Here are two ways t lose money on a sawmill. None of this is the customers fault. They were really nice folks. One guy wanted 8 5x5 cedar. As per previous post I had some in stock but all had turned gray from the sun. People like to see the color of Cedar.
I broke 2 new blades sawing 8 5x5 I was not pushing hard. Same blades I have used for years. Usually don't break till after 8-10 sharpenings. So I am out the cost of 2 blades on this job and spent a hr with the customer. Did I make any money on this deal? No. Next customer called and wanted a small order for a restoration job. 6 1x8 and 4 1x4. I misunderstood him and was showing him 1x6's . He said he needed 1x8's . I had a stack of 10. Only 3 were good enough for his restoration. No problem I understand. I have another stack. All I can see are the ends. The 1x8's are halfway down the stack. I start unstacking get to them and they have wane on the edge. Won't work. I said here is what I will do. I will cut some and bring them to you. I don't mind. I found a log that would make a 8x8 cant and cut 8 1x8's. Got 3 good one's . 3 will make 1x4's and 2 for lumber pallets. Got it all done and he called and said he wanted 1 more 1x8. Back to the log pile finally found one that would make an 8x8 cant. Got 1 good 1x8. It had a hidden hole in it. Did I make any money on these jobs? not a dime. This is the way it goes every day. I am ready to get a job and go back to sawing just for me.
Can't says I miss those days....
Welcome to my world... everyday here we try and make silk purses from sows ears. I get asked all the time why I want to get bigger, and while I answer about economies of scale and all that kinda stuff... at the end of the day the real answer is that I need to be able to process sows ears faster so I can fill orders easier so I can eat.
At the end of the day we all get to make this choice and its as simple as "What do I want to achieve here?" Cut a few boards for myself/ have a paying hobby/make a living?
I used to be involved in a big mill - part owner (little part) and operations manager. I got out - wasnt ready to get out but we got eaten by a bigger fish. Few years later I came back, bought a portable mill, just wanted to process a few logs on the side and build myself a new house. Six years later and I'm in debt up to my capacity to repay, got dozers and loaders and skidders and forklifts and trucks, got saws and kilns and drymill gear, got headaches about getting paid on time and headaches about paying on time and headaches about not enough work and headaches about too much work in the time we got to do it and headaches about who's coming to work: got 10 cents in the bank and everything else tied up in equipment and logs and sawn lumber... and lately I wonder what I'm trying to achieve, and wouldnt it be better if I just went and got a real job and spent weekends sawing lumber to build that new house?
I think for all of us there are times when it doesnt hurt to be a bit introspective, and to stick our head out of the sawdust pile and look about and ask where we think we're going and how are we going to get there. Problem is for me at least... well I got the tiger by the tail to some degree... but theres a fair bit of "a bad days sawing is better then a good days just about anything else" about it too.
Sawmilling is a disease.
Those are some of the primary reasons that I got out of the lumber business. Then I got out of the stationary sawing business because of log handling plus slab/sawdust cleanup. Portable sawing only for me. ;D
Hard days I agree, been there,
Quote from: ozarkgem on August 30, 2016, 07:09:20 PM
One guy wanted 8 5x5 cedar. As per previous post I had some in stock but all had turned gray from the sun. People like to see the color of Cedar.
I keep on hand a belt sander. I can give a gray Cedar post a fresh look in minutes.
Also it would help to keep Cedar out of the sun when storing.
Sometimes you're the chicken and sometimes you're the hatchet...
Chicken here :D :D :D
I really appreciated reading this thread. Quoting my father in law here, "the grass isn't greener on either side really". He's a farmer and I'm in the corporate world. A little introspection is always a good thing. Otherwise you find yourself on a river in a canoe without a paddle. Better to have a paddle and a purpose. You may hit a rock and lose your paddle, but you better find another paddle quick. Always know where you wanna go and what you want to achieve.
Well I can relate to this topic. Last Saturday 4 o'clock in evening I got a frantic call from a company that runs 24 hours a day that I supply/repair pallets for. The evening shift started and noticed they had no pallets in stock. Ironic thing was a week prior I sent a text to all 3 shift managers that I had a trailer truck ready for delivery and let me now when they have my next trailer load ready to back haul back. Well lets just say they did nothing until they were out. This is a business with hundreds of employees. using pallets to ship with, on 50 semi trailers. So I have become a 911 service. This kind of thing drives a person crazy. So I hopped in the semi took it in there dropped it on the loading dock while half the shift was looking at me because there automated machine that loads and wraps goods was shutdown due to no pallets. I'm telling ya you can't make this stuff up. That's why I have forced myself to stay a small business maybe a lot of different businesses but small...
