Just took delivery of this old beauty. (https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20141227_090053977.jpg)
I pulled it into the garage and topped off the differentials, planetaries, trans, and xfer case. The Braden winch doesn't free spool so I pulled it outside to hook it to a tree to try to free it up. Was moving it around outside and lost the clutch... And so it begins!
So far I love the old girl. It has a 353 with small rockwell axles. I think it's around a 1964.
So anyone have any advice on what part number the slave cylinder may be or why the winch doesn't like to freespool?
Wow..!! 8)
I don't know beans about it but I have picked out slave and master cylinders at NAPA. They even had one for a Dodge 800 series single axle truck (1971 or there about). But that was when they had paper books to look through not sure how it works with the new folks behind the counter/computer.
Sweet skidder..
It looks like a C4...8 lug wheels. Does it have a hydraulic clutch? Is that what you meant when you said,"lost the clutch"? Sometimes a little gear lube in the brake fluid will swell the rubbers so they work. If it has been sitting for awhile the winch is probably full of rust/dust. Sometimes just pulling the side cover and blowing all the junk out works miracles. Then again the master controller might needs new rubbers.
I've been debating whether it's a C4 it C5 but I didn't think they offered a C4 with a 353. It does have a hydraulic clutch and the rod came right out of the cylinder and it's pretty corroded so I don't think it will seal again.
The winch is all mechanical, looks pretty simple. Still trying to figure out exactly how it's supposed to work. There is an adjustment on the worm gear shaft, but not sure what it does.
I like!, More pictures please. Curious how it stacks up to my Garrett 20 that I believe to be around 1968 year. Just looks more modern than my machine.
that looks like my c4 but my winch is behind the seat that machine looks nice.you will like it
I got the clutch working again. Somehow the rod had jumped off the arm that goes into the bell housing and the slave cylinder ended up over extending and leaking. I was able to clean it all up and put it back together. I love how simple these old machines are.
I'm getting ready to change the oil. I was told to use straight 30wt, anyone know how much? Is the black canister below the fuel filter some sort of oil filter?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20141227_170828502.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20141227_170858963.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20141227_170924383.jpg)
lumberjack48 knows what it is. C-5 early model is my guess. my brother has one.
David
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/29166/001.jpg)
I would run Mobil 1300 super 15-40w for winter and straight Mobil 1240 HD 40wt when temps get to a steady 30degrees or so. They are both low ash and C-F2 rated. Rotella has a straight 30wt with ash that is 1.0 to.
Good looking skidder. Congratulations
that's a nice looking skidder
Quote from: mjeselskis on December 27, 2014, 05:53:36 PM
Is the black canister below the fuel filter some sort of oil filter?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20141227_170828502.jpg)
yes that is the oil filter On the C6 it's on the other side and a little longer but should still be the same thing. Between the location, internal spring, and the oil in the canister it can turn into a dirty job real quick ;)
Thanks. Is it a paper element? Something that Napa would carry?
You will want to run a series 1 oil comparable to Chevron Delo 100 .Chevron book says recmended to comply with D D two stroke 0.85 ash limit . Only comes in 20 30 40 and 50 wts . Check with your oil suplier and have them look in the oil book . Do not run 15 40 . Gearbox
Quote from: eichenberg93 on December 27, 2014, 06:41:19 PM
that's a nice looking skidderQuote from: mjeselskis on December 27, 2014, 05:53:36 PM
Is the black canister below the fuel filter some sort of oil filter?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20141227_170828502.jpg)
yes that is the oil filter On the C6 it's on the other side and a little longer but should still be the same thing. Between the location, internal spring, and the oil in the canister it can turn into a dirty job real quick ;)
[/quote I have been running 15-40 oil in dd for over 20 years and my dad longer then that with no and ill say it again no troubles good luck with it
At the risk of starting a debate, why is it that straight weight oil is recommended? I'd think 15-40 would be better for cold starting and hot operation
i had a 132 franklin grapple skidder with a 353 in it for about 25 years ran shell rot 15 40 year round, never had any trouble changed it every 250 hrs.
