How to evaluate used sawmill?

[idaho04]

I am shopping for a used mill. I am about to go on a trip to see a '92 WM LT40HDG24. Although I am pretty good mechanic, I am not experienced in sawmills. What should I be looking for checking a used sawmill?

Anybody selling a sawmill for under $14K?

[Bibbyman]

How many hours may be a little deceiving.  Look it over and see if it looks "banged up" as in how hard it may have been used/abused.  

The head should track back and forth and up and down smoothly.  If not, maybe there are a bearing or two bad in the sawhead.

Check the "feel" of the up/down and forward/reverse switches.  If they are "mushy" or don't always cause the head to go up/down, forward/reverse real snappy,  they could need cleaning or replacing.  They don't last forever in any case and cost about $40 each to replace.

Same as above with the hydraulics.  Plus look for leaks.

Look at the lumber that has been recently sawn or saw some lumber on the mill and note if it makes good lumber or not.  This will tell you if it's adjusted right.

Without some experience,  it would be hard to tell if the guide rollers need replaced.  You could just ask if they have been replaced recently.  The guide arm should slide in and out smooth and have just a little play with hand pressure.

Ask if any updates have been made to the mill.  Wood-Mizer has been making little improvements along the way and some mill owners will make every update and others will only update when they have a problem.

Options,  add them up.... Got debarker?,  setworks?, sharpener? Resaw?  Seat? Extra blades?  Maintenance parts such as filters, plugs, etc.

[Captain]

One thing to keep in mind, if buying new or used, is TRAINING.  As you mentioned, you are not an experienced sawyer....

I bought my first mill and had to learn everything myself, the learning curve was slow. :-[  When I sold it, I spent the afternoon cutting logs into lumber with the buyer, and he left about 2-3 months ahead in knowledge than I was when I bought.  

I would not buy without at least watching some materials being cut.  It does not take a pro to recognize problems and do not be afraid to ask questions.  Also, guys like Bibby and other folks familiar with the particular product are extremely valuable resources when looking for "common" wear items.

Best of luck

Captain

[chet]

When I looked at a couple used mills, I took a freind of mine that had been running the same mills for quite awhile. With my limited backround the mills looked great. My buddy had a totally different opinion.

[Bibbyman]

Wood-Mizer gives the same training and support to a buyer of a used mill as they do a new mill.  That's one reason that used WM are so popular.

I should also add,  look to see if all the shielding is in place and you don't see something cobbled up.  

You could ask also if the mill had been recently inspected and adjusted by Wood-Mizer.  If you take the mill to one of the service centers for your day of training,  it would be a good time to have them go through it.  They will take you step by step through alignment and give you tips of what to watch for if this or that start to happen.

I think there is a fee for the inspection and any parts they replece but then you'd know you were starting out right.

[ElectricAl]

Idaho04,

Just an example, a friend of our has a 1994 LT40HDG24 with 700 hours. Less then 10 portable jobs. Sawed in a barn. Always kept in side, never rained on. $12,500.

1992-1995 LT's are all basically the same.

[ARKANSAWYER]

  Do not be worried if the mill has been used.  Mine has sawn over 600,000 bdft and shows the scars of the work and has been drug over 15,000 miles to do it.  Wanda will saw with the best of them.  I would look to see if has signs of being serviced.  Old grease and new on fittings.  Oil drain plug that looks like it has be used.  Clean filters, and no cobbling is a good indicator.  Tracks should be clean and not pitted deeply and by all means make it cut something even if you have to go get a 2x6 and rip it in half.
    Call the closet WM place and they will give you some training.  Better yet bring it to the house I have plenty of logs and experiance to put you way ahead of the learning curve.  I will even furnish blades, fuel and lunch.
ARKANSAWYER

[MM]

Bib,
 Wood-Mizer don't do the free training thing anymore. They only give training if you bring your mill in and have a service plan done on it. silver for <500 hours. gold for <1000 ect.or they will do training for $50.00 per hour. or maybe it's $55.00 per hour. I don't remember.
   The most important thing on looking at a used mill is the overall condition of the mill. Take a lool at the grease fitting and see if they have had grease in them. If the mill was bought buy the person that has it. Try to feel them out on how much preventive they done on it.  If the mill has a lot of hours take the covers off and look inside. Pull the dip stick on the engine and look at the filter. Ask yourself. Does it look like they have changed it like they should? Check the over all operation of the mill. Remember if the mill has around 800 hours on it ask the owner if they have change the electric motor brushes. It's recomended to change them every 800-1000 hours. Check around the main bearing. (where the blade drive is.) See if the seals are leaking. This was a major issue on sawmills. Not major if they would keep the proper amount of ATF in the bearing. Check the Up/dwn sprockes. If there are 4 seperate sprocks. check them. those was one of the common things that goes out. I hope this helps.....        Matt  

[Oregon_Sawyer]

I beleive that the Portland branch still gives free training on a used mill.