I hope you added an emergency delivery charge!
Unless you are prety good sized yard mill operation have found I normally come up on the short end of custom orders . I hate trying to find logs only to saw out half the yeild for an order . I tend to seek people who agree to just buy the logs and have me make them all the lumber . It doesnt happen much but it has .
You need to be very careful about calculating profit (or loss) on a single job. It can lead to bad business decisions.
For example, applying the cost of a broken blade to a single job isn't realistic. The blade lost some of its life on previous sawing jobs. Did you charge a portion of its cost to those jobs? And blade life varies, so how do you decide how much of a blade's value to charge to a single job?
If you spend extra time talking to a customer and don't have any other jobs lined up, then how do you decide what the "talking time" really cost?
Imagine you "lose" money on a small job because the customer keeps asking for better quality, or better appearance. What if the customer comes in a week later, and having been educated by you, hands you a well thought out cut list, with detailed descriptions of what is acceptable, and a reasonable time frame to do the work? Was that first job really a loss?
Suppose you saw into a log stop and wreck a brand new blade (not that any experienced sawyer would ever do that :D). Do you apply the cost of the blade to that particular job, or do you apply it to "education" (yours)?
Sure there are good days, bad days, frustrating days, and days we figure we should have just stayed home. The big question is, "Am I making enough money in the long run to make this worthwhile?"
Quote from: killamplanes on August 30, 2016, 10:16:45 PM
Well I can relate to this topic. Last Saturday 4 o'clock in evening I got a frantic call from a company that runs 24 hours a day that I supply/repair pallets for. The evening shift started and noticed they had no pallets in stock. Ironic thing was a week prior I sent a text to all 3 shift managers that I had a trailer truck ready for delivery and let me now when they have my next trailer load ready to back haul back. Well lets just say they did nothing until they were out. This is a business with hundreds of employees. using pallets to ship with, on 50 semi trailers. So I have become a 911 service. This kind of thing drives a person crazy. So I hopped in the semi took it in there dropped it on the loading dock while half the shift was looking at me because there automated machine that loads and wraps goods was shutdown due to no pallets. I'm telling ya you can't make this stuff up. That's why I have forced myself to stay a small business maybe a lot of different businesses but small...
This sounds a lot like the plant where I work since they implemented this J I T program. Just in time doesn't work we run out of supplies more often than not. I spent all Saturday and Sunday shuttling product from one plant to our main facility to keep a machine running so we could meet a customer order. ::)
It's all in management, And knowing when to say NO.
Quote from: Brucer on August 31, 2016, 01:09:12 AM
You need to be very careful about calculating profit (or loss) on a single job. It can lead to bad business decisions.
For example, applying the cost of a broken blade to a single job isn't realistic. The blade lost some of its life on previous sawing jobs. Did you charge a portion of its cost to those jobs? And blade life varies, so how do you decide how much of a blade's value to charge to a single job?
If you spend extra time talking to a customer and don't have any other jobs lined up, then how do you decide what the "talking time" really cost?
Imagine you "lose" money on a small job because the customer keeps asking for better quality, or better appearance. What if the customer comes in a week later, and having been educated by you, hands you a well thought out cut list, with detailed descriptions of what is acceptable, and a reasonable time frame to do the work? Was that first job really a loss?
Suppose you saw into a log stop and wreck a brand new blade (not that any experienced sawyer would ever do that :D). Do you apply the cost of the blade to that particular job, or do you apply it to "education" (yours)?
Sure there are good days, bad days, frustrating days, and days we figure we should have just stayed home. The big question is, "Am I making enough money in the long run to make this worthwhile?"
My point was this time it was the blade(they were new by the way). next time a bearing , next time a tire and it never ends. An hr spent with the customer is an hr not sawing or building something to sell. If everybody at a car plant stopped and talked for an hr would they consider that a cost? Been in business since 1978. Do small customers turn into big customers? In my case 98% of the time no. Sometimes they do come back but its the same thing over again.Big customers figure since they are big buyers they can beat you down on price. Don't play that game. Part of the problem here is there are so many Amish sawmills. They come to me and get a price the run to them and of course they will sell for less, then they come back to me and want advice on how to dry it and finish it plane it and so on. I play dumb and tell them I don't know. :D. I think last night I decided to go back to hobby sawing. I will make some money some other way. I still enjoy sawing. May have a huge lumber pile here for the estate auction. :) :)
We do mostly custom orders from one board to truck loads. Having a large supply of logs on hand helps. If logs get old we saw into cants and then into either 3/4, 7/8 or 1" depending on width and orders.