Nice skidder! Glad your clutch is working 8). Is it a chameleon skidder? Looks like its white or green. :D. Congratulations and good luck with it!
The oil thing is always a debate, the CF 2 rating is for two stroke diesels. The ash content is important on these detroits and the max # is 1.0 , I ran straight #30 and when it's 10 degrees out it's like molasses and I have no way of heating the oil up so found a 15-40 super 1300 Mobil CF 2 that recommend there oil for this motor. Running it all last winter and this winter to and things seem fine. note the CF 2 rating on the jug. It is at the max ash1.0. If you really want straight oil you could blend your own I guess. Good luck. Nice skidder.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/29166/NCM_0330.JPG)
Quote from: mjeselskis on December 27, 2014, 07:12:07 PM
Thanks. Is it a paper element? Something that Napa would carry?
I believe its napa number 1180, i changed mine to the spin on filter a while back. I run 15-40 with no problems
http://dieselpro.com/oil-filter-for-detroit-diesel-engine-13618.html?gclid=CIeZ5_7a6MICFXBp7Aod-koA8g#.VJ_z_AIAA
Nice. They made the c4 with a 353. Pulp wood special were the first to have it. The flat stock fairlead would put it at a late 60s machine if it is original. The earlier ones have the round tube fairlead like mine. I think I did read the very first c5 were no different from the c4 drive train wise. Of course I learned all this from the forum after I bought mine. :-)
Quote from: mjeselskis on December 27, 2014, 07:42:40 PM
At the risk of starting a debate, why is it that straight weight oil is recommended? I'd think 15-40 would be better for cold starting and hot operation
why do they recommend 55-65mph on the highway do we do it (some times ) :D :D :D 8) 8) 8) just saying 8) 8) 8) 8) 8)
Yeah, the garage lights make it look white.
I got the winch figured out today. It took a while to figure out how to take it apart but when I did I found a stack of clutch disks and friction disks. Some of the disks had glazed and stuck together. It took a little persuading but I got it all apart, cleaned up and put back together. It is a very simple winch. It runs on yet levers. One lever has a cam action that presses the clutches together and effectively locks the center shaft to the outer drum. When the PTO is engaged and trans/reverser in gear the winch pulls in. When the trans clutch is pushed in or the PTO is disengaged, the brake holds the load. When the cam action lever takes the pressure off the clutch disks, the winch free spoils. Hopefully I'll get to try it out tomorrow.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20141228_105918625.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20141228_105928114.jpg)
As far as engine oil goes I use mobil del-vac 15w-40 year around.Good luck on the winch I hope it works for you 8)
So does the machine have a forward/reverse box before the main four speed w/ reverse transmission? Is the transfer case just a 2 speed with no 2 or 4 wheel drive selection. Just curious if its the same as my 20. That winch looks easy to work on compared to my gearmatic #9. Please keep up the progress pictures!
It has a "transfer case" that does hi/lo and also F/N/R, as well as a PTO to the winch. The trans is a four speed but I was told the forks aren't hooked up for 3rd & 4th. I'm not sure that I'll need to go any faster than 2hi
The only thing that will take some getting used to is that the trans has to be in a gear to get power to the winch.
I think I'll be pulling some firewood tomorrow. Just need to find all the grease fittings and find a spot to store the saw.
My manual hasn't been updated since 1997 but here's what DD says about oil:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/19539/Oil-1.jpeg)
and
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/19539/Oil-2.jpeg)
I don't think DD will mind if I post this bit from their manual.
Nice skidder and how did ya find one with good tires.. ???
:new_year:
Thanks for the info on the oil. Good to see they list 15-40 for colder temps.
The tires... They aren't as good as they appear since they are actually 8 ply tractor tires. The previous owner was lucky and ran them for six years with no problems and I'm hoping that luck continues. I know I will be limited in what I can do with these tires on but I plan to take it easy with it since it is almost 50 yrs. old.
