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Other topics for members => General Woodworking => Topic started by: hackberry jake on May 25, 2016, 08:56:06 PM

Title: handheld belt sanders
Post by: hackberry jake on May 25, 2016, 08:56:06 PM
My first belt sander was a 3X18" skil cheapie I bought new. I burnt it up in about a year. The second one was a 3X21" skil that I got at an auction for $5. It came with a grizzly jig saw as well. I just got done burning it up. Now I'm ready to step up to a professional version. It looks like the biggest anyone makes is a 4X24. I looked at a few of them and really like the weight and feel of the Porter cable, and the orange box store has it on sale for $209. I don't know if I should leave towards the 3X24 because of cheaper belts... What Do you have, and do you like it?
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Dan_Shade on May 25, 2016, 09:16:59 PM
I have a 4x24 Porter cable, I prefer that size to the 3x18.

I find it's easier to handle, and less likely to dig in.
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: WDH on May 25, 2016, 09:24:47 PM
I swore off belt sanders.  Also swore off hickory  :). 
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Left Coast Chris on May 25, 2016, 09:25:04 PM
I have a 4x24 porter cable also and it has so many hours on it the steel friction plate on the bottom is wearing through now after 7 years.   It has paid for itself three times over but I would still like to find replacement parts and I'm having a hard time finding them.  That is my only small complaint.   The situation that I am considering changing the wear plate and rollers is testament to its solid construction and durability.    Also $209 is a great price for one.   You can't go wrong.

A side note on the belts:  Klingspore has a bargain box of 4x24 belts that is a huge value.
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: ScottAR on May 25, 2016, 11:53:30 PM
I have a 3x21 dewalt and it's fine although I've used a porter cable and it seemed more robust.
I've been eyeing a makita in 4x24 as the dust collection looked better and 11 amp motor would be a step up.   My main complaint with the dewalt is the dust collection is poor. 

My main uses are scribing cabinets and counters to walls and recently cleaning up behind a floor sander.

I tried some frued/diablo sanding belts and was impressed.  I will buy more.
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: SwampDonkey on May 26, 2016, 05:24:21 AM
Makita here, same one for over 20 years.  8)
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: scgargoyle on May 26, 2016, 06:15:01 AM
I bought my 3X24 Makita in the late 70's. Still using it.
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Kbeitz on May 26, 2016, 06:26:26 AM
I have 3 of the 3X21" skils.First one I bought over 25 years ago and it's still going strong.
About every 3 months you need to put a drop of oil in the little hole on the motor shaft.



 (https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/39553/Sander__2~0.JPG?easyrotate_cache=1464258282)
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: opticsguy on May 26, 2016, 10:34:26 AM
I use the Bosch 4x24 and is an excellent machine.  With a 40 grit belt you can bore holes in wood. 
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Larry on May 26, 2016, 10:54:34 AM
I have one of the new PC 4 X 24's.  95% of its use is to level glued up slabs too wide to run through the planer.  That size is the least likely to make a divot.  I did use it the other day to put a brushed finish on some aluminum plate.  Too heavy and awkward for other uses, especially for the elderly. :D :D I also have one of the old locomotive PC 3 X 24's.  It will do nearly the same job and sometimes they can be found at auctions for a few dollars.  Mind has a leaking oil seal which is a common problem when they are 50 years old.  I think the seal is hard to find but that's ok as I only use it as a shop ornament. :)