We just got an order for 10 1" x 8" x 8'. This will be picked up with an order already completed by a good customer.
When sawing the 11" logs we will go for the 1", but if we see the quality is too low, then we will make 2" x 8" for garden beds. We sell several hundred of those 2x8 through out the year. These are the backup plan when we saw 8".
If this had been a stand alone order, I would have added a quarter a foot to regular price since it is a small order. I do add 10 cents a foot if a customer specifies widths.
I enjoy talking as much as anyone . But there are times when work comes first. Body language is a big cue when talk is over. If you are seated, just standing up is a good cue. And there is nothing wrong with politely saying, " I have to get back to work".
If you break a new blade, time to figure out what caused it. Several good threads on here about blade troubleshooting.
And has been said, "It is good to once in a while to stand back and reconnoiter the situation."
I have heard that the average length of self employment is 20 yrs. After that owners get cranky with all the constant BS they have to put up with.
I have 4 more years to magic 20. I have made changes in the last few years to make it better for me.
I like my customers, the ones I do not like....well.... I want them to go somewhere else. For them I am simply "sold out" when they call.
I'm happier being smaller and having someone appreciate what it is I do, and I work hard to keep them happy. My prices are fair, not cheap, not expensive.
Those who are(extreme); slow pay, play pricing games, take hrs of time for small $, I actually want them to be my competitions burden. Gives me some satisfaction thinking about it, 2 birds one stone.
Quote from: DMcCoy on August 31, 2016, 08:15:31 AM
I have heard that the average length of self employment is 20 yrs. After that owners get cranky with all the constant BS they have to put up with.
I barely made 15 year. Lol I was in the restaurant business. Now I'm unemployable I've been told.
When I first got my mill I was planning/hoping to make some part time money. So far I'm just hobby sawing which is all right with me
Matt
This is my 14th year to saw so does that mean that I can retire next year?? ??? 8)
Quote from: DMcCoy on August 31, 2016, 08:15:31 AM
I have heard that the average length of self employment is 20 yrs. After that owners get cranky with all the constant BS they have to put up with.
I have 4 more years to magic 20. I have made changes in the last few years to make it better for me.
I like my customers, the ones I do not like....well.... I want them to go somewhere else. For them I am simply "sold out" when they call.
I'm happier being smaller and having someone appreciate what it is I do, and I work hard to keep them happy. My prices are fair, not cheap, not expensive.
Those who are(extreme); slow pay, play pricing games, take hrs of time for small $, I actually want them to be my competitions burden. Gives me some satisfaction thinking about it, 2 birds one stone.
Maybe that is the problem, I am getting close to double the time.
Quote from: Kingcha on August 31, 2016, 08:41:58 AM
Quote from: DMcCoy on August 31, 2016, 08:15:31 AM
I have heard that the average length of self employment is 20 yrs. After that owners get cranky with all the constant BS they have to put up with.
I barely made 15 year. Lol I was in the restaurant business. Now I'm unemployable I've been told.
When I first got my mill I was planning/hoping to make some part time money. So far I'm just hobby sawing which is all right with me
Matt
[/quote
Not sure I can get a job either. I applied for a really good job and during the interview they made reference that I had worked for my self most of my life. They asked how I would do in a political situation and I said it would be an adjustment. They asked my management style. I said tell me what you want done and get the h*## out of the way. Well I am still self employed. ;D
Quote from: ozarkgem on August 31, 2016, 08:52:44 AM
Quote from: Kingcha on August 31, 2016, 08:41:58 AM
Quote from: DMcCoy on August 31, 2016, 08:15:31 AM
I have heard that the average length of self employment is 20 yrs. After that owners get cranky with all the constant BS they have to put up with.
I barely made 15 year. Lol I was in the restaurant business. Now I'm unemployable I've been told.