I'm keeping my eye on CL for a used set of 16.9-30 forestry tires just in case.
Nice looking skidder! Contratulations 8) you will like it!
is it true on the older skidder that the vin # will say when it came off the line like 15612 it would be the 12th skidder built :-\
Greased it up this morning and put it to work. Everything seems to work well. Brakes don't work so I have to back against a tree when winching in, but it pulls good. I cut about 2 cords of beech for next year's firewood. Besides getting almost every tree hung up on a stump when I tried to winch it in, it went pretty good.
Not sure I'll ever get used to the Detroit. Man is it loud !! I like to run most things at the lowest RPM to get the job done, but this thing starts slobbering if it isn't wide open.
Is the deutz air cooled engine a lot quieter than the Detroit?
Be very careful without brakes! Anytime you get off make sure the blade is hard in the ground and if on a hill backed against a tree. As far as a Detroit goes I don't mind them cause I run skidders wide open most of the time lol. Just wear good ear protection
Be careful when your using a tree brake to winch up hill, I almost lost my skidder when a 20" beech up rooted.
Quote from: Ed_K on December 29, 2014, 08:33:11 PM
Be careful when your using a tree brake to winch up hill, I almost lost my skidder when a 20" beech up rooted.
x2 on that ;D
I backed up against a 12" pine yesterday and find out that it wasn't strong enough for the job...
I do need to get the brake working, it is missing the Meyer cylinder and the brake drum is covered in hydraulic fluid from a slow leak in the steering cylinder.
The Deutz engine is real quiet,and they are a great engine. They last a long time,but there one of the most expensive engines to rebuild.If the oil is changed regularly they are a 12,000 hr engine. I had one in my 1986 C6D and never had a problem with it !!!
the master cylinder you should be able to get from parts store if its like ours 1 line
It is just one line. Any idea what vehicle it may cross reference to?
Thought I had the slave cylinder problem figured out, but I had to fill up the clutch master cylinder 3x today so I could keep using the clutch.
The machine did impress me today though, it pulled everything I put behind it, although I was probably loading it light. It churned its way through some nasty mud that would have buried my tractor.
dodge ford or chevy just measure the bolt holes so you can get a very close match if there is an older guy in the parts place he my tell you just what year make and model truck its off
Quote from: loggah on December 30, 2014, 08:32:31 AM
but there one of the most expensive engines to rebuild.
How you figure that loggah ?
if you had a tree farmer dealer do a rebuild ,back 10 years ago with genuine duetz parts it was about $1000 a hole. thats with a good crank and heads. if you needed head work,replacement heads or crank $10,000
WOW ill stick with my Detroits ;D
(Ebay link deleted by Admin, Please refer to forum rules)
About $ 250 a hole will buy the aftermarket kit which I have a link posted for. Original deutz parts are about $ 350 -400 per hole, depends where you buy.
At six or seven thousand hours cranks normally don't need to be touched. If you have to hone the valve seats and / or replace the valves it's another $150- 200 or so plus about 20 - 25 hours of labor. I have one four cyl engine which was done with the Chinese kit and it's holding up pretty good after 1400 hrs. My " mechanic " says those aftermarket ones are better than most people expected and he too thinks Deutz is one of cheapest ones to rebuild and he likes the fact he can change every jug individual.
I must say that my guy is Amish, is pretty sharp ,has some very useful connections and not much overhead. Guess I am just lucky. ;D
If I had to pay $ 10000 ten years ago for a rebuild I would be broke by now. ;D
I ran my C6D 5 years and never had a engine problem whatsoever !!! But i always used heater pipes over my pickup exhaust to preheat the engine,i never used ether on it. They are great engines ,but hardly ever got warm enough in the winter so the smoke would clear up.The only reason i got rid of the tree farmer was to go to a power shift machine. I was getting slower in the woods and needed a power shift machine to help me keep the pace up+ i wanted a dual arch grapple with winch.
