Bottle neck

Peter Drouin · June 08, 2015, 06:48:15 PM

Hired two men today to help some. Found a bottle neck real fast. :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

drobertson · June 08, 2015, 06:53:00 PM

Not sure I'm understanding, could it be the sloppy slab stacking?

bkaimwood · June 08, 2015, 06:54:55 PM

Maybe you shouldn't saw so fast? Hahaha!!! Its hard to get good help!!

goose63 · June 08, 2015, 06:57:43 PM

Look's like a lot of camp fire wood

Brucer · June 08, 2015, 11:33:45 PM

From the subject, I thought this was gonna be about slide guitar :D.

Remember, it's only a bottleneck if it reduces the amount of money you make in a given amount of time.

Percy · June 08, 2015, 11:41:04 PM

Quote from: Peter Drouin on June 08, 2015, 06:48:15 PM
Hired two men today to help some. Found a bottle neck real fast. :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

Yep...using human anatomy as a parallel to your situation....You improved your throat only to find out that now your butt is plugged.. :D :D

Ron Wenrich · June 09, 2015, 06:29:01 AM

Handling waste is always a problem. It is the lowest valued product, which means you can't spend a lot of time handling or storing it. In milling, waste accounts for half your volume. Your results may vary.

We had a similar setup when we first started. We could put about a cord of slabs in a bundle. We banded ours, then hoped we could sell them as the heating season came around. We found that our supply was much larger than the demand. Too much land was used to store the material. So, we found an alternative.

We ended up chipping ours. We never signed in with a paper mill, as there are few. We did end up selling chips to a local company that makes mulch. We ran our chipper with a Detroit 641. At first, they would take the slabs to the chipper, then pay someone to chip on the weekend. That was eventually moved to the mill, and fed in at the mill. Our production, at that time was about 8 Mbf/day. Eventually we moved to conveyors and slab dumps. That worked out pretty good, and saved a bunch of labor.

If you're upping your production, you'll have to figure out what to do with the waste.

Cedarman · June 09, 2015, 07:07:06 AM

We have a long belt down the center of the mill feeding a grinding hog. Makes mulch which is blown into a truck. Mulch company changes out trucks as needed. We make 1 to 2 loads per week depending on what we are doing. All junk slabs go to the belt. Slabs with recoverable lumber go through resaw with waste going on belt. Edger at end of resaw and edgings go on belt. A linear process. Our WM is set about 20 feet from the belt and all slabs have to be carried to the belt. All floor sweepings free of rock go onto the belt. Amazing the amount of material that hits the floor.
But we are paid well for cedar mulch.

Machinery is much more efficient at handling waste then humans. Bundle slabs and move with forks. Handling a second time is more efficient if they are bundled.

Peter Drouin · June 09, 2015, 06:49:56 PM

Quote from: Percy on June 08, 2015, 11:41:04 PM
Quote from: Peter Drouin on June 08, 2015, 06:48:15 PM
Hired two men today to help some. Found a bottle neck real fast. :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

Yep...using human anatomy as a parallel to your situation....You improved your throat only to find out that now your butt is plugged.. :D :D

:D :D :D

Quote from: Ron Wenrich on June 09, 2015, 06:29:01 AM
Handling waste is always a problem. It is the lowest valued product, which means you can't spend a lot of time handling or storing it. In milling, waste accounts for half your volume. Your results may vary.

We had a similar setup when we first started. We could put about a cord of slabs in a bundle. We banded ours, then hoped we could sell them as the heating season came around. We found that our supply was much larger than the demand. Too much land was used to store the material. So, we found an alternative.

We ended up chipping ours. We never signed in with a paper mill, as there are few. We did end up selling chips to a local company that makes mulch. We ran our chipper with a Detroit 641. At first, they would take the slabs to the chipper, then pay someone to chip on the weekend. That was eventually moved to the mill, and fed in at the mill. Our production, at that time was about 8 Mbf/day. Eventually we moved to conveyors and slab dumps. That worked out pretty good, and saved a bunch of labor.

If you're upping your production, you'll have to figure out what to do with the waste.

Quote from: Cedarman on June 09, 2015, 07:07:06 AM
We have a long belt down the center of the mill feeding a grinding hog. Makes mulch which is blown into a truck. Mulch company changes out trucks as needed. We make 1 to 2 loads per week depending on what we are doing. All junk slabs go to the belt. Slabs with recoverable lumber go through resaw with waste going on belt. Edger at end of resaw and edgings go on belt. A linear process. Our WM is set about 20 feet from the belt and all slabs have to be carried to the belt. All floor sweepings free of rock go onto the belt. Amazing the amount of material that hits the floor.
But we are paid well for cedar mulch.

