in the process, and noticed today it is about time to change the one behind the axle on the rail side.
How do these hold up over time when used regularly?
Quote from: backwoods sawyer on September 25, 2013, 02:21:20 AM
Are the fine adjust outriggers slower, faster, easier, harder to setup?
I move my mill a lot, so speed and ease are both important.
I have worn out a few legs and holders in the process, and noticed today it is about time to change the one behind the axle on the rail side.
How do these hold up over time when used regularly?
In a perfect world the stock ones would be faster I think. But how often do you get to set up in Never-never land? Under normal conditions these are much faster and easier. And as the mill settles itself in, adjustments are just as easy and take seconds. I prefer a 1/2" ratchet over the speed handle myself.
I've only had mine for less than two years, so I really can't say yet about the longevity. But so far so good.
When the head is in the travel position, the two outriggers under it are very difficult to reach. The head needs to be moved first. That is the only drawback I have found to date.
When retracting the leg, don't jam the screw into the stops. When you reach the stop, back off just a bit. I think jamming into the stop could cause damage in the long run, just like cranking a screw valve wide open will.
For cases where you can't quite extend the leg far enough to reach the first pin hole, I carry a couple of 6x6 blocks. You could do without them, but it's faster and easier. Not often needed.
My main question about the FAOs is what is their maximum length of travel (distance the foot moves from the furthest up and down positions). I'd appreciate if someone could measure & post this.
I think I understand the benefits of the FAOs (fine adjustment on setup, fine and fast adjustment if the mill settles in, and tops of the FAO's are never in the path of the blade). But I'm unsure if there is anything important (to me) that I'll give up if I switch. With the stock outriggers, the adjustments are so fast, the range of travel good, and the mechanism simple and trouble free. I especially like that I can quickly jack up the front one high when I am hooking up the mill. I'd hate to spend about $1400 on new FAOs, then find I miss the old ones.
My standard setup procedure: think clearly and get the front 3 outriggers right the first time. Put these down forming a "tripod" which establishes level front to back, and side to side, with their height below the blade travel. Then set the back 3 . "Jack out the crown" of the mill rail when setting the rear 2 along the rail. Put boards under the drive side tire, and the loader feet, when these are off the ground. I carry a bucket of shims (1/4, 1/2, 1, 2") which accomplish the fine adjustment and deals pretty well with "settling in".
I got the first 3 two years ago and immediately knew that the other 3 would be replaced someday. Now they are done but I can not speak about their performance yet, but I am confidant that all will be OK.
Quote from: terrifictimbersllc on September 25, 2013, 07:01:46 AM
My main question about the FAOs is what is their maximum length of travel (distance the foot moves from the furthest up and down positions). I'd appreciate if someone could measure & post this
I have not measured, but I have no question that the "length of travel" is at least as much as the originals, probably further.
My only issue is that the front FAO is "missing" a hole. On setups when the front is low, I have to use blocks because the top hole is too high and the next hole is too low. I know "drill holes" which I will do "someday".
I am curious about the back FAO because it is completely different from the others.
Quote from: Magicman on September 25, 2013, 08:35:26 AM
My only issue is that the front FAO is "missing" a hole. On setups when the front is low, I have to use blocks because the top hole is too high and the next hole is too low. I know "drill holes" which I will do "someday".
I am curious about the back FAO because it is completely different from the others.
Drilling another hole wouldn't be a bad idea, but like you I just use blocks. Don't need them often.
The back outrigger can, under some situations, be too high. That one has a
lot of travel. Normally, even if it seems too high, once you've moved the head to the front it will go down enough to not be an issue.
I always carry a handfull of falling wedges to adjust out riggers and a loose leg can be tightened up quickly. My Cooks mill uses a fine ajust type of out rigger but it has issues with slipping.
with a substantial difference in price to replace, it would need to be a ease of use to sell me on them.