What do You THink of These Mill Prices?

[jpgreen]

I'm totally new at sawing for hire, and the milling I've done has been for my own lumber, and trades.

Below is a price list from a mill in our area.  They are the only one around, cept for a building supply that is sky high.  The next choice is a box store 2 hours away at a one way drive.   What do you think of these prices, and based on these prices what oportunity would be there for a private portable mill operator?

What I'm getting at is- what could a guy charge for milling the property owners downed logs? This sure would help give me an idea of what to look at and maybe where to start.  I was thinking of charging by the board foot, that way my slowness due to inexperience with my woodmizer, would be a fair deal for the homeowner.

Any thoughts would be much appreciated.

Cedar 3/4"
Sel/Btr ...........$1275/M
#1       ............  940/M
#2       ............  875/M
#3       ............  825/M
#4       ............  675/M
Pecky   ............  575/M

Cedar 4/4
Sel/Btr ...........$1425/M
#1       ............  1090/M
#2       ............  1025/M
#3       ............  975/M
#4       ............  825/M
Pecky   ............  725/M

Pine
4/4 up to 6" wide  ............... $425/M
4/4-8/4 & over 6" wide  ......  $450/M

Doug Fir
4/4 up to 6" wide  ...............  $750/M
4/4-8/4 & over 6" wide  ......   $750/M
3" & 4" Deck Boards  ...........  $1000/M
6"x6" & above  ....................  $2000/M

Tan Oak
(5/4) & Below
Sel/Btr ...........$900/M
#1       ............ 700/M
#2       ............ 500/M
Mixed Grade KD S2S .......  $900/M

Black Oak
(5/4) & Below
Sel/Btr ...........$1200/M
#1       ............ 1000/M
#2       ............ 700/M

ALl lumber is green & rough sawn.

[beenthere]

I'll admit to your post being a bit confusing.  Not tough to confuse me  :

Are you 'sawing for hire' for which you would likely want to just charge by the hour or charge by the total board feet sawn?

Or (being as you posted a price list by grade, etc.) are you thinking to saw and grade the lumber (edging and end trimming and then 'grading') and sell graded lumber?

I would think you would not be in a position to grade lumber (although knowing a bit about it will help you make some of the sawing decisions) nor interested in doing it for a customer, unless you are going to set up your business to sell lumber by grade, thickness, and species.  If so, that would entail drying it, as storing green lumber can be done only for a very short time or on stickers in an air-dry pile.

Just inquiring, to help you get more information. 

[Jeff]

Looks like he is developing a marketing point for getting people to have thier own trees sawn into lumber by a portable mill by comparing a service price to out the door prices at the local mill.

Correctamundo?

[jpgreen]

Nexactly...  8) 8) 8) 8)

[Jeff]

It'll never work. :-\

[Jeff]

KIDDING ;)

[jpgreen]

 >:(.............  :D

[Jeff]

You'll get lotsa good advice in da morning. I'm to tired to be anything but goofy. In between typing I am resting my head with my chin in my hand and my elbow on the arm of the chair and just randomly clicking around da forum. ZZZZZZZZZ

[jpgreen]

I'm doing the very same thing.  Noddin' out at the keyboard. Time for beddyby...   

[Bibbyman]

For some reason my alrarm went off at midnight.  That's why I'm up. 

[TN_man]

I was wondering why you guys were up so late.
I would just charge by the bd.ft. regardless of the grade. It will take just as much effort on your part to saw up poor quality lumber as it will good.
The other guys prices are based on the fact that it is his lumber and he has graded it. You will be cutting other people's lumber and not grading it, if I understand what you are wanting to do.
I charge 20 cents/bd.ft., some other woodmizer guys I know of around here charge 15 cents/bd.ft.. I think that they are a little low.
These are Tennessee prices though. I have no idea what the going rate would be out your way.
Just my 2 cents.

[Ron Wenrich]

Lots of variables.  Does the landowner have any other use for the trees?  Can he sell the trees or do they just sit there and rot?  If it is the latter, then you have a market for cutting the logs.  

Can he sell the trees or can he use the lumber?  If he can use the lumber, then you may have a market for cutting the logs.  If he has no use for the lumber, then its better to sell the logs.