When I first got my mill I was planning/hoping to make some part time money. So far I'm just hobby sawing which is all right with me
Matt
[/quote
Not sure I can get a job either. I applied for a really good job and during the interview they made reference that I had worked for my self most of my life. They asked how I would do in a political situation and I said it would be an adjustment. They asked my management style. I said tell me what you want done and get the h*## out of the way. Well I am still self employed. ;D
Self employment has a way of changing a person's outlook, that is for sure. I tend to agree with being no longer hire-able. It is the lack of control I think, I'm not looking to get a job somewhere. I have to live with the consequences of my own stupid ideas but they are mine. Really obnoxious people I don't have to deal with which is something that is hard to put a price on. Having someone really appreciate the time and effort you put in and the word of mouth referrals are hard to beat as honest compliments.
With every Tom, Dick and Harry wanting to grow a beard and be a sawmill operator, its going to get even tighter to make a buck.
Unless you have a sawmill dealership.
I predict there is going to be allot used orange sawmills for sale in five years.
I am very comfortable with my decision. Re-leaved might be a better word. I will keep my mill and go in a different direction. I got to thinking about all the stuff I need to get to be able to sell quality lumber, kiln, buildings, planer, moulder, log yard and on and on. Not worth it. Keep it small and keep it all.
How prospective employers view a history of self employment is going to be directly influenced by how you view that history yourself.
See the thing is that being self employed does change you. It teaches you a skill set that you cant get being person number 362 on the line at the widget factory. It teaches you to deal with people, it teaches you to be self reliant, and it teaches you to recognise problems and look for solutions, and the simple truth is you cannot succeed being self employed unless you're passionate about what you do, and if you can bring that passion to the new career thats priceless. Those are attributes that are highly valuable to any employer.
But its how you present those attributes that makes you suitable for a job or not. Theres not a lot of places for a one man band in an orchestra: If you can present how those strengths can benefit the new team as a whole you become an asset. If you just want to be a one man band in the middle of my performance then you're going to be always out of tune.
You've been self employed: present yourself as a prospective employee that you yourself would want to hire.
Quote from: ozarkgem on August 31, 2016, 05:08:48 PM
I am very comfortable with my decision. Re-leaved might be a better word. I will keep my mill and go in a different direction. I got to thinking about all the stuff I need to get to be able to sell quality lumber, kiln, buildings, planer, moulder, log yard and on and on. Not worth it. Keep it small and keep it all.
Theres a lot to be said for that.
As mentioned previously I've been thinking on it a lot lately myself: I'm not ready to leave this industry but the overall strategic direction I'm currently taking isnt necessarily the one I want to be on. For me the question is can I find away to get from A to E without going through b, c and d. I've pretty much had to vertically integrate for want of a contractor base - there are good points in that in terms of being able to guarantee supply when I want it but it also means that I've got equipment that doesnt really pay its way, requires seat time to work, and time is the most precious commodity I have.
Realistically I need to spend another 1/2 million dollars to get where I want to go... sure its pre-tax dollars, and its exponential growth, and its equipment that pays for itself... but thats a lot of money any way you look at it. Not impossible when all said and done given where I am in life. But not easy either, and much as I love to drive a mill theres a part of me that looks at that number and thinks how many more 8 days weeks it'll take and wonders if theres an easier way. And part of me knows that behind that will be another half million because thats how I'm wired.
I love sawmilling. I cannot think of another thing I'd want to do every day to make a living... and I can see myself being 90 years old and still running a mill on the days I want to. But I like fishing too, and spending time with my wife, and travelling, and a whole heap of other things that I cannot find time for because I'm running a sawmill.
Ergo: I need a bigger faster sawmill so I can take time off occasionally :D
Ozarkgem, in France, 65 is an age where nobody wants to work anymore, except if they realy realy have to. Or they are dang politicians.
Legal age was 60, turning to 62 now. 64 in few years. Supposedly, i can do that when i'm 62 1/2. 20 years to go approximately.
Read the book early retirement extreme. And leave the mess to others to deal with it! ;D
@Satamax (https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=9153)
You are sooo bad...
Next thing we are going to see is a bunch of american refugees looking for early retirement. :D
venice
Quote from: Satamax on August 31, 2016, 06:03:38 PM
Ozarkgem, in France, 65 is an age where nobody wants to work anymore, except if they realy realy have to. Or they are dang politicians.
Legal age was 60, turning to 62 now. 64 in few years. Supposedly, i can do that when i'm 62 1/2. 20 years to go approximately.
