A friend just had 18 acres cleared and has huge piles of oak, pine, maple and cherry. I am new to sawmilling and unsure how to proceed. After buying a tractor and WM LT28 I am to broke to offer money but suggested I mill them and we split the money from lumber sales. He is leaning towards selling them all to a local mill. If he allows me to mill them, what should I mill them into? This seems like a much too good opportunity to let pass but I need advice on how to proceed. Any help will be appreciated. Thankyou-Chuck
chuckzx12,welcome to the forum.Probably be better off selling the logs to a mill. Some on here do sell lumber,but it can be a hard market. If you have 1X6 they want 1x8. If you have 12 footors they want 10's or 16's. Some will buy green lumber,but most want it dry and maybe planed too. There is alot to selling lumber. Yes,you might sell some,but maybe not all. Need a way to store the lumber,need a building.
Welcome to the Forestry Forum, Chuck.
I think I'd get him to talking about the price of store bought lumber and how it wouldn't be costing him anything to just have some on hand and work a deal with him to saw on a percentage. Let him do what he wants with his share and you have yours. Even if you get him to let you do a part of what he has you're showing him that you can do it and making a name for yourself in the area.
Just my thoughts.
Allan
1st question - do you have a market for the lumber? Do you plan to sell it green or are you going to sticker it and air dry - or buy a kiln? Do you have a place to store the lumber? Equipment to handle the logs and lumber? That's a lot of lumber to do something with. I'd make sure I had a market before putting the time and effort into milling it myself. Good luck! :) By the way, welcome to the forum. Lots of good information here!
Thanks for the replies. I have a Kubota L3800, no kiln so I would have to air dry or sell wet, I would sticker stack and cover. Not sure of the local market but I know that 1x6 and 2xanything can sell quickly as I have many friends who do construction. I realize it will take a year or more to dry so no money until then. I would also like to build a large pavillion in which to do future milling and keep all the equipment out of the weather.
If you do it full time it would probably take you 40-50 workdays to saw that all up. That is counting 25-30 logs sawed per day. I imagine that moving the lumber, slabs and sawdust will be quite a logistical challenge. Then you will have to sell the lumber. Some say that's when the hard work begins.
I just saw your post. The L3800 is a very capable helper, but it will have it's "hands full". Even if you will not saw up the whole pile, try to talk about some of the logs.
I learned how to run my mill on a large pile of pine logs I sawed for my neighbor. My guess is that it was around 6-7mbf but I didn't keep track, just sawed until I ran out of logs. I didn't make a dime on it, but I took all the experience with me. It helps that I'm good friends with that neighbor, plus he gives me free lumber if I ever need any.
Quote from: chuckzx12 on October 22, 2013, 09:42:53 PM
Not sure of the local market but I know that 1x6 and 2xanything can sell quickly as I have many friends who do construction.
Keep in mind that most local codes require grade stamped lumber for residential and commercial construction (for the structural lumber). Also, it's hard to make money selling at the prices local lumber yards sell their 2x's for.
I may suggest we mill enough for our personal use (he needs a garage and I need a pavillion) out of pine. That would save me money and the is the reason I bought the mill. I also do some tree work and it kills me to cut an 80 foot pine into campfire wood. I have no idea what to do with maple. Could make a few tables from oak. Not sure the best use for cherry. This is a part time gig for me usually about 10-25 hours per week. I got a week or 2 to figure this out and thank you all for your input.
Chuck, if you want to get your feet wet this would be a perfect time to saw on trade for sure. I would suggest that he sells what logs he can, keeping back the best for personal use. You could then do a log swap for sawing his out. The both of you would benefit, and you could increase your skill level. Just a thought, david
Thanks David-I think that is a good plan and seems to be the direction I am leaning. I know he would give me the lumber I need for milling his. Wish I had a use for oak...some of this stuff is perfect.
Welcome to the Forestry Forum, Chuckzx12.
Many have already mentioned the market, and it is all important. Random sawing various dimensions of lumber will insure that you get stuck with various dimensions of lumber without a market for that lumber. I know. I tried it. :-\
Welcome to the forum Chuckzx12. Sounds like an interesting decision you have to make. Good luck!