Davco is closed today. Napa is having a hard time finding a cross reference to a vehicle. Can anyone ID this slave cylinder?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20150101_110746555.jpg)
36117
Example:
http://shop.industrialbrakeandclutch.com/SLAVE-CYLINDER-689-36117C-FD36117-618684-29481C-7346537.htm
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/32112/20150101_133239~2.jpg)
Perfect.
thanks chester_tree_farmer.
Slave cylinder bought and installed and she is as good as new. I've pulled out about 10 cords with it so far and it's working well.
One thing that does need attention is leaking wheel seals. I'm tired of the puddle of gear oil on the shop floor when I fill up the diff's. I think they are Rockwell pr52 axles. Can anyone recommend a good source for seals? How hard is it to replace them?
Inner axle shaft seals I found at my local bearing shop. The large outer planetary seals were OK on mine so I left them. Very easy to to do. Might need help or some kind of hoist for the planetary, kind of heavy. I just used RTV gasket maker on the outer cover because the large o rings were questionable.
This is the large seal that mates with the planetary hub seal surface. This picture shows it attached to the spindle.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/21468/P8180002.JPG)
Here is the mating surface it rides on, shiny part on the hub.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/21468/pc080023~0.jpg)
Sorry I aint got a picture of the inner axle shaft and seal. I will post the seal number later.
inner aexl shaft seal dia. 1.875x 2.398x 0.256
I got axle seals from Daveco in Maine. They had them in stock. $400 for four. Ultra Black gasket maker for everything else.
If you have the same axles as mine you will need a large (4 7/16"???) 8 point socket to preload the wheel bearings upon reassembly. I got one of the stamped steel ones online. It was about $60, but I have since seen them for about 1/3 of that at some surplus military website. I was concerned about the strength of the stamped socket as the stated preload torque is around 800 ft/pounds. The socket turned out to be plenty strong enough.
Quote from: SliverPicker on January 07, 2015, 11:17:41 AM
I got axle seals from Daveco in Maine. They had them in stock. $400 for four. Ultra Black gasket maker for everything else.
If you have the same axles as mine you will need a large (4 7/16"???) 8 point socket to preload the wheel bearings upon reassembly. I got one of the stamped steel ones online. It was about $60, but I have since seen them for about 1/3 of that at some surplus military website. I was concerned about the strength of the stamped socket as the stated preload torque is around 800 ft/pounds. The socket turned out to be plenty strong enough.
That sounds like a different /bigger axle. Mine is the pr52 rockwell. What size machine is yours silver?
Thanks for the seal numbers. I hadn't checked with davco but they are only 30 minutes up the road so I can give them a call. I was hoping they weren't going to be $100/per.
What are the chance that I'll need to replace bearings while I am in there? Do the bearings usually wear out and that's what causes the seals to stay leaking?
Quote from: tantoy on January 07, 2015, 11:34:59 AM
Quote from: SliverPicker on January 07, 2015, 11:17:41 AM
I got axle seals from Daveco in Maine. They had them in stock. $400 for four. Ultra Black gasket maker for everything else.
If you have the same axles as mine you will need a large (4 7/16"???) 8 point socket to preload the wheel bearings upon reassembly. I got one of the stamped steel ones online. It was about $60, but I have since seen them for about 1/3 of that at some surplus military website. I was concerned about the strength of the stamped socket as the stated preload torque is around 800 ft/pounds. The socket turned out to be plenty strong enough.
That sounds like a different /bigger axle. Mine is the pr52 rockwell. What size machine is yours silver?
Mine's a C5D. The year is anyone's guess. I know my transfer case, transmission and my engine (Duetz 5cyl) where all manufactured in different years between 1974 and 1976. Engine October 1st, 1976. Transmission "mid 70's". Transfer case January 1974. I may be that mine has the optional bigger axles. I don't know what the model number for my axles is.
The oil seals for my axles are National Oil Seals #B370063BG.
Silverpicker,
Does yours have 8 lug or 12 lug wheels?
12 lug.