Your price has to be the difference or less between selling the logs and buying the lumber.  If logs are selling for $500/Mbf and the landowner can buy the comparable lumber for $700/Mbf, then you have to come in at $200/Mbf to make your scenario work.  

A lot would depend on log markets, lumber markets, your sawing price, and log yield.  

[jpgreen]

Thanks Ron,

That was the part of the equation I did not have yet.  What the prices are for logs.

But the people that want me to mill for them now, have logs and need lumber, and some would just go to rot. Most of these people do not want logs skidded on their property and tearin' up the place, so they have been real happy with my other mill, but it's to much work. 

I've got a drop axle trailer frame off a 18' travel trailer that I'm thinking about making a log hauler out of simular to the one Daren posted.  His was a propane tank mover.  Then I could move some logs to the woodmizer if need be.  Or a rich aunt could leave me a pile of money, and I'd go buy a Peterson..  ;D

The other thing is it's not that easy to get logs hauled off like it used to be in these parts.  They need a Timber Harvest Plan filed, and with the cost of fuel, etc. the portable mill looks better all the time.

I seem to remember the mill owner be real picky about what he'll come out and get, and he don't pay all that much.

Another neighbor of mine had 10 big old growth Oaks.  Bout' 36" diameter.  I could not mill them with my old mill.  He did a trade with the Saw mill owner, and the owner picked em' up.

I looked at his share of the deal after it was all said and done and the stack looked pretty skimpy to me. My neighbor didn't have any concept of scale or board feet, and was happy with what he got.  I didn't have the heart to tell him he got took to the cleaners.

*DanG- wish I had my Woodmizer then..   :-[

[getoverit]

Last year when I started trying to find a sawyer to cut up some Hickory for me, I got prices ranging from $.20/bdf to $.90/bdf. One in between there came up with $.35/bdf.

In each case, they ALL wanted me to haul the logs to them. None we willing to come to my place and saw them on site.

The one mill at $.90/bdf has been in business for generations, and has a huge woodlot and several employees and loads of equipment. The one at $.35/bdf has a woodmizer HD30 with a lamborghini engine on it. Although it is portable, he hasnt moved it in years. He also has a circle mill, a Corley I think. The one at $.20 is a portable mill.

You have to build a business plan based on expenses in your area, and then stick to your prices that you set where you can make a profit. In my case, I am leaning towards a price of around $.35/bdf with my new Peterson. The reason I am higher is because of the following reasons:

1. I will be milling one tree at a time at the owner's location.

2. The trees I am going to mill are urban trees and will most likely have metal in them that will have to be dodged or cut around.

3. I will most likely have some time with the homeowner educating them on proper drying methods.

4. Most of what I will be milling I am expecting to be hardwoods, and hardwoods dont mill as fast as softwoods - more time spent milling.

You will have to decide whether or not you are going to go get the logs and mill them at your place or mill them on site, and then decide how much time you are going to have invested to mill the logs into lumber and then calculate your expenses for fuel, blades, time and wear and tear on your mill. Of course you can base all of your prices on the actual price of green lumber from other mills. Keep in mind that they may have a volume or bigger, more poweerful equipment that allows them to mill for less than your actual costs. You have to base your prices on YOUR costs and wanted profit margin.

Hope this helps!

[dail_h]

   I do both,here at home,and also at the customer's. You have to be flexible ,and adaptable. You can't saw for a week 45 miles away ,for the same thing you do in your backyard,least not for long.

[customsawyer]

Here are some other things for thought. It will also depend on what other equipment you bring with you and if you furnish a extra man or is the log owner provides a off bearer. Other than that it mostly depends on what the market can bear. I know that when I move to a customers site I take the sawmill, tractor with loader, and if the job is big enough I take my edger, with one or two men to stack the lumber. So as you can see if you are bringing all of this epuipment and hired help the price per bf as to be enough to cover all expences. For the most part if I am understanding you just bought your mill, so brace yourself there is going to be a learning curve involved in getting to where you are making any dough. On the other side of the coin is the fact that if you bring all of this extra stuff than you should be able to produce more bf/hr and it should all even out in the end. Point in fact is that some days are better than others so you just take the good with the bad, keep smiling,  laugh at yourself from time to time and remember that what ever mistake you just made we did to.
P.S. keep a eye on the side supports and the clamp. ;D