Read the book early retirement extreme. And leave the mess to others to deal with it! ;D
Venice, Et. Al.,
In Norway the average work week was 35 hours when I was there in 2007-2009. We had to be careful not to exceed that with most of our team when there. Most expat construction workers like us expected to work 60-70 hours a week then have longer breaks between. When working in Iraq and Afghanistan the norm was 84 hours per week then 2-3 weeks off every 8 weeks.
Also many, if not most, European countries start off with 4 weeks mandatory vacation instead of starting with none or 1 week then building up an additional week every 5-10 years. I usually got TOWP which you built up weekly but that was also your sick leave, holiday pay and vacation.
Good luck.
Quote from: Satamax on August 31, 2016, 06:03:38 PM
Ozarkgem, in France, 65 is an age where nobody wants to work anymore, except if they realy realy have to. Or they are dang politicians.
Legal age was 60, turning to 62 now. 64 in few years. Supposedly, i can do that when i'm 62 1/2. 20 years to go approximately.
Read the book early retirement extreme. And leave the mess to others to deal with it! ;D
I tried retirement for a few hours. Hated it. I get great satisfaction from doing a hard days work. I really don't like to take Sundays off. I hate to waste a day doing nothing. That is the most worthless feeling there is. I think in Europe they are a little more laid back and maybe have a bigger social network. I have a very limited number of friends. Only 2 ever come to my house. I live alone. No pets. Maybe its my bathing schedule. I have to accomplish something every day. Its what keeps me going. I don't fish, play golf, go the the casino or what ever. I have no vices. Thank you for the thought though. Do you think you will retire and do nothing? Just wondering.
This may be working in my favor already. One of my customers I did a kitchen Island for last spring called and he wants some custom made doors and Cedar cabinets for his get away house. I can build it all here and deliver and install. No messing with people.
Quote from: longtime lurker on August 31, 2016, 05:47:16 PM
Quote from: ozarkgem on August 31, 2016, 05:08:48 PM
I am very comfortable with my decision. Re-leaved might be a better word. I will keep my mill and go in a different direction. I got to thinking about all the stuff I need to get to be able to sell quality lumber, kiln, buildings, planer, moulder, log yard and on and on. Not worth it. Keep it small and keep it all.
Theres a lot to be said for that.
As mentioned previously I've been thinking on it a lot lately myself: I'm not ready to leave this industry but the overall strategic direction I'm currently taking isnt necessarily the one I want to be on. For me the question is can I find away to get from A to E without going through b, c and d. I've pretty much had to vertically integrate for want of a contractor base - there are good points in that in terms of being able to guarantee supply when I want it but it also means that I've got equipment that doesnt really pay its way, requires seat time to work, and time is the most precious commodity I have.
Realistically I need to spend another 1/2 million dollars to get where I want to go... sure its pre-tax dollars, and its exponential growth, and its equipment that pays for itself... but thats a lot of money any way you look at it. Not impossible when all said and done given where I am in life. But not easy either, and much as I love to drive a mill theres a part of me that looks at that number and thinks how many more 8 days weeks it'll take and wonders if theres an easier way. And part of me knows that behind that will be another half million because thats how I'm wired.
I love sawmilling. I cannot think of another thing I'd want to do every day to make a living... and I can see myself being 90 years old and still running a mill on the days I want to. But I like fishing too, and spending time with my wife, and travelling, and a whole heap of other things that I cannot find time for because I'm running a sawmill.
Ergo: I need a bigger faster sawmill so I can take time off occasionally :D
I am a big fan of vertical integration. That is pretty much what I do now just on a smaller scale than you. I logged the logs using minimal equipment and sawed the lumber for the upcoming cabinet job. Not a lot of time in logging and sawing the lumber for that job but should be pretty good money.
ozarkgem,you live on a 250 foot square lot?? ??? Retirement,I would love it. I did take about 2 years off. I had to go back to work to get a rest. ;D I have many,many,many projects around here. I worked on a few of them in the 2 years,just never finished any of them. I would enjoy working my wood lot for one. I can't keep up with it now. Reclaim more of the grown up pasture. But that produces more work,places to be leveled out,rocks to be dug,more mowing. I could keep a crew busy here,just could not afford to pay them. Just like it's getting dark now at 7:45. The big lights will be coming out quick.
