sawmill Smarts

[Rancher]

I was going through a few things I have saved that were of interest to me and thought I might share this here. I believe this was on a Yahoo forum over a year ago.

Listen to your saw mill, it will reveal things to you; not just about yourself, but the social and economic problems of the USA , if you let it talk. We have all heard, if walls could only talk, my saw mill talks, if I allow it to; throught a medium.
Yesterday evening, my 16 year old grand daughter , one of the apples of her papas eyes, was consolidating gass into one container, and fueling and oiling my saw for me, so I could cut up a log this morning. And we where chatting about me cutting when the school bus comes in the morning. What do the kids say, I asked. Well there are those that worry, what if he comes after us with that saw. The bus turns around with in 20 feet of my mill, so they all have a good view.
Then she informs me , some of the aggies want to do this sort of thing , meaning cut lumber with a saw mill. What is an aggie? I ask . She informs me an aggie is a dumbie, that takes welding, tree farming, building cattle guards, that sort of stuff. What do you mean dumbie? I ask. A dumbie is a perso9n who can barely past english, reading, spelling, that sort of stuff, so they take ag classes; she informs me.
To say I am shocked by this would be putting it mildly, especialy since she is taking ag welding this year; althought she takes college courses during the summer, when school is out. I explain to her that this country is on such an education kick, that is out of line and it is destroying us, sending good jobs overseas . We may have kids graduate H/S that can be computer programers, and all kinds of office workers, but we do not have trades people graduate any more. Nor do the ones that graduate with top scholistic skills, have the ability to become tradesmen. Indeed, many of the people who complain about illegal aliens can not /do not have the basic skills or education to do the job an illeggal alien does; but they complain.
I tell her, I was a dumbie, did not graduate H/S, which she already knew. Then I flew in military jets as a crew member, drove some of the most alsum , heavest trucks run in America, built my own house with a chain saw, asking; how many peopple do you know with degrees, smart people who have done, can do the things this dumbie has done. Of course I am the only one.
But I try to explain to her, that we desperately need classes back in our schools, that encourge children to become trades people, trademen make products that create an economy, with out them we have no goods, no houses, no food,clothes or the thousands of other things we use in our daily lives. So we need the aggie, the carpenter and automotive courses back in our schools. These kids would be as important to our society, as those that get a degree in ocean farming or space exploration in college, I tell her.
I know she did not mean dumbie in a bad way, I have raised her not to be that way. But children and young adults mimic , copy kat, what they hear older people say. To me that means some adult parent, or school personl at some point referred to a child as a dumbie, becauese they had a problem with adjectives or pronouns. Are they so vain they do not realize what it takes, the skills, the education to develope those skills, for them to live the lives they live ? I hope my grand daugghter and her generation, grow up smarter than many in my generation where; on what it takes to make society prosper . One that will not tople when it becomes too top heavy, like ours has come so close to doing.
Of course my saw mill is only one of the many resourses that talks to me, or instigates conversation with the very young, so that we may learn what is truely going on in their minds. If you have a mill let it instigate conversation with your children and grand children. I assure you it works, and the by product can be worth much more in the long run than the value of a board. Bill C

If I am out of line taking this from another forum I am sorry. We are all in this together and hopefully not just for ourselves.

Dave


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[fishpharmer]

Rancher, Good post with some great points.  Thanks for sharing.

How's the ranching bidness going?

[Rancher]

Ranching, like most other things, has it's ups and downs. Most ranchers will agree on one thing...they'll keep going till they run out of money.
Really, the grass is good this year, hope the prices will be just as good.
There's always boards to make and firewood to sell.

Dave   

[Piston]

The most successful, caring, do-anything-for-anyone, hardest working, most-willing-to-help-when-your-broke-down-on-the-side-of-the-road-at-midnight-in-the-cold-rain person I know never went to college. 
Just because I went to college doesn't mean I'm smart or good at doing things, just look at some of my projects  :D :D

Thanks for sharing, you have some really good points.

[rph816]

I agree wholeheartedly.  I was a shop junkie in high school, did go on to college, then graduate school and now have an office job, but I still saw on the weekends, build my own furniture, flooring and cabinets for the house.  Worked construction all through high school and college and met some of the best people (aggies, dumbies, whatever) salt of the earth folk, good people.  I agree that America is really pushing some parts of education too hard.  Education is always good, but it doesn't necessarily have to be english or music or philosophy or computers, it can be welding, plumbing, woodworking, auto-body, all of those are just as important.  I hope that your daughter follows her own path (I've got one of my own, not quite school age yet) and does what she enjoys.  If that's becoming a doctor, great, if that's taking over the sawmill, great.  America was built by people of all types and we need to keep it that way.

Ryan

[paul case]

thanks rancher,
i always thought that dumbie was another name for football linemen. glad i got that straight. now i know i am who the jokes were about. just funnin ya

you are correct though. too many educators think that everyone who goes to school and colllege will get a desk job that pays good and never get their hands dirty. thats a bad way to get started thinking for a teenager or a country in general. the nicest things we enjoy in this country, cost a lot of hard work, sweat and even some peoples lives. we should do what we can to help preserve our freedoms by working to keep our country working for our good not just some importers profit.  pc

[brdmkr]

One of the chief mistakes that society makes is assuming that more formal education equates to more intelligence.  Some of the most intelligent people I know have PhDs and others didn't get through high school.  There are plenty all in between as well.   