Machinery is much more efficient at handling waste then humans. Bundle slabs and move with forks. Handling a second time is more efficient if they are bundled.

I do chip all the [stuff] from the mill.
I just got cut off guard what 3 guys and a WM supper can do. :D :D :D

Today went well, I think we got all the bugs worked out now.

Magicman · June 09, 2015, 07:28:34 PM

Is "bottle necks" similar to "Goat Necks"?? ???

POSTON WIDEHEAD · June 09, 2015, 07:29:55 PM

Quote from: Magicman on June 09, 2015, 07:28:34 PM
Is "bottle necks" similar to "Goat Necks"?? ???

Magicman · June 09, 2015, 07:35:19 PM

Be careful when you choose weapons.

This thing just might be motorized. ;D

Peter Drouin · June 09, 2015, 10:26:02 PM

Quote from: Magicman on June 09, 2015, 07:28:34 PM
Is "bottle necks" similar to "Goat Necks"?? ???

:D :D :D :D

Quote from: Magicman on June 09, 2015, 07:35:19 PM
Be careful when you choose weapons. This thing just might be motorized. ;D

4x4American · June 09, 2015, 10:32:10 PM

I was told by the mechanic at the big hardwood mill up the road, that the waste payed all the bills for the operation. Paid the employees and all. And that the profit from the lumber was pure profit. How true is that? I have no idea, but that's what he told me.

Peter Drouin · June 10, 2015, 06:01:20 AM

Quote from: 4x4American on June 09, 2015, 10:32:10 PM
I was told by the mechanic at the big hardwood mill up the road, that the waste payed all the bills for the operation. Paid the employees and all. And that the profit from the lumber was pure profit. How true is that? I have no idea, but that's what he told me.

I don't see how that can be.

Ron Wenrich · June 10, 2015, 06:16:11 AM

You have to look at it this way. Half of the log is going to be waste. It goes out in slab and sawdust. You're sawing pine, so the weight would be a little different. But, for the typical hardwood mill, for every 1 Mbf sawn, you will get about 2 tons in slabs and 1 ton of dust. If chips are $30/ton and dust is $15/ton, you would end up with $75 per Mbf for the waste. Add in another $20/Mbf for bark, and you'll be getting close to $100/Mbf in waste. You can look at either getting your logs $100/Mbf cheaper or your milling costs are $100/Mbf cheaper.

Not many mills are working with only a $100/Mbf cutting expense. It probably will pay mill wages, but not all costs. One of the highest costs are logs. Whether you log your logs or buy them over the road, they are still an expense item. Trucking also has to be factored in as an expense.

Klicker · June 10, 2015, 11:18:42 AM

I heard of a farmer who took a load of logs to a mill and thought he would get a load of shavings. He said they wanted as much for the shavings as he got for the logs

4x4American · June 10, 2015, 09:31:16 PM

That was from the old mechanic from long ago, the mill had been around a longtime and prolly didn't have much overhead as say a newer mill. Now they redid the place and have prolly alot of overhead. It also helps that the company is huge, they have I belive 5 mills in the USA and milling isn't their main thing. I was told that the mills were just kinda beer money to the company. This is just what i was told by an oldtimer.

thecfarm · June 11, 2015, 06:51:37 AM

That was either bad logs or expensive shavings. ;D

AnthonyW · June 11, 2015, 11:40:57 AM

Quote from: Ron Wenrich on June 10, 2015, 06:16:11 AM
You have to look at it this way. Half of the log is going to be waste. It goes out in slab and sawdust. You're sawing pine, so the weight would be a little different. But, for the typical hardwood mill, for every 1 Mbf sawn, you will get about 2 tons in slabs and 1 ton of dust. If chips are $30/ton and dust is $15/ton, you would end up with $75 per Mbf for the waste. Add in another $20/Mbf for bark, and you'll be getting close to $100/Mbf in waste. You can look at either getting your logs $100/Mbf cheaper or your milling costs are $100/Mbf cheaper.

Not many mills are working with only a $100/Mbf cutting expense. It probably will pay mill wages, but not all costs. One of the highest costs are logs. Whether you log your logs or buy them over the road, they are still an expense item. Trucking also has to be factored in as an expense.

I have to remind my father, the mill is not a mill. It is a 24 foot long log splitter that also has the ability to make lumber. I give no second thoughts to opening a log that looks good. If it turns out to be junk, I slab it in 4" thick, cut to length with the chainsaw and stick it in his firewood pile.