Quote from: thecfarm on August 31, 2016, 08:38:00 PM
ozarkgem,you live on a 250 foot square lot?? ??? Retirement,I would love it. I did take about 2 years off. I had to go back to work to get a rest. ;D I have many,many,many projects around here. I worked on a few of them in the 2 years,just never finished any of them. I would enjoy working my wood lot for one. I can't keep up with it now. Reclaim more of the grown up pasture. But that produces more work,places to be leveled out,rocks to be dug,more mowing. I could keep a crew busy here,just could not afford to pay them. Just like it's getting dark now at 7:45. The big lights will be coming out quick.
Where did you get the 250 ft sq lot? I have 2 places. 18 acres where I live in a cabin and 42 acres where my other cabin is. My cabin I live in is 800 sq ft. I love cabins.
You said you tried retirement for a few hours and hated it. You would rather put in a hard day's work. With a 250 foot square lot there is not much to do. I just thought you did not have the land to find something to do. ;D My land beckons me every morning as I leave for work. :( I do not need a job to keep me busy. I would much rather do a hard day's work on my own land. :) Pay may not be as good,but I sure do enjoy it alot more.
Quote from: thecfarm on August 31, 2016, 08:58:30 PM
You said you tried retirement for a few hours and hated it. You would rather put in a hard day's work. With a 250 foot square lot there is not much to do. I just thought you did not have the land to find something to do. ;D My land beckons me every morning as I leave for work. :( I do not need a job to keep me busy. I would much rather do a hard day's work on my own land. :) Pay may not be as good,but I sure do enjoy it alot more.
Yes my two places keep me busy but I consider it work. Maybe not paying work but still work and just as satisfying as a real job. Since my health insurance is going up 600% in Nov I need to make a little money also.
20 yrs sounds right. Alot of self employed people start of with a job for yrs then plunge in to there own business. So that would probly get them to retirement age. I tell people I am mentally and physically ready to retire but financially not quit there i'm 36 haha....
Quote from: ozarkgem on August 31, 2016, 08:21:11 PM
I tried retirement for a few hours. Hated it. I get great satisfaction from doing a hard days work. I really don't like to take Sundays off. I hate to waste a day doing nothing. That is the most worthless feeling there is. I think in Europe they are a little more laid back and maybe have a bigger social network. I have a very limited number of friends. Only 2 ever come to my house. I live alone. No pets. Maybe its my bathing schedule. I have to accomplish something every day. Its what keeps me going. I don't fish, play golf, go the the casino or what ever. I have no vices. Thank you for the thought though. Do you think you will retire and do nothing? Just wondering.
Ozarkgem, it's good if you're happy working hard. I'd say i work to fight depression. And to keep myself away from the booze. I'm lazy otherwise. If i'm with people, i work. On my own, my mind wanders to other territories. Anything is better than working, for me. If i could retire now. I'd go off traveling, fishing, hunting sailing. Seducing girls. But if i did that, may be my liver would be far worse. I like having my workshop, and being able to do things. I mean, do my own things. Build stoves, bows, guitars, whatever tickles my fancy. But work? Nah, not for me! ;D Earn money to pay more taxes? Endless taxes that mean you're not even owner of the land or house you bought. Leaving the rat race, that's more my goal. Have friends, enough dough to be happy, and still be able to do stuff. And leave all the power hungry, money hungry, fame hungry people to themselves.
Quote from: Satamax on September 01, 2016, 05:31:04 AM
Quote from: ozarkgem on August 31, 2016, 08:21:11 PM
I tried retirement for a few hours. Hated it. I get great satisfaction from doing a hard days work. I really don't like to take Sundays off. I hate to waste a day doing nothing. That is the most worthless feeling there is. I think in Europe they are a little more laid back and maybe have a bigger social network. I have a very limited number of friends. Only 2 ever come to my house. I live alone. No pets. Maybe its my bathing schedule. I have to accomplish something every day. Its what keeps me going. I don't fish, play golf, go the the casino or what ever. I have no vices. Thank you for the thought though. Do you think you will retire and do nothing? Just wondering.
Ozarkgem, it's good if you're happy working hard. I'd say i work to fight depression. And to keep myself away from the booze. I'm lazy otherwise. If i'm with people, i work. On my own, my mind wanders to other territories. Anything is better than working, for me. If i could retire now. I'd go off traveling, fishing, hunting sailing. Seducing girls. But if i did that, may be my liver would be far worse. I like having my workshop, and being able to do things. I mean, do my own things. Build stoves, bows, guitars, whatever tickles my fancy. But work? Nah, not for me! ;D Earn money to pay more taxes? Endless taxes that mean you're not even owner of the land or house you bought. Leaving the rat race, that's more my goal. Have friends, enough dough to be happy, and still be able to do stuff. And leave all the power hungry, money hungry, fame hungry people to themselves.
