log moving woes

Fla._Deadheader · July 15, 2003, 05:00:55 AM

Larry, I have a 20" forge that I built and it will get the steel red for , well, 20". Each tong is 4' long. We used 2 torches and got the steel bent to the correct shape. It was difficult to find something large enough to quench the whole thing, so, we used 2 garden hoses. I figgered it would not work, and, I was right. It is soft enough that when we hook a log, and start pulling, the tongs will straighten from the X to the tips, as I keep pulling. There is no way to know what is happening underwater. This is, however, a VERY hard pull. It wouldn't take much to get it where I need it to be.

Minnesota_boy · July 15, 2003, 05:30:09 AM

Deadheader,
That cold rolled steel is too low in carbon to heat treat. You could add carbon, but it wouldn't diffuse deep enough to doo much good except to make the outside harder (case hardened) adding more material at the stress points by welding extra material there would help, but would add weight and maybe make it too unweildy for your use. You really need a steel that is make to heat treat like 4140 or 4340, but you still need a way to heat it, quench it, then temper it and the tongs are a bit big for your setup, and there is always the danger that the tongs would crack on quench. You could go to an induction hardening process. It should only cost about $400,000 to set yourself up to harden those tongs, :D

Fla._Deadheader · July 15, 2003, 03:35:01 PM

:

OR, I could buy a set for $110.00. Just trying to get some bills outta the way, first.
NOW, the guy I had to do my hauling, just sold his girlfriends boat and they took off till the end of August !!!!!!!
Looks like I gotta get a truck to haul with.

:

Anybody wanna be a partner ???:

:

My son just sold some air dried Pine for $4.00 bdft. ;D

DanG · July 15, 2003, 03:52:05 PM

Hey Harold! I ain't never pulled no logs off the bottom, but I'm lazy and that makes me think up easy ways to do stuff. I'm also cheap, which makes me think up ways to do stuff without spending money.
Having qualified myself, thusly, here's my idea, which you may or may not have already tried. Why not build a rig that works just like a cant hook, or modify a cant hook that you could lower onto the log with your winch. Ed could shift it into position, then skedaddle out of the way, and you could exert a perpendicular pull with the boat, using the leverage of the extended and reinforced handle to roll the log out of the mud. I don't know if it would work at all, and it surely wouldn't work on every log, but it may be worth thinkin' about. :P

biziedizie · July 15, 2003, 04:01:35 PM

  DanG I think you should be Harolds new partner 8) You can sit around and think of new ideas to get things to work better and Harold can do all the hard work :D Just think at the end of the month all the profits could be split 50/50 ;D
  Oh yeah one more thing do you got a truck??? Harold needs a truck real bad ;)

   Steve

Fla._Deadheader · July 15, 2003, 04:49:36 PM

Steve, Ole Dang's quite the rigger. The only thing that might stop Dang's idea from workin, is, the sapwood is REALLY soft from the water. It tears out from the smaller tongs all the time. The way to use the tongs is to get them as near completely around the log as possible.
The Cypress is pretty hard, and won't USUALLY tear out, but, ya gotta remember, these logs can be 60 feet long, buried up to 8' deep on one end.

We already have several we can't get to bubble, YET! ;D ;D ;D
DanG DOES have a truck that would work, IF he put a big ball in the bed! :D :D :D :D :D

D._Frederick · July 15, 2003, 09:49:23 PM

Fla.-,
How deep are the logs that you are having trouble with? On PBS, they showed divers moving very big rocks with parachutes. They took thier tanks and filled the chute with air until they had enough lift. Suppose that you would need 20 ft of water and not much current to make this method work.

Fla._Deadheader · July 16, 2003, 04:37:00 AM

I think you answered yer own question, "D". The sand is really fine and packs really tight. Go in the water sometime, guys, and see how well you can dig. Wear all the gear you can put on and use a short handle (20") shovel. In 5 minutes, you will be gasping for air. Working in the water is TOUGH

;D

Kevin · July 16, 2003, 05:38:10 AM

Guaranteed to make your logs bubble ...

http://www.jwautomarine.co.uk/prbags.htm

DanG · July 16, 2003, 08:01:40 AM

Harold! I suppose it's just old age and failing eyesight that caused you to overlook the gooseneck ball in my truck. :D :D
Can we haul on weekends? Can't get time off from work till first week of August, but I can get a week then.

dail_h · July 16, 2003, 06:26:20 PM

DH,
Can't you jet around them logs to loosen'em up some?A want add on some of the equipment sites might tupn up some big yong

Fla._Deadheader · July 16, 2003, 06:47:29 PM

Dail, can't legally use anything to dig with but yer hands. :

:

Dang, weekends there is nobody at the mill to unload the trailer. To haul lumber, ya gotta drive to Vero Beach. Can't make it in 1 day and back, unless ya stay over 1 night at the camp ???

DanG · July 16, 2003, 09:15:57 PM

OK, Harold. How many loads could you have ready for hauling to Vero by the first week of August? I can be off that week.

Fla._Deadheader · July 17, 2003, 03:49:15 AM

How many loads??? ??? ??? We are only 2 guys in a boat and can't see. It may take us 2 weeks to FIND a load, much less saw it. :

:

Appreciate the offer, but, can't be definite on anything

Heading to the river in 20 minutes. Will post back on Monday or Tuesday.

shopteacher · July 17, 2003, 04:58:25 AM

Two blind guys in a boat. Now that conjures up some interesting visions :

Fla._Deadheader · July 19, 2003, 08:06:21 PM

Wait till tomorrow. I got some pics AND a story. Got some wood to post pics of and need input, also.

lamar · September 02, 2003, 10:21:17 AM

deadheader hey' I finaly found out how to locate a post I couldnt rember where I left it like tools and such ??? All you have to do is look under your own name,duh. When I ask a question or give my comentary

and never come back is that considered bad? ;D To get to the meat I have some loader tongs that I cobbled up 10yrs. ago and bust bent welded added many things to them to beef them up.You might be able to weld some torsion bars in just the right place to get the tensile strength you need and there free off an old car.I had some on my loader but they were to brittle.

Fla._Deadheader · September 02, 2003, 04:17:36 PM

   Hi Lamar. When asking a question, it never hurts to leave a "thanks" after ya get some input. ;D
   If I could find a couple of late 40's Fords, I could get the solid driveshafts and use them. Had a shaft once, and, some guy stole it. I have a smaller, Blacksmith made set, that were made from car axles, probably "T" model.
   I thought Torsion bars were actually high tensile tubing???

lamar · September 02, 2003, 09:14:13 PM

deadheader I should of said stabalizer bars.solid steel. I pulled a lot of tranys out of those pre 49 fords.those shafts are hard to find.Used to make ecetelene ???cannons out of the shaft tubes. we could lobb avocacatos 1/4 mile. ;D You probably dont need them to long so theres lots of high tensile parts in most parts cars.

isawlogs · September 02, 2003, 10:30:06 PM

Just a thought here ...Did you think of using the rear axles off of a 3/4 ton truck to make your tongs with ???
I made a spear for the front end loader to pick up the round bales of hay... Like I sead just a thought...

Frank_Pender · September 02, 2003, 10:41:20 PM

Marcel, that is what I use for maul handles is a 3/4 ton pickup axel. 8)

Fla._Deadheader · September 03, 2003, 06:28:33 AM

Thanks guys. I think, when I made the first set, I used 44" long pieces of 1" steel. Axles are too short to make the big tongs.
The salvage yards around here don't have old car parts anymore. Taxes are getting so high, they keep the latest model stuff, so they can turn parts rapidly and get more.