OK. Mine is 8 lug so it makes sense that yours is different
My machine was used HARD, But all the wheel bearings looked good, if not good enough for a hub turning at 20 maximum RPM in an oil bath. I suppose if the bearings sat in water and were rusty that could be a different story.
I was able to carefully clean up the larger seals. They were no torn and seemed pliable. I just smoothed the surface on the planetary hub where they ride with fine paper and crocus cloth.
Usually what happens with wheel seals is the small metal particles from the gears and bushings get trapped between the spindle and seal, so that the seal lip doesn't make good contact.i know in my Franklin when you change seals you should change the sleeves on the spindle also. if you have a groove in the spindle you have to sleeve it,replace it or seat your seal so the lip isnt in the groove.
My wheel seals are a bit different. The seal rotates inside of its own "housing". The seal doesn't rotate around the end of the axle like a normal lipped seal so it will never wear a groove in the axle tube unless the seal seizes inside of its own housing and begins to rotate in relation to the axle tube.
This is a simple concept, but for some reason I am having a hard time putting it in print. Does my description make any sense?
Makes sense to me, these seal types are pretty common on larger quipment etc. My 20,000lb gooseneck has the exact same seal in it. Like you said it takes the wear factor out of it, where most lip seals will actually cut a groove in the metal requiring you to re sleeve the shaft and install a new seal.Loggah's comment was spot on. Another example I know of was the 5.9 cummins. has a crank seal that will cut grooves in the crank and start leaking oil. You either have to set them at different depths to keep from wearing in the same groove on put a spedi sleeve on them.
I didn't realize that this type of seal was fairly common. I had never seen one before redoing my axles.
unitized oil seal or dual action oil seal is the name your looking for. My 20,000lb Mortiz gooseneck has 10k dexter axles, the oil bath seal in them is the same in a f650 ford.I bought mine from my buddy who owns a large semi/equipment service place. They was way cheaper there then anyplace else because he sells 1000's a year vs. a few sets like at napa etc. These seals are on all the semi's heavy equipment even semi trailers. Basically anything with a oil bath hub now a days.
That's good to know. Maybe next time I can find them for less than $100 apiece.
OK. Need some help. Mine doesn't look like tantoy's pictures. I've got this far. I'm assuming I need to pull that big nut off? It wiggles with a chisel and hammer but gets hung up on the inner "teeth".
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20150110_144007552.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20150110_144028142.jpg)
Assuming this gear needs to be replaced?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20150110_144047832.jpg)
Part I pulled out to get this far. (https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20150110_144123740.jpg)
Yup remove the bog nut. Easy as pie. These guys here helped coach me along the way. A my questions pm me.
OK thanks. Now just need to find a ~4" socket
Is there a lock or something I am missing on this nut. I made a socket and can get it to turn about 1/16 revolution but then it stops hard.
Looks like it is set up to have a tab or two bent in those notches so it cannot turn out (or in). Acting like a castle nut or bearing retaining nut.
That's what I was thinking but I was scared to break off the inner tabs trying to bend them
Two half moon clips to remove before you can spin the not off. And I think it's 4 1/8 nut I thiiink correct me if I'm wrong. I just food one of these last year on my spider. If your big ring great is fine you will spend roughly $400 on gears. I know just where to buy em too.
By your pics it looks like yours has no half moon clips tho. Should come off easy enough tho.
If I remember right mine had a thin washer under that nut and was bend over a bit on two sides to hold it in place. Maybe hard to find and covered with grease. Maybe not original.
The whole thing looks a bit different too and I think I have the same axles as SilverPicker on a C5D with 12 lugs.
Good luck.
Went back at it and got the inner tabs clear of the outer and got it off.
Thanks for the help.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20150110_202620093.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20150110_202643010.jpg)
After seeing all the pictures, can anyone say for sure what axles these are?