I am with you on leaving the rat race. I left it about 5 yrs ago. I am still able to make some money and deal with less rats.
I drew my last pay check in 1981. I am having a great ride. Up at 6:15 this morning ready for coffee, e-mails to see the quotes I need to make, read the forum, check Fox News and then later see what is going on at the mill. My son takes care of seeing that the help gets going and checks the orders to see what needs to be done. I fill in marking logs, bucking up, moving logs, sawing a little, answering phone calls, loading trucks, doing what needs to be done. Last chore last night was putting a pallet of T&G on a truck at 8:00. But I watched a little TV, took a nap, ate some supper for a few hours before that. Monday I practiced retirement for a couple of hours with a friend and coffee at McD's after a good day at the mill.
Heading in 2 weeks to Mn and Rotochopper for 2 days of show and tell at their expense. Got back from 3 days at IWF show in Atlanta. WOW, what a bunch of vendors, gizmos, and other neat things to look at. Learned a lot.
I still love the action.
This thread makes me feel how lucky I am.
I am still in the pink when sawing cedar.
Nothing better when things are going your way. Keep it up.
There are a lot of sentiments here that I can relate to.
Last paycheck was almost 4 years ago. Just got tired of the turds out there that think the workplace is a great location to play their little power games. I tend to think the jobsite is where we should get together and get the job done right!!
My wife and I made the move to our 80 acres and started working out several small lines of income.
I too am inclined to do everything for myself and have built up a serious pile of tools and machines.
Neat thing is that, if I need this tool do build something for me...the people around me need it too.
Seems like every system I set up, turns into another thing to bring in money. Now I'm not saying we're making big money, but we are making the bills and starting to get some good flow through a few of our lines of work. Best part is, I get bored easily, so the many angles keeps things fresh.
Most importantly, we are happy improving our little paradise and even the bad days are far better than the old days putting up with a boss I can't get any work out of.
Most days...I wake up about 9am ( not a morning person), surf for tools and skills on the net, and start leaning on something by 10 or 11am. We work till we're done with the task which may be 7-9pm.
Not much time right now for play as we're leaning hard to get so much built. But we decide what each day will be and I really like that freedom.
Yesterday, it was Sunny and I needed some parts and supplies from town, 150 miles South. Woke up and hopped in the Cobra!! Had a great day running about 300 miles of premium highway and communing with my favorite toy!
Today we're back to fixing things and filling the kiln. I wouldn't change a thing!!
I spent 8 years working for "the man", 12 years self-employed, then back to the corporate offices for a few more years and finally two years ago, to "public service" (aka state employee). After being jerked around by bosses, employees and customers, I am at a job that I love, working with and for some great folks, and hoping that I can retire from here. In the meantime, though, I am building my retirement plan - custom woodworking shop, stockpiling lumber, and planning on getting a new mill very soon for hobby sawing and to supplement any future income I may need. I know things will change significantly in the next 20 years but I hope to be able to saw logs and lumber for myself, build some decent furniture and crafts, and be able to sell a few boards here and there to other hobby woodworkers.
All I can say, is working for yourself can be a lot of work. :D :D :D
Most guys that are self-employed complain their Boss is an Idoit .
Idoit too! :D
Sawing custom can be tricky. Just did around 10k bdft for a very nice customer, no list, talk about walking the tight line, too bas its my last job sawing,
Keep looking Jim. I think you will or maybe you already have found your niche.
PC
Quote from: AlaskaLes on September 01, 2016, 02:17:14 PM
There are a lot of sentiments here that I can relate to.
Last paycheck was almost 4 years ago. Just got tired of the turds out there that think the workplace is a great location to play their little power games. I tend to think the jobsite is where we should get together and get the job done right!!
My wife and I made the move to our 80 acres and started working out several small lines of income.
I too am inclined to do everything for myself and have built up a serious pile of tools and machines.
Neat thing is that, if I need this tool do build something for me...the people around me need it too.
Seems like every system I set up, turns into another thing to bring in money. Now I'm not saying we're making big money, but we are making the bills and starting to get some good flow through a few of our lines of work. Best part is, I get bored easily, so the many angles keeps things fresh.
