The Forestry Forum

General Forestry => Sawmills and Milling => Topic started by: Robert Owens on October 04, 2015, 06:42:43 PM

Title: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Robert Owens on October 04, 2015, 06:42:43 PM
I want to buy a moisture meter and not sure on reliability of the various brands. My past experience is just with the analog meters and am familiar only with the delmhorst and lignomat brands. What do you guys use and are you happy with the reliability of it?
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Bandmill Bandit on October 04, 2015, 06:52:11 PM
 I use  the Lignomat and so far have been very happy with it.

It small and mine came with a pretty decent case that keeps the metre well protected.
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Magicman on October 04, 2015, 07:46:56 PM


 (https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/20011/DSCN0201.JPG)
Mine is a Wagner L606, analog.
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: deadfall on October 04, 2015, 08:17:22 PM
Just got my first one (at a thrift store).  You spend a buck for one of these things and you don't expect to have to replace the battery to get it to work!

(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/32712/moisture_meter.JPG)

I know it's not a high end meter. I see it going for $35 at a tool site, and $24 at that big site that undersells everyone.
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: hackberry jake on October 07, 2015, 08:02:11 AM
delmhorst. I've been pleased with it so far.
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: woodworker9 on October 07, 2015, 05:02:07 PM
Lignomat for 15 years.  Very happy with it.
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Kbeitz on October 07, 2015, 07:52:40 PM
I just bought a DMioTECH  off E-bay...  $20.87
I dont know if it's good or bad.
Never used one before...
I'll let you know how it works....

Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Knute on October 07, 2015, 09:01:03 PM
Lignomat, Several years and no problems.
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Glenn1 on October 07, 2015, 09:22:05 PM
Quote from: Knute on October 07, 2015, 09:01:03 PM
Lignomat, Several years and no problems.

X3
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Magicman on October 07, 2015, 09:25:22 PM
Quote from: Kbeitz on October 07, 2015, 07:52:40 PM
I just bought a DMioTECH  off E-bay...  $20.87,  I dont know if it's good or bad.  Never used one before...I'll let you know how it works....
What are you going to compare it with?
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Robert Owens on October 07, 2015, 09:33:52 PM
Thank you all for the replies. I just want to make an educated purchase that will last me for quite a few years.
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: YellowHammer on October 07, 2015, 10:42:19 PM
 
Quote from: hackberry jake on October 07, 2015, 08:02:11 AM
delmhorst. I've been pleased with it so far.

I use one also, easy to use.  Accuracy is very important, and Delmhorst will factory recalibrate on request.  This way I know it's always dead on, no guessing. 
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: fstedy on October 08, 2015, 12:31:26 AM
I use  the Lignomat for 10 years and so far have been very happy with it.
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Kbeitz on October 08, 2015, 02:03:10 AM
Quote from: Magicman on October 07, 2015, 09:25:22 PM
Quote from: Kbeitz on October 07, 2015, 07:52:40 PM
I just bought a DMioTECH  off E-bay...  $20.87,  I dont know if it's good or bad.  Never used one before...I'll let you know how it works....
What are you going to compare it with?
I had to start somewhere... I had none and never used one.
I just hope it works...
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: longtime lurker on October 08, 2015, 05:18:13 AM
Another vote for Delmhorst.
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: bkaimwood on October 08, 2015, 06:44:41 AM
Wagner, because it was readily and easily available at the local big box store cheap...turns out its pretty accurate, has been compared to some of my woodworking friends meters, and after close to 2 years of abuse, still works like new...I would like to get one that doesn't use pins though, so I'm interested in this thread...
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: WDH on October 08, 2015, 07:28:33 AM
Delmhorst J2000X

Wagner MMC 210
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Kbeitz on October 08, 2015, 07:37:39 AM
Wow.... I just checked the price on the Wagner MMC 210....
Guess what I bought is junk....

Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Magicman on October 08, 2015, 07:45:31 AM
Not necessarily.  Compare it side by side with a top end model and see what it does.
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: dtody on October 08, 2015, 08:42:05 AM
I got one at Rockler for $50.  says +/- 3% error factor which isn't great when you're looking around six to nine percent.  I air dry so I'll measure on cutting then wait to next year to measure again.  When I have hundreds of stacks I might upgrade. 
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: hackberry jake on October 08, 2015, 10:34:52 AM
I have thick (8/4) wood in the kiln right now and the slide hammer with the longer pins are sure coming in handy.