I also have a Craftsman 3 X 21 that I bought new about 30 years ago.  I think it might have been medium quality at the time.  I use it all the time for scribing, rough work, and laminate edges.
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Bruno of NH on May 26, 2016, 05:28:58 PM
Try to find the locomotive type PC they are the best  .
But the new PC are nice and so are the heavy duty makita
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: 21incher on May 26, 2016, 05:54:59 PM
I had a old Montgomery Wards 4 x 21 3/4 for years and then it started shocking me, so I took the low cost route and bought  4 x 24 variable speed magnesium one from harbor freight and I would never own a single speed one again. The blue Norton belts give me the longest life. :)
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: SwampDonkey on May 26, 2016, 06:30:50 PM
Hard to beat Norton, but locally you can't find good belts like you could 15 years ago.
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: DFILER2 on May 27, 2016, 08:08:53 AM
It seems you are burning them up pretty quickly, maybe you should be looking at a different type of tool. A surface sander or stationary sander, just a thought.
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: redprospector on May 28, 2016, 09:28:00 PM
I've got an old Porter Cable 3x21 that I bought at a trade day in Denton, TX in 1978 for $5.00, and it was old then.  :D A month or so ago the brushes gave up in it, and I went and bought a 3x21 Skill to use while I was hunting brushes. Wow! What a difference. I'm thinking about taking my old Porter Cable to the tool shop and have it rebuilt.
Running that new Skill makes me want to do a lot less sanding.  :(
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Larry on May 28, 2016, 09:46:27 PM
With the old PC locomotive sanders the rear handle is straight behind and low.  The front handle is past the front end also.  I think the location of the handles made it a lot easier to control the sander and avoid divots.

My new PC with the top mount handles is a bear to control and do good work.  The 4" wide belt also contributes a lot to control problems.  I do ok but when I only use it every 6 months or so it takes a bit of practice to get back in tune.

When I was young, I got a lot of experience running those old sanders.  I finished non-ferrous metals by wet sanding and the finish had to be perfect.  Used mostly water and before long the work area was a mess.  One day I was able to hold one of the sanders straight out with one arm and violently shake it for a very long time.  I was also screaming at the top of my lungs until my co-worker pulled the plug. :D :-[ :D
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: hackberry jake on May 29, 2016, 06:59:53 AM
Quote from: Larry on May 28, 2016, 09:46:27 PM
One day I was able to hold one of the sanders straight out with one arm and violently shake it for a very long time.  I was also screaming at the top of my lungs until my co-worker pulled the plug. :D :-[ :D
I always wondered what was wrong with you..
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Just Me on May 29, 2016, 08:19:28 AM
I have a few PC 3x21's, and a 4 x 24, and my favorite the PC 3x 24 Whisper Series. All are good.

PM me an address and I will send you a 3x21 no charge. I have more than I need as I do not have crews any more and they are a nice handy unit for when weight of the larger ones is too much.
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: isawlogs on May 29, 2016, 08:55:41 AM
 I have two Makita 3X24. One with coarse grit one with fine grit. These have a 4" base plates and I run them with the 4X24 sanding paper. Have had one for over 20 years and the other I got at a garage sale, it was not running at the time I bought it. Who ever had it before me had spliced the cord about a foot away from the handle, wires had come apart  :-\  I cut the cord and rewired it, these having a eight foot cord on them made it easy.  :)
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: opticsguy on May 29, 2016, 10:09:20 AM
The cord on my Bosch was damaged and replaced it with a 20 foot cord. Wow, does that make it a much much more functional tool.
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: isawlogs on May 29, 2016, 02:22:37 PM
 When someone cuts the cord on any of my tools he usualy goes and replaces the short ones with a ten foot cord.  ;D
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: SwampDonkey on May 29, 2016, 03:32:22 PM
20 feet is way too long for me, I don't like fighting cords around other objects. :D
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: WDH on May 29, 2016, 08:04:07 PM
I hates shorts cords. 

Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: hackberry jake on May 31, 2016, 07:43:16 PM
I actually ordered a cheap Amazon belt sander. A WEN 3X21. It was less than $50 and came with a 2 year warranty. I bought an additional 2 years of warranty for $4. They also sell a handheld planer for about $40 with the same warranty... Never used the handheld variety before but I know a lot of people think they're handy. The sander is supposed to get here Thursday.I don't have super high hopes for $50.
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: mesquite buckeye on June 01, 2016, 10:51:20 AM
Those handheld planers are super handy to level out big unwieldy boards and other stuff. Mine sure came in handy making that bathroom sink and leveling up my crooked counter boards. ;D
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: hackberry jake on June 01, 2016, 08:45:08 PM
Quote from: mesquite buckeye on June 01, 2016, 10:51:20 AM
Those handheld planers are super handy to level out big unwieldy boards and other stuff. Mine sure came in handy making that bathroom sink and leveling up my crooked counter boards. ;D
At $40 it won't take much motivation for me to order one. I could probably use it before the belt sander for flattening large butcher-block tops and the like.
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Texas Ranger on June 01, 2016, 09:27:58 PM
Hand planer we essential when I was building doors and furniture
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Brad_bb on June 01, 2016, 10:44:29 PM
I have a Bosch 4x24
The last timberframe crew I worked with had Makita.  I'm usually using mine to sand timbers to smooth them or get the gray off.

Jake, what are your main uses?  That may partially dictate your belt size.
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: hackberry jake on June 02, 2016, 08:45:38 PM
Quote from: Brad_bb on June 01, 2016, 10:44:29 PM
I have a Bosch 4x24
The last timberframe crew I worked with had Makita.  I'm usually using mine to sand timbers to smooth them or get the gray off.

Jake, what are your main uses?  That may partially dictate your belt size.
Usually flattening things like butcher block counter tops, or taking spray ink off of signs. Dried spray ink clogs up even the coarsest of random orbit sandpaper.
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Just Me on June 03, 2016, 07:30:36 AM
20 foot is good. That way every time you suck it up into the sander you have some extra. 8)
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Carson-saws on June 19, 2016, 01:38:57 PM
Just Me....REAL nice work...looked at your gallery.  Know Indian River pretty well,  have property down near Ostlander on the Pigeon River backing up to Mackinaw State Forest. 
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: tule peak timber on June 19, 2016, 02:14:55 PM
I caught this thread last week , and ordered the Makita 4X24. Very happy with it- paid for itself in a couple of days. I'm now eying the 12 1/4 inch wide hand planer-comments ?Rob
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Just Me on June 20, 2016, 05:53:58 AM
Quote from: tule peak timber on June 19, 2016, 02:14:55 PM
I caught this thread last week , and ordered the Makita 4X24. Very happy with it- paid for itself in a couple of days. I'm now eying the 12 1/4 inch wide hand planer-comments ?Rob

I have the 6 3/4 straight, and the 4 3/8 curved, but I have never run that monster. Its probably like the 16" makita skilsaw, much easier than the idea seems.
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Just Me on June 20, 2016, 05:59:46 AM
Quote from: Carson-saws on June 19, 2016, 01:38:57 PM
Just Me....REAL nice work...looked at your gallery.  Know Indian River pretty well,  have property down near Ostlander on the Pigeon River backing up to Mackinaw State Forest.

I actually live on Munger, with the Pigeon River Forest right behind my house.

Thank you for the compliment.
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Carson-saws on June 20, 2016, 09:10:09 AM
Great area up that way...like to fly fish the river...  you are welcome,  looks like you have the "knack"   liked the bench seat picture.
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: muggs on June 20, 2016, 01:56:26 PM
I have the Makita 3X21. I used it to sand about 12 doors a day. Served me well. I used to use a larger sander but it was just too tiring.   Muggs
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: opticsguy on June 21, 2016, 12:38:03 AM
Bosch 4 x 24 with 25 cord.  Great reliable machine and with 36 or 24 grit can you can bore to the center of the Earth...........
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Brad_bb on June 23, 2016, 12:44:35 PM
So what did you decide Jake?  Been using my Bosch 4x24 to smooth down Osage brace stock.  Works well.  Just don't let the sander fall off the work to the floor.  Mine did and bent the front idler wheel bracket.  I got it bent back enough that the adjustment works to keep the belts on the sander again.  Learning lesson.
The three in the foreground have been sanded and the live edge draw knifed and wire wheeled.