Most importantly, we are happy improving our little paradise and even the bad days are far better than the old days putting up with a boss I can't get any work out of.
Most days...I wake up about 9am ( not a morning person), surf for tools and skills on the net, and start leaning on something by 10 or 11am. We work till we're done with the task which may be 7-9pm.
Not much time right now for play as we're leaning hard to get so much built. But we decide what each day will be and I really like that freedom.
Yesterday, it was Sunny and I needed some parts and supplies from town, 150 miles South. Woke up and hopped in the Cobra!! Had a great day running about 300 miles of premium highway and communing with my favorite toy!
Today we're back to fixing things and filling the kiln. I wouldn't change a thing!!
Another Mighty Mite mill owner. So far I think its you and me.
Quote from: paul case on September 01, 2016, 07:53:40 PM
Keep looking Jim. I think you will or maybe you already have found your niche.
PC
Hey Paul
I kind of like your set up. You don't deal with people that much. I got a call from a customer in Racine. He is ready to get back on his project. I think once I get started on it his friends will see what I do and it will go from there. I still plan on sawing. I just don't want to deal with the "I need 2 1x6's" and sort the whole pile to get the ones they want. If the job in Racine takes off I plan on moving to Neosho area.Brandon has a pretty sweet setup also. No dealing with people.
Yup, just you and me on that list. I haven't seen them mentioned often, but it's a VERY well built mill and I'm making it even better. Mine is a Mk4B. Which one are you running?
I don't work it a whole lot of the time. Upgraded to Cooks guides and 1.5" bands cuts really flat and pretty fast. Also nice to be able to do 25.5' beams. I was initially planning on a clean, used TK B20 and then this showed up for a good price and better options.
I have been planning on avoiding the guys looking for 6 boards. I'd rather spend the time building something with those 6 boards that's worth more than 6 board Charlie is going to bring in...lol.
Good luck with your upcoming job.
Even with lots a Amish mills here things are going good here also, I do a lot of custom sawing and sell lumber for trailer decking and fencing, very little small sales, side lumber goes for flooring rather cheap but at least its gone. The only regret is that I should have started when I was 25 instead of 55.. Being portable I've even sawed for the Amish 3 times, I think they'd rather have me saw than haul their logs. Steve
Quote from: AlaskaLes on September 02, 2016, 12:16:14 AM
Yup, just you and me on that list. I haven't seen them mentioned often, but it's a VERY well built mill and I'm making it even better. Mine is a Mk4B. Which one are you running?
I don't work it a whole lot of the time. Upgraded to Cooks guides and 1.5" bands cuts really flat and pretty fast. Also nice to be able to do 25.5' beams. I was initially planning on a clean, used TK B20 and then this showed up for a good price and better options.
I have been planning on avoiding the guys looking for 6 boards. I'd rather spend the time building something with those 6 boards that's worth more than 6 board Charlie is going to bring in...lol.
Good luck with your upcoming job.
Can't remember the model no. Its a 1985 version. They are heavy built. Mine only had 2 hyd valves on it when I bought it. Now there is 11 valves. Full hydraulic now.
6 board Charlie :D :D
Jim,
I know how depressing it is dealing with John Q. Public. I may have forgotten to show you the $1000 worth of custom cuts from my logs sitting in the end of the building waiting on the orderee to pic them up and pay. Makes me think about quiting custom work. However I have a few that work out to my benefit.
With ties, cants, grade and pallet stringers, I could easily make enough to justify only sawing my own logs into my own products. It may come to that for me. I know that we do better at cutting the same things all the time. Scott(my 21yo son) has been on cants and ties with 4/4 from the sides for a long time now and seldom has a mis cut or has to take a shim. I may even take up building houses or cabins, who knows?
PC
Quote from: paul case on September 02, 2016, 06:26:57 PM
Jim,
I know how depressing it is dealing with John Q. Public. I may have forgotten to show you the $1000 worth of custom cuts from my logs sitting in the end of the building waiting on the orderee to pic them up and pay. Makes me think about quiting custom work. However I have a few that work out to my benefit.
With ties, cants, grade and pallet stringers, I could easily make enough to justify only sawing my own logs into my own products. It may come to that for me. I know that we do better at cutting the same things all the time. Scott(my 21yo son) has been on cants and ties with 4/4 from the sides for a long time now and seldom has a mis cut or has to take a shim. I may even take up building houses or cabins, who knows?
PC
I like the cabin idea. I can do rustic.