 (https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/25938/IMAG0542.jpg)
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: teed on October 08, 2015, 07:43:36 PM
Sounds as if I want one without the spikes of really good quality, it is Wagner that I should buy
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: WDH on October 08, 2015, 08:43:04 PM
The Wagners are good pinless meters.  Mine has operated flawlessly.  It is a density meter, so you have to know the specific gravity of the species that you are measuring.  Wagner supplies a chart with this info for most commonly dried species. 
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Kbeitz on October 10, 2015, 05:28:07 PM
OK...... Newbe here....
What am I lookin for...
I just go my new meter  DMioTECH  ...
I never used one before and I'm sure I dont know what I'm doing.
I milled a Hemloc today that was standing dead timber. Right after I cut I checked the %.
I got anywhere from 20% to 30% all on the same board.
What % do I look for? Is there a chart somewhere.



 (https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/39553/Meter__DMioTECH__.jpg)
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Furu on October 10, 2015, 06:16:23 PM
Delmhorst RDM3 is a nice meter but is not inexpensive but what is that is good quality.
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Brucer on October 10, 2015, 10:00:33 PM
Mine is a Timber Check. It has pins built into the body. Turn a dial on the top until a red LED on the side comes on. Then read the dial.

Common moisture meters come in two styles - resistance and electromagnetic. The ones with pins are resistance meters; they're very simple and they've been around for a long time. (You could build your own if you were so inclined). They measure the resistance of the wood over a fixed distance (the distance between the pins), then translate it into a moisture reading.

The resistance of wood increases as it gets drier so you will always be measuring the highest moisture content that the pins can reach. The relationship between resistance and moisture can vary depending on the species and the temperature of the wood. Usually a meter will come with a chart to adjust the reading for different species and temperatures.

One thing you really have to watch for with the pin-type meters is that the pins are straight, parallel, and smooth. Any deviation or roughness can create a gap between the pin and some of the wood. That increases the resistance and makes the wood appear a lot drier than it actually is. I've seen a meter with badly bent pins (not mine ;D) give a reading of 6% when the actual value was 14% :o. I always carry a pair of smooth jaw pliers in my tool box to straighten the pins.

The best resistance type meters have hammer-in pins. The pins are mounted in a sturdy non-conducting block and there is a heavy handle the slides on a steel rod attached to the block. Just slide the handle up and down to hammer the pins straight in. The kind like mine with built-in pins tend to bend the pins as you lever them into the wood. I wouldn't want one like mine is I were dealing with hard wood.

Resistance type meters have a useful range of about 6% to 25% and over. The resistance of the wood doesn't change much outside this moisture range. A 25% reading can mean just about anything above 25%.

The electromagnetic ones like the Wagner MMC220 don't need to penetrate the wood. An electromagnetic signal is sent into the surface and bounces back a signal that varies according to the moisture content. The moisture range it can measure is a little broader, especially at the high end. You still have to correct for species.

For the work I'm doing, mainly in softwoods, the pin-type meter is perfectly adequate. If I were selling wood (or processing it) according to moisture content, I would probably spend the bucks on a Wagner.
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Kbeitz on October 11, 2015, 04:42:00 AM
When checking wood that you have been drying for a while do you need to cut a chunk off to get to the center for a good reading ?
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: ScottInCabot on October 11, 2015, 08:11:57 AM
Sort of embarrassed to even mention it, but since it compares to more expensive models(tested)...I'll go ahead.

Home Depot Ryobi E49MM01(think it was discontinued-probably because it actually works and came from HD)....and it only cost $39!!!!  Just have to remember to bring a 9v battery, or you'll wonder why it isn't working at all(DAMHIKT)


Scott in Cabot
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Brucer on October 11, 2015, 11:11:36 PM
Quote from: Kbeitz on October 11, 2015, 04:42:00 AM
When checking wood that you have been drying for a while do you need to cut a chunk off to get to the center for a good reading ?

Depends. A resistance type will give you the moisture reading near the end of the pins. If that's close to the centre, you're good. The other types will usually tell you how deep they are measuring (usually not more than 3/4").