 (https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/16191/Sanding_Osage2.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1466701330)
My buddy posing like a swimsuit model.  At least the brace stock looks good.
 

 (https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/16191/Sanding_Osage1.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1466701310)
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: submarinesailor on June 23, 2016, 01:13:30 PM
Brad - I have always wondered how you guys sand the edges of your benches, counter-tops and other live edge products and get them to look so good. Do you use the belt sander on the sides of your live edge or something like a random orbital?  It seems to me that you may pull to much off the sides if you use a belt sander.  Maybe it's having the right touch or technique?
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Brad_bb on June 23, 2016, 01:28:21 PM
No, on the flat faces, the yellow you see, gets the belt sander.  The live edge, the rounded part, gets the bark draw knifed off being careful not to dig into the wood.  The we are wire wheeling off the remnants of the cambium/bark with a 4" fine or medium wire wheel mounted in a low speed 3/8 drill (variable 0-2200 rpm).  You don't want a stiff coarse while wheel or high speed tool or you'll strip the thin darker color between the cambium and sapwood.   If there is any place where the draw knife dug in or other damage like a chainsaw cut, we use 80 grit on a foam sanding pad by hand or if really bad, the nose of the belt sander to shape and get any rough edges out.  It keeps some of the other colors of the cambium layer to contrast with the actual wood color.  I also want it smooth to the touch.  I haven't done much of this before, but it's working well. 
The wire wheel removes the thin paper like layer that is under the bark on top of the sapwood.  When you wire wheel it, that layer comes off in fibers and clumps up looks like fur balls. Also, I plan to experiment with a hard wax buffed finish.

This is what it looks like after wire wheel.


 (https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/16191/Sanding_Osage3.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1466702670)
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: submarinesailor on June 23, 2016, 03:05:36 PM
Wire wheel.  Never would have thought of it.  THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Bruce
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Brad_bb on June 23, 2016, 03:29:13 PM
Fine to medium wire wheel.  Using steel for this, but some softer woods might be better with brass?
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Dave H. on June 23, 2016, 11:55:07 PM
jake,your a bad influence,lol.




 (https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/34962/IMG_20160607_163219.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1466740417)
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: hackberry jake on June 24, 2016, 03:05:45 PM
I went with the cheapie. It's fairly lightweight and it has been working well so far.


 (https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/25938/IMAG1699.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1466795122)
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: WDH on June 24, 2016, 03:51:51 PM
Whoa Jake!  That butcher block  is nice!
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Bruno of NH on June 24, 2016, 05:20:29 PM
x2 on the top  :) :)
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: tule peak timber on June 24, 2016, 07:31:15 PM
X 3 on the top  :) :) :)
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: SwampDonkey on June 25, 2016, 04:31:08 AM
You done as fine a job as an expensive one. That top looks awesome.  8)
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: Al_Smith on June 25, 2016, 07:34:26 PM
I've got a 3 by 21 I  inherited from my father and a 4 by 21 I bought,both craftsman .They do alright but the 4 by 21 is an odd ball and the only place I've found belts is Sears .I've also got a Makita  hand power planer which is real handy .
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: PC-Urban-Sawyer on June 25, 2016, 08:15:28 PM
Klingspor sells 4x21 belts.

26 items listed at http://www.woodworkingshop.com/category.aspx?id=20&f1=4%22+X+21%22 (http://www.woodworkingshop.com/category.aspx?id=20&f1=4%22+X+21%22)

Herb
Title: Re: handheld belt sanders
Post by: SwampDonkey on June 26, 2016, 04:50:27 AM
Yeah, I only see 24" and 36" in 4" width at Lee Valley

The 3" wide comes in 21" and 24" though.

Belts made in Germany by 100 year old company