Look for a plate like that. I changed three hub seals on mine about five years ago.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/15457/IMG_0280.JPG)
The 8 lug are the Rockwell "pr52". I am sure they made some changes to them here and there so I wouldn't think otherwise just by a few different ways that nut is held in place. Lopet and sliver picker have a C5D and Lopets is a quite a bit later model C5D. The C5Ds have different axles. They are heavier axles in the C5D. The Rockwells had tags riveted to the outside casing, similar to what Lopet showed, but if yours still has them u would be a lucky man indeed. And if u do please post a pic of the tag! :-)
As far as that gear, I would build it up with some Lincoln Softweld 99Ni or similar and just machine it to shape with a grinder and file. I lust have a feeling that gear would be hard to find, maybe not $$$.
You don't have the real small Rockwell planetaries. Those are a mix of 8 bolt wheel nuts and the larger style Rockwells that were found on Timberjack 215 skidders. Those are the same as found on the D series Timberjacks and C5D Tree Farmers with the 12 bolt wheel nuts. The hub changes to fit the 30 inch rim but has the same planetary parts.
Quote from: bushmechanic on January 11, 2015, 01:55:52 PM
You don't have the real small Rockwell planetaries. Those are a mix of 8 bolt wheel nuts and the larger style Rockwells that were found on Timberjack 215 skidders. Those are the same as found on the D series Timberjacks and C5D Tree Farmers with the 12 bolt wheel nuts. The hub changes to fit the 30 inch rim but has the same planetary parts.
Great info. Bush mechanic. So looking at the pic David-L posted of his brothers machine - the front are the small planetaries?
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/29166/001.jpg)
Thanks for all the help so far. It is very much appreciated. Is this the only seal that I need to replace besides RTV on the mating surfaces? Anyone got a good spot with decent prices for these? I'm sure Davco will have them but usually not the cheapest. I can't find a part number on it. It is stamped Canada and C/R.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20150111_155734787.jpg)
The area that this seal rides on is definitely grooved. Has anyone ever used a speedi sleeve to fix this? My father in law works in a paper mill and he said they use them on pump shafts quite often to get the seal to work when the shaft gets a groove.
https://www.motionindustries.com/productDetail.jsp?sku=01321251
Do you have a local bearing house near? I wonder if they can get that seal if its a Chicago rawhide brand. To bad there is no number left on it. Is there no smaller seal that seals around the Axel shaft and keeps the gear oil in the pumpkin? You would see a machined seal surface on the shaft if it does use that inner seal.
Yes chester-tree-farmah that planetary on the front in the pic is a small Rockwell. No trouble to tell them cause they usually have 8 lugs and you can see the ends of the brass pins outside the cover. Inside the cover the pins only have c-clips and washers holding on the gears, unless its a TJ 208 then there is a steel plate and spacers locking the pins from moving sideways, oh and a different seal system. mjeselskis if you do get a speedi-sleeve to fit that you will pay with an arm or leg. You could try Timberparts in New Brunswick but I think freight will get you.
Thanks guys. You must have spent some good quality time these things since you seem to have the memorized. Tantoy, there is no flat spot on the shaft and no seal to be found. I believe the oil from the pumpkin is supposed to get out to the planetaries by the looks. I have a few bearing places around so I can bring it in and see what they have.
Bush_mechanic, the cheapest I have found speedi sleeves for is 105 if the shaft is 5 7/8 but I am reading 5.93" with my caliper so not sure what it's supposed to be.
mjeselskis When I did mine I wasn't sure either what I needed. So I took the seals off ( well the second one I got off without wrecking it ) cleaned everything, laid it on a table with a white surface and took a few pictures from different angles and send them along with some measurements and a picture off the axle tag to a couple of dealers. It still was around $ 300 per set but yours might be cheaper. I probably still have the box with the number on it but it won't do you any good.
This is what I most of the time do when I don't find any numbers on the parts and thanks to digital technology I normally get the right stuff unless somebody works in a parts department who shouldn't be working there. ;)
Looks like the parts list is getting longer. A couple of the planetary gears seemed loose so I pulled the brass pins out and they are pretty worn.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20150111_192849740.jpg)
Given that I'm only going to be pulling 10-20 cord per year with this, would you replace these pins?