The best way to get a reading deep into a thicker piece of wood is to cut a board in half and then take a measurement on one of the cut ends. If it isn't dry enough, leave the two halves in the kiln and cut one of them in half when you want to take another reading. Remember that wood loses moisture faster out the ends to any reading taken near the ends will read on the low side.
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Kbeitz on October 12, 2015, 07:37:06 AM
So whats a good number for planning or sanding ?
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: WDH on October 12, 2015, 07:46:26 AM
12% and below has worked well in my experience. 
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: BCsaw on October 12, 2015, 11:30:01 AM
Brucer, thanks for your post. I was looking at the Timber Check. I would like to have an idea of moisture content in my wood. However it is not critical. I did not want to spend a ton of money but I did not want to waste my money either.  ;D
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: OffGrid973 on October 12, 2015, 03:53:46 PM
Mini Lingo has treated me well...two settings for different types of woods.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/33352/image~11.jpg)
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Brucer on October 12, 2015, 11:01:27 PM
BCSaw -- I've had the Timber Check for about 10 years now and it stood up well. It was designed to be simple and rugged.

You have to be sure you've switched it to the OFF position after you've taken a reading. Otherwise you'll forget and wear out your battery -- and you have to undo a screw to replace the battery.

Biggest problem I've had is pushing it into a hard surface (carefully so as not to distort the pins) only to realize that I've got the LED's facing away from me >:(.
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Compensation on October 13, 2015, 01:47:53 PM
I use a General. It's the fastest one I could get that day and it's done a good job so far.
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Bandmill Bandit on October 13, 2015, 08:40:03 PM
Quote from: cwimer973 on October 12, 2015, 03:53:46 PM
Mini Lingo has treated me well...two settings for different types of woods.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/33352/image~11.jpg)

exact same as mine and it has worked well for me.
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: bkaimwood on October 17, 2015, 07:32:58 PM
My previous post about my cheap pinned Wagner meter being pretty close and reliable has recently come into question...I still think it has been great for the money, and has been close, and reliable...BUT.. I just checked some good sized walnut slabs that have been in the kiln FOREVER, last load to come out...it checked out 8-10% on surface and sub-surface checks, but after cutting a slab, I got readings as high as 25%!!! Yes, I know, this screams case hardening.. BUT, I find this hard to believe, as this walnut was air dried for months, then in the kiln for months...and its a low temp kiln...it reaches peak temps of 120, but rarely, more commonly in the 95-100 degree range...no fan overkill, regular destressing cycles overnight, with everything off, and so on...I'm thinking maybe this meter is good for standard grade lumber up to maybe 6/4 max, but its performance lacks past that... I think the most important detail is I deal with mostly 8/4-12/4, and these slabs are 28" wide...so maybe I need to spend 250-300 bucks on a pinless, high quality meter? Your thoughts gentleman?...
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: DR Buck on October 17, 2015, 08:08:22 PM
I use the Delmhorst J2000.  It's been excellent for about 10 years with only ocassional battery replacements.
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: logboy on October 20, 2015, 01:53:01 PM
Quote from: hackberry jake on October 08, 2015, 10:34:52 AM
I have thick (8/4) wood in the kiln right now and the slide hammer with the longer pins are sure coming in handy.


 (https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/25938/IMAG0542.jpg)

I have the exact same setup.  I used a mini Ligno for years but started having a hunch it was lying to me about stuff coming out of the kiln. After buying the Delmhorst it confirmed that it was telling me stuff was dry when it really wasn't.  Some of the readings on the Ligno were 4% different than the Delmhorst.
Title: Re: What moisture meter do you use?
Post by: Brucer on October 22, 2015, 12:17:54 AM
Remember, those pin-type meters are actually measuring the resistance of the wood between the pins. Drier wood has a higher resistance. The meter will measure the lowest resistance (greenest) wood between the pins.

If the pins only penetrate the surface, you'll get the surface moisture. If they penetrate deeper, you'll get the higher moisture reading near the tips (and the dry surface will be ignored).

If the pins are bent or rough, they won't make good contact with the wood. That will increase the resistance a lot and your meter will give an artificially low moisture content.