[Sprucegum]

Read on a machinists' forum;

"Dad, what do machinists do?"

"Look out the window son and see the the sky, the grass, the trees; they were made by God. Everything else you see was made by a machinist."

He may have stretched it a bit but I see his point.  ;D

[Qweaver]

. Nor do the ones that graduate with top scholistic skills, have the ability to become tradesmen. Indeed, many of the people who complain about illegal aliens can not /do not have the basic skills or education to do the job an illeggal alien does; but they complain.
.
But I try to explain to her, that we desperately need classes back in our schools, that encourge children to become trades people, trademen make products that create an economy, with out them we have no goods, no houses, no food,clothes or the thousands of other things we use in our daily lives.

Well, I just have to respectfully disagree.

I'm a college grad that taught vocational welding, woodworking, metal working and drafting.  Our school also had vocational classes to train machinist, mechanics, body men, carpenters and office workers.  Most high schools now offer these courses.  All of our vocational teachers had to work at least three years in the trades to qualify to teach.  I was certified to weld almost any metal you can name during my three years at Circleville Metal Works.  I worked most summers as a welder making code welds for the refineries in south Texas.  Most of my fellow vocational teachers do the same in their trades.  
One of my best friends taught calculus and physics and he also operated a marine maintenance business on the side and is highly skilled at trouble shooting and rebuilding anything on a boat including engines.  Another of my friends is an engineer that has designed and is building an eighty foot sailing catamaran...not having it build...but building it himself.  So be careful about putting labels on college grads.  On the other hand, the foreman that I worked for at Circleville had a 9th grade education and is one of the smartest men I have ever worked for.  So I don't pass judgment on anyone...with or without a degree.  BTW. Any of my students that could pass a 6G pipe welding test was always able to find work straight out of high school.

[Magicman]

In HS, I took three years of aggie (shop).  One reason was because we got 1½ credits per year so I didn't have to take other stuff.  I grew up on a farm, so I absolutely knew that I wanted out of that business.  Electronics and communication was my game, so a career in that industry was in order.

Well, I'm now retired, and I certainly did not want to "contract back" into telecommunication.

Guess what.  I now own a tree farm, portable sawmill, and use those "dumbie aggie" skills every day.  Thank you for "Shop (dumbie aggie) Teachers.   

[Ron Wenrich]

Ever listen to those two mechanics on Cartalk on NPR?  Both of those guys are MIT grads. 

[jdtuttle]

So we need the aggie, the carpenter and automotive courses back in our schools. These kids would be as important to our society, as those that get a degree in ocean farming or space exploration in college, I tell her.

Well said Rancher & I agree. I have been a school board member for the past 12 years. It's a small District but we have a better shop than our neighboring larger Districts. The kids built a go-kart this year & coordinated with the physics dept. to obtain data on test runs. They had sensors on the tires for temp. change, monitored the weather & collected all sorts of data. I didn't see one dummie there. Even the young ladies were involved.
jim

[Dan_Shade]

 BTW. Any of my students that could pass a 6G pipe welding test was always able to find work straight out of high school.

I really don't know what a 6G pipe weld is, but I'm going to guess that it's tough to do it, and takes practice.  Practice and perseverance are the main ingredients to success.  You have to practice, identify shortcomings, and persevere to overcome the shortcomings.

I really believe that "successful" people all have some similar traits in regards to personal motivation.  Education is never a bad thing.  I think those that cry the sky is falling about our trades going away are being a bit short sighted.  If we really have a need for these trades, those folks that know how to do them will be able to charge a premium for their services.

I took shop classes, then went to school to become an engineer.  I wouldn't change any of that.

[redbeard]

Hello Rancher, I being a college drop out in the early 80s went to work in the construction trades all my life, sometimes i catch my self saying i wished i would have stayed in school and got a degree and i wouldn't have to work so hard. Well it dosen't matter what your title,degree or job is if you don't work hard your not going to succeed in life. besides we need bankers and engineers so guys like me can make a living and especially farmers so i can eat. My hats off to all those who work hard at making a living.

[tyb525]

I think the idea isn't so much that we should eliminate higher education, but that kids should know how to work hard. If they want to stay in a trade, that's great! If they want to go on, get a degree or PHD, and be a rocket scientist or whatever, thats great too. They just need to know what it means to work hard for the things that they want and need.

[Okrafarmer]

The best education is self-education, with exams administered by your peers and circumstances, and especially by your spouse and children. And the most important part of self-education is listening and being willing to change your mind when it's wise to do so.

[Banjo picker]

I am not saying all but at least some "educated " people look with disdain or at least worry about those of us that haven't been "properly" educated.  I have a very good friend , maybe my best friend...that spoke to me about my sons not going to college.  He is a retired prof...(economics no less)....I told him I had only went to college for 6 months before I quit and got married, and I have done alright...He told me Yes but you were the exception to the rule....My lean on this is there is no shame in a calloused hand...The boys are doing ok as well one is 28 the other is 24 both have their own home and owe nothing for it.......I guess if they had went to college they would be getting out about now...I wonder if they could find a job....If you like it go to school....I spent 12 1/2 years there and I didn't like very much of it...The aggie part was the best...Tim

[paul case]

..The aggie part was the best...Tim

i agree tim, doing what you love is the best. for me that was vo ag, ind arts, and baseball. not that i was good at any of it . i just liked doin it.pc