processor saw control valve question

[ssspeciale]

Hi all this is my first post,even though I have been lurking and learning here for a few years. My son and I are building a wood processor.It will be used to process logs up to about 16" with about a 20 hp gas engine all hydraulic with a 20" bar hydraulic saw,4"x24" ram with a 6 way splitter,and a hydraulic motor driven saw feed and log bunk.My question is about how to plumb the hydraulics for the saw.If possible I would like to have the saw turn on/off,lower/raise and have the clamp clamp/release all with 1 valve.I have watched videos where it looks to me like that is how some processors work.Is this possible? If it is possible how should i plumb it up?
I also would like to know how my splitter auto cycle (with power beyond)valve and my 2 spool valve for the saw feed and the log bunk should be configured.Should they be before or after the saw valve?Would I be able to say use the log feed bunk feed functions while the splitter auto cycles or would I have to wait for the splitter ram to extend and retract (I don"t think I would use the saw/clamp valve until the splitter ram retracts)before i can use another valve? I hope someone on here can explain all this to me.Thanks in advance to everyone you all are a great group of helpful knowledgeable folk.

[Gearbox]

There is a book at Surplus Center that lay's out hydraulics . For sure you will need at least a 2 section pump .

[DDW_OR]

 have a 2008 Multitek 1610ez
what i like
live deck, conveyor, 4 way splitter
what i do not like, or change
make live deck to handle longer logs
awkward last cut.
3 foot longer conveyor
my controls are on the driver side, I like the newer ones with controls on passenger side.
better motor cover to keep bark and branches off

https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,89073.msg1369419/topicseen.html#msg1369419

https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,82908.msg1342780/topicseen.html#msg1342780

[blackfoot griz]

I have had good luck with my one lever clamp, saw motor and saw cylinder circuit. The key is splitting the saw cylinder circuit with a flow control- -this enables you to speed up the cut,slow or even stop the cut . There are some pics in my gallery. I am guessing you will running at least two pumps...a 2 stage for the splitting function and another to run the saw, clamp, live deck etc. Where I see your challenge is getting the balance of getting the max out of 20 hp for this.  On my build, the pump section that runs the saw, saw motor and saw cylinder is 15 gpm @ 1500 psi. It is adequate, but I wouldn't want to have less power here.  This would take most if not all of your 20 horses. 

Are you planning on cutting and splitting at the same time?

[ssspeciale]

blackfoot griz

It looks like you have the same setup I would like build. I was not planning on cutting and splitting at the same time I thought that would require a larger engine and I"m trying to keep cost down.I need advice on the pump/pumps and engine size I have a 20 hp kohler I thought I would use but if i need bigger i will start looking.Do I need 2 pumps if I don't cut and split at the same time? I haven't bought the pump/pumps because I'm not sure what i should get.I do have the hydraulic motor for the saw it's .70 cu in 15 gpm 5000 rpm.I appreciate any advice you can give me.thanks

[blackfoot griz]

Trying to do this with one pump could be a little challenging!  IMO,  you will need a minimum of 2500 psi going to your splitter with a 4 inch diameter cylinder....especially trying to push a block  through a 6 way knife.  That said, that leaves something like 12.5 to 13 gpm  maxing out your 20 hp engine.  (Hopefully someone will verify....doing this off a little cheap iPad thingy, with a slow internet connection and off the top of my head. These days, I can hide my own Easter eggs). This flow may be enough to run the saw function and the psi would be on the lower end of the scale for the splitter function for a 6 way knife. As I see it, you are trying to balance psi and flow rate to get the job done. 20 hp is plenty to run a two stage pump, but I am afraid it would not work well trying to use the 2 stage for the saw function. I think it would kick down and be too slow. Has anybody tried a 2 stage pump for a saw function?

[Al_Smith]

You can "stack" the pumps,IE connected via a through shaft if you get the right kind .It will cost a fortune though . I've seen 3 or 4 in a row in certain industrial applications ran from big electric motors .

Then too if you had a large enough pump and engine you could use a common pressure line and use I think it's called open center valves .This system would be expensive too .This system runs at full pressure all the time using an unloader valve set to whatever pressure you want  .4 inch cylinder and a 6 way might not be enough size to get the job done .

[DDW_OR]

my 1610ez uses one pump and 25 hp

here is the control layout


 

Conveyor Controls
Log Lift     Conveyor
Up             Forward

Log Lift      Conveyor
Down         reverse

Saw     splitter   adjustable      log clamp      log feed
down   extend   wedge up      down      forward

saw   splitter   adjustable      log clamp      log feed
up   return   wedge down   up              reverse


Log Lift = Live deck

[ssspeciale]

DDW_OR

Do you have any specs on the pump in your 1610ez?Is there a make/model plate on it that i could try to search? I have been watching 1610ez videos on youtube and it looks like the saw runs fast and the cycle time on the splitter is around 6-7 seconds.I would be happy with something close to that I don't plan on cutting a bunch of larger diameter logs unless they are not worth sawing on the sawmill,I think i will be processing mostly in the 6" to 12" diameter range. thanks

[dave_dj1]

I just went and watched some of the videos on the Multitek 1610ez, I see what you mean about having the controls on the drivers side vs the passenger side, it looks as though I would prefer them on the drivers side as well.
It looks to be a nice machine with some well thought out features. I would need it to cut longer than 22"-24" though, I need 30".
I would love to build one very similar.

[snowstorm]

You can "stack" the pumps,IE connected via a through shaft if you get the right kind .It will cost a fortune though . I've seen 3 or 4 in a row in certain industrial applications ran from big electric motors .

Then too if you had a large enough pump and engine you could use a common pressure line and use I think it's called open center valves .This system would be expensive too .This system runs at full pressure all the time using an unloader valve set to whatever pressure you want  .4 inch cylinder and a 6 way might not be enough size to get the job done .

i think you mean closed center valves. usually a piston pump is used and the pressure is relived at the pump not the valve. with load sensing pressure compensated valves. you could 2or3 or4 functions at once with almost no loss of speed. it can also be done with an open center gear pump if you have load sensing valves. its not as good but way better than just an old open center system

[ssspeciale]

blackfoot griz

Is the manifold you use to control the saw motor and the clamp and saw rams a purchased item?

[blackfoot griz]

blackfoot griz

Is the manifold you use to control the saw motor and the clamp and saw rams a purchased item?

Yes, I built my processor and hauled the whole thing to town to have a hydro shop run all the lines. I don't know what the manifold is. Unfortunately, I won't be anywhere near it for a couple of weeks.  :'(

[DDW_OR]

DDW_OR

Do you have any specs on the pump in your 1610ez?Is there a make/model plate on it that i could try to search? I have been watching 1610ez videos on youtube and it looks like the saw runs fast and the cycle time on the splitter is around 6-7 seconds.I would be happy with something close to that I don't plan on cutting a bunch of larger diameter logs unless they are not worth sawing on the sawmill,I think i will be processing mostly in the 6" to 12" diameter range. thanks

Sorry it took so long. installing a Central Boiler 750 and other prioritys


 

200102580202
AP200/15 D 880
9B 50154608
MADE IN ITALY
BUCHER HYDRAULICS

__________

I am very GREEN when it comes to hydraulics. so how do i read this plate info?

Edit - here is the link to that question
https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,93354.0.html