Just wondering how many people out there are pro sawyers that sling a saw all day? I think we are a dying breed. Most people I talk to think im nuts for being a logger but i love it and wouldnt have it any other way!! Like my grandpa always told me, when your in the woods everyday is a picnic!!
A logger in Michigan that slings a saw all day is certainly becoming a rare breed. Not loggers in general, but saw slingers. What with processors and harvestors and fowarders there aint many that use the saw for much during the course of the day. Maybe sitting on top of a chip van with it the first trip in to clear the haul road of low branches. :D
I work with several and have a lot of respect for them. They mostly work the quality sawlog jobs to insure good grade and veneer cuts.
I have one mill owner who slings a saw all day himself to insure the quality of the log harvest and the profits made by quality product cuts.
I do not do it much myself anymore, but did some in summers or weekends when not teaching. I have about twenty-five or thirty past students that are still "slingin" a saw. In-fact, several bring by Western Big Leaf Maple burl for me to purchase. 8) I only buy from my past students.
Me and my few conventional logging friends still sling saws. I have been preaching the bennies of mechanized equipment for some time now, but they insist a $650.00 saw is easier to come by than a $60,000.00 fellerbuncher.
Here, we call saw & skidder loggers "Wood Boogers". I am a wood booger.
I use a saw just about every day but for a different reason ...
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I used one about all day yesterday------man am I sore today :(
We cut logs one or two days a week and I'm always stiff and sore the next day. We have talked about getting a little bell feller/buncher to use in our planted pines. Most of our timber is on steep hillsides so a chainsaw and winch are the only option.
One thing ya gotta admit is the quality of the logs is generally better when cut manually. Most all veneer is manual cut to length in my area. It may be cut from the stump with machine, but its bucked manually from long length pieces or treelength. This isn't always so with sawlogs though, its becoming more mechanical because most woodlot owners are selling stumpage to mechanized logging contractors. With hardwood pulp prices the way they've been, some smaller logs have been sent as pulp because the log price isn't that great for small logs. Anyway with manual felling and bucking there is no mechanical damage like pull out and spliting of the log when the machine operator tries to move the log before the cut is complete. Also, I've seen the lumber at a couple of our local mechanized mills. They are forcing the wood through to fast and the run of stuff has alot more cracks and twists and breaks. Slow'r down boys, and improve the quality of your output. ;)
I'm sure no pro, but i've sure cut down and skidded several.But around here aprofessional logger is alogger that has been working in the woods for ten or more years and can still walk in or out of them.
I know several pros around this part of the country,theres just not alot of work around here unless it has something to do with a chainsaw and a skidder.
hillbilly
I am not a pro logger, but, if I am lucky sometimes I sling a saw five days a week doing urban tree removal. That would be on some days almost a constant six+ hours of saw use a day.
Point being, even working outside in the city doing tree work can be enjoyable, though not as much as in the woods for sure.
I'm not technically a full-time logger, with the farm and all, but I generally cut logs 100 to 150 days a year, depending on the weather. Mostly I log in the fall and winter. Even when I have employees working I still do all the felling and much of the bucking in order to get a quality job. I've found it easier to train a guy to run the skidder or forwarder than cut logs. We'll be starting back up at the end of the week and going full bore all winter.
All of our cutting is done with chain saws, no feller bunchers or processors involved. There are a few timbcos working in the area, but they are used only for felling. The quality, and thus value, of some of our timber is so high that it pays to do a good job with a chain saw, especially for topping and bucking.
The saw slingers we have can cut pretty good, but the bucking leaves a lot to be desired. The one cutter does split too many trees. Then they skid those butts through the mud to make sure there is plenty of dirt in the cracks. Lots of lost time due to muddy splits.
The bucking went further downhill when they automated the bucking. Now, they're in a big hurry and we get crooked logs, too much trim allowance, and defect that isn't placed too well. Any splits are disregarded, so they make it into the mill instead of the pulpwood pile. They say they can't see the logs as well from the loader truck.