I have a 96 LT40HDG35 for sale. I want 18,000 for it.  I am getting a newer mill in the next 30 days(finally).  

I know this is more than you were talking about but I have alot of extras with it.

I just had it in for a service in Portland.  Call them they will tell you what the shape is.  The mill has 1850 hrs on it.

I have it listed in the for sale area but I need to update the listing.

I am 30 miles west of Salem Oregon.

[Bibbyman]

Thanks for the update MM.  I don't want to say something not right.  I always felt it was WIN/WIN for WM and the customer.  WM would get to make a good frist impression and most likely,  that mill owner will want to upgrade later on.

[D._Frederick]

My 2 cents worths,
The  engine is the most costly item to replace, to have it rebuilt costs about as much as new.  Check the air cleaner to see if has been serviced. To tell the overall health of the engine, test the compression. It is easy to do: run the engine untel it is hot, screw out the spark plug and screw in the compression gauge, run the starter and read the lbs/.square inch the gauge indicates. For a good engine, it should be above 120. Look at the engine oil for shiny bits of metal, a bad sign.
WM uses lot of dc motors, the commuators(sp) will wear and be pitted. If bad will, require  machining or replacement.
Check the hydruallic cylinders for bent rods and leakage. Check the hoses for cracks and leakage.
Check the band wheel bearings. With the blade off, rotate the wheels and feel for rough spot and for play.

Follow the other posts for overall conditions- Good luck.

[Tom]

That's strange that Wood Mizer no longer does free training. Their attitude and willingness to help new folks was always one of their strongest selling points.   I guess they feel that they are far enough ahead that they can give the other manufacturers a break.

Times and situations change but Wood Mizers attitude toward business and its customers  is something I never thought I would see them give up :-/

I sense a "Consultant" in the woodpile..

idaho04, Keep in mind that the sawmill is mostly steel and can be welded if broken or replaced if worn. That's why there are so many operable "old" mills around.  On the Woodmizer and many other bandmills, the frame is critical in its up/down configuration.  Since the blade is horizontal the frame can be warped to the side and not hurt a thing. It's up/down bending that you need to be concerned about.  Things like deeply pitted tracks or welding beads getting in the way of the wheels of the mill head.  Every time the blade encounters one of the these humps it reflects it in the board.

Don't be afraid of an old or worn mill if it has been maintained.  The rest of it is just parts and you will be replacing them as you use the mill anyway. Bent stuff and high price aren't good.

One place to spend some time examining is the blade guide assembly.  They need to be tight and true.  If they aren't then the previous owner isn't cutting very true lumber.  Still, this is something that you can fix.

[solidwoods]

I don't think I saw it mentioned, Or maybe everyone knows about it?
https://sawmill-exchange.com/

Used mills/mill equip
Find other millers in your area, and visit and make contact.  Mills trade/buy logs, lumber, cants, and customers
JIM

[idaho04]

Looks like a good mill, Loren, but out of my range. One could spend fortune on a mill.

Thanks everyone for good information.

I was a little worried about the cantilever head on an older mill. Timberking seem to brag about the advantage of four post design, no sagging they say. But nobody mentioned it so I guess I should not worry.

Gas engine is something I can handle. I have been rebuilding some car engines in the past. I would consider to use 15HP electric motor if the gas engine on the mill was gone.

[Tom]

that '92 LT40 is built to handle a 24 horse.  Onan was the original engine and if it were me, I wouldn't settle for less than 24 horses.  Hmmmm  unless money got in the way.

Sagging Cantilever?   No problem.  Woodmizer has put an adjustment screw on every part of their sawmill.  Many I've never had to use but they are there if I ever need them.

Timberking's 4 post is a steady frame but on the flip side, cantilever isn't inherently unsteady.  

[Minnesota_boy]

I just sawed a pair of 2"x24" pieces for a tabletop (2 piece, bookmatched) and I'd bet there wasn't a 32nd of an inch difference from side to side, and my mill has almost a million bd-ft through it.  i wouldn't worry much about a used mill.

[MM]

Wood-Mizer may listen to what people say about the trianing thing. I think they are looking at the man hours worked vs. the income. Bottom line is $$$. When I was there I didn't think it was a good idea. but, I was an hourly employee!!! "Consultant" who would that be? If any one need advice. I'll type away,Arky and bibb.and other owners will too. I used WW some. But the FF is the, in my mind, the best thing that happened for the little guy.  Just need to say Thanks FF....... Matt