Welcome aboard,
if you can figure your needs prior to sawing, it works much better ;)
Quote from: thecfarm on October 22, 2013, 09:22:52 PM
chuckzx12,welcome to the forum.Probably be better off selling the logs to a mill. Some on here do sell lumber,but it can be a hard market. If you have 1X6 they want 1x8. If you have 12 footors they want 10's or 16's. Some will buy green lumber,but most want it dry and maybe planed too. There is alot to selling lumber. Yes,you might sell some,but maybe not all. Need a way to store the lumber,need a building.
Amen to that!
DGDrls
Welcome to the Forestry Forum, chuckzx12.
1,200 sounds like a lot of logs, especially when a lot of us mobile sawyers pull up to a log pile and there are usually anywhere from 15 to 50 logs in the pile!
I think if you manage to get the complete sawjob, you'll have some degradation in some of the logs before you get done!
One thing which hasn't been said,
Sort out all of the logs, keep may be four or five truckloads of the most perfect stuff, Sell the rest to the mill.
That is certainly an optimistic first job, and possibly overwhelming once you start into the pile and get a few logs done. However, you would get a lot of valuable experience very quickly. You will probably trade in your 28 for an LT40 hydraulic about a quarter of the way through ;D
One idea that would enable you to saw much faster and possibly more efficiently, is to get in touch with some local timber frame companies, as well as lumber yards, and ask if they need, or would like to buy, large diameter timbers. If you could find the right market for timbers it would make the sawing go much faster.
I will mill timbers all day long on my manual mill, but I won't mill dimensional lumber aside from doing it "on my way to the timber".
Do you have a front end loader grapple?
I'm curious, what are the diameters of the logs? On an LT28, larger diameter (i.e. 16" and up) get to be quite tiring particularly if they are 12' or longer in length. At that size, a good day on an LT28 might be 5 logs per day (unless you have help). Edging will be done on the mill presumably.
If you would like to tackle this opportunity (and challenge) you will have to find markets for everything first. I would make lumber yourself out of what you think you either need or can sell easily. For example, if pine board and batten is popular in your area, then maybe you want to turn some of that into lumber to sell. If you have white oak look for trailer decking and fence board markets, for example.
Quote from: chuckzx12 on October 22, 2013, 10:19:51 PMWish I had a use for oak...some of this stuff is perfect.
And it would be a shame to saw these logs into boards. They may be worth more in logs than boards.
Milling all that on a part time basis, with limited experience and little financial reserve will be a problem. I agree that the best bet is to keep out what you and the landowner can use, and sell the rest to the mill. Building that pavilion will take a big bite out of your milling time! Once you get going, you will be surprised at how many opportunities are out there!
Quote from: Satamax on October 23, 2013, 06:39:00 AM
One thing which hasn't been said,
Sort out all of the logs, keep may be four or five truckloads of the most perfect stuff, Sell the rest to the mill.
x2 - my thoughts exactly when I read chuckzx12 first post.
Thank you all very much for the thoughtful replies. They have all been very helpful in leading me to decide to mill for our current needs and sell the rest. We will mill pine for his garage and my pavillion and lumber to use on a small addition next year to my house. I will also mill some oak for flooring in my addition and a nice slab for a bar/countertop. I will try to post some pics as we proceed. Thanks again!!-Chuck
Quote from: chuckzx12 on October 27, 2013, 07:48:46 AM
Thank you all very much for the thoughtful replies. They have all been very helpful in leading me to decide to mill for our current needs and sell the rest. We will mill pine for his garage and my pavillion and lumber to use on a small addition next year to my house. I will also mill some oak for flooring in my addition and a nice slab for a bar/countertop. I will try to post some pics as we proceed. Thanks again!!-Chuck
I don't know how much oak you have but there's usually a market for railroad ties, it's mu understanding that you can command about $20.00 a piece for them. NOT REALLY SURE ABOUT THAT. Anyone else want to elaborate on that? I have never done it. Just Parroting what I've read on line.
I am thinking a good average for 7x9's would be 23 bucks. Green oak flooring is up as well. One just needs to know where and what they are looking for. Without support equipment, it might be advisable keep what is wanted or needed, and sell the rest to existing mills. david
Quote from: chuckzx12 on October 27, 2013, 07:48:46 AM
Thank you all very much for the thoughtful replies. They have all been very helpful in leading me to decide to mill for our current needs and sell the rest. We will mill pine for his garage and my pavillion and lumber to use on a small addition next year to my house. I will also mill some oak for flooring in my addition and a nice slab for a bar/countertop. I will try to post some pics as we proceed. Thanks again!!-Chuck
I'm just curious if you guys ended up milling your logs or not? Any updates? ;D