Quote from: ohiowoodchuck on January 09, 2015, 10:56:13 AM
unitized oil seal or dual action oil seal is the name your looking for. My 20,000lb Mortiz gooseneck has 10k dexter axles, the oil bath seal in them is the same in a f650 ford.I bought mine from my buddy who owns a large semi/equipment service place. They was way cheaper there then anyplace else because he sells 1000's a year vs. a few sets like at napa etc. These seals are on all the semi's heavy equipment even semi trailers. Basically anything with a oil bath hub now a days.
scot seal is another name for it. most all the big trucks have used them for yrs. they dont use a wear sleeve. just push it in the hub by hand. take your old seal to traction, used to be brake service. Augusta bangor and they a few other stores
Couldn't find a riveted tag but found this on the axle. If the axles are original, I'd say this makes the skidder about a 1967 model year
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20150111_194345278.jpg)
Quote from: snowstorm on January 11, 2015, 07:43:10 PM
Quote from: ohiowoodchuck on January 09, 2015, 10:56:13 AM
unitized oil seal or dual action oil seal is the name your looking for. My 20,000lb Mortiz gooseneck has 10k dexter axles, the oil bath seal in them is the same in a f650 ford.I bought mine from my buddy who owns a large semi/equipment service place. They was way cheaper there then anyplace else because he sells 1000's a year vs. a few sets like at napa etc. These seals are on all the semi's heavy equipment even semi trailers. Basically anything with a oil bath hub now a days.
scot seal is another name for it. most all the big trucks have used them for yrs. they dont use a wear sleeve. just push it in the hub by hand. take your old seal to traction, used to be brake service. Augusta bangor and they a few other stores
you are correct sir, I ordered 4 seals from napa and they were skf scot seals, the height of them was 1/2 more than the national brand I took them back and we tried to cross every number but it all came back the same. I got my money back and went to my buddy and got the right ones and never looked back.
Thanks snowstorm, I forgot about traction. They used to have a store in Lewiston, I'll have to see if they are still there
Quote from: mjeselskis on January 11, 2015, 07:34:08 PM
Looks like the parts list is getting longer. A couple of the planetary gears seemed loose so I pulled the brass pins out and they are pretty worn.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20150111_192849740.jpg)
Given that I'm only going to be pulling 10-20 cord per year with this, would you replace these pins?
I think you are going to have to stop at some point and just put it back together. I have the same problem, keep taking things apart and see more things to fix. At the end of the day the old beast would probably just keep on pulling logs despite broken gear teeth, worn seals, sloppy pins, leaking hydraulic cylinders, ect. Just use best judgement and fix what you feel most necessary.
Quote from: mjeselskis on January 11, 2015, 07:51:47 PM
Couldn't find a riveted tag but found this on the axle. If the axles are original, I'd say this makes the skidder about a 1967 model year
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/24804/IMG_20150111_194345278.jpg)
Cool, I will check my axles to see it I have a casting date like that. I have never been 100% sure of the date of my Garrett.
The numbers are on the front side on the "passenger" side.
I think you're right, I just need to draw a line in the sand. I just don't have enough experience with these to know if I'm 1 day away from breaking our if it will run like that for 5 more years.
If you put those worn pins back in it wont last long !!!!! those pins being worn that much will allow the planet gears to walk so the tops of the gear teeth may hit,basically your gears will be out of time. I would try and find some new, better pins at least.
Quote from: loggah on January 12, 2015, 06:54:43 AM
If you put those worn pins back in it wont last long !!!!! those pins being worn that much will allow the planet gears to walk so the tops of the gear teeth may hit,basically your gears will be out of time. I would try and find some new, better pins at least.
Indeed loggah has much more practical experience that I have. I just fear that you may have to do this 3 more times. I guess you gotta pay to play as they say :-\
Yeah. I'm afraid what I'll find in the other three but I'd rather replace just the pins instead of them and the gears. At least I won't have to worry about them when I get done