What most guys don't realize is that the bucking creates the value of every product in that log. Buck it too short, and you won't get a board above 1 Com. Give me a crooked log and the grade drops dramatically (not to mention it busts up equipment). Poorly trimmed knots limits the way I can position it on the carriage. I can only do so much with fetching grade from a log.
We have very few mechanized fellers. The only ones using them are doing clearcuts, usually in front of strip mines or on state lands.
Clearcuts is 99 % of the work up here on woodlots unfortunately. Moving away from it somewhat on crown lands because you have bigger wood and more volumes/acre. Then , there's the issue of doing a good job on crown lands and having the native loggers come 'round and high grade the veneer and sawlogs which we want to grow a bit larger and help establish another generation. ::)
The first and most important person to a sawmill operation is/are the cutters in the woods. The next is the sawyer. that is what I have learned. That is why I really explain to the suppliers of logs what my specks are at my mill. If they differ to far from the specks I charge of those that bring more time to my sawing. As a cutter I was always very conscience of the sawyer and what the mill wanted for logs. If I did not send in the correct spected log I knew I would really get docked on grade and scale. :'(
I have to agree with oldtimer, I do mostly thinning on private lots. Lots of cordwood & a few sawlogs 8). It would be faster to have a fellerbuncher, and nicer in bad weather. Now I cut with a 2171 Jon, bunch with MF1433 w/fransguard winch, then pull out w/taylor skidder. But I love being in the woods ;).
Muledriver, Where in the UP are you located?
powers
Muledriver, Check you PM'S.
I used to do it for a living for about 10 years, year round, cutting mostly for a forwarder (piling all the 8 foot stuff) and a bit for a skidder,mostly all clearcuts. Planted lots of trees too (to make up for all the ones I've cut) and did some backpack herbicide spraying and different silviculture cuts as well.
Now I do it about 2 days a week for myself on small private lots.
I tell people I do it the "old fashioned" way, with a chainsaw and tractor with a Farmi winch. Lot's of people still want it done this way.
There's lots of jobs I've done where the land owner wouldn't let any large machinery on his land. This works pretty good for one or two guys.
I worked in heli-logging for five years in B.C. Saws were the only solution for falling in that country but processors and "but'n'tops" were used at the roadside. Fast but I sure agree about the waste. Hand bucking is slow but quality is a lot better
sawguy21:
What part of BC was ya heli-logging in? I laid out some heli-logging and cruised the wood on the Charlottes and Sommerville Island along the Alaska Border. Three years out there, 'til the forest economy crashed.
cheers
I am able to work work 8-9 months a year here falling timber.
SwampDonkey, I was based out of Prince George with Northern Mountain Helicopters. We worked the central and northern interior for the most part but did some work around Powell River and the island. The twenty inch plus butts at P/R did not look too impressive until I learned it was third growth! Some of the old stumps were HUGE. Sure can't imagine dropping those with a misery whip
Prince Rupert tree growth is mostly shrub compared to the 2.6-4.0 meter wide sitka spruce and red cedar on the charlottes. Nothing like using two 7.5 meter long d-tapes to wrap around a red cedar. Most the hemlock were 80 plus cm. :D
Not to many throw a saw all day around here anymore either, most got lazy. Ive been doing i for 6 years, 4 of them on my own. Ive got a JD640 cable skidder and a 03 tj360 cable skidder. only one around that still uses a 066 everyday..
Welcome to the forum Jim. :)
Jim:
Alot of skidder operators around here are having it hard to retain saw slingers also. Its hard work, and very few men (or women) can hang tough now-a-days. What the big problem is, is the act that traditionally the work was seasonal and most folks got used to that way of life and don't want it full year round. Most were used to going back farming or fishing for 5 or 6 months of the year. Hard to break tradition I guess. Also, some of our social programs have taken away the incentive, since the wages (a reflection of the low price of primary forest products) were never that great here in the Canadian maritimes.
cheers