A way to remove stuck countersunk hex (allen) head bolts from Lucas 618 Sawmill

[sigidi]

TJ, dunno if the info is 100% transferable from a Lucas to your machine, but when I do up the blade bolts I usually have my cordless drill and swiss army pocket knife, I use the corkscrew in the head to clear out all the built up sawdust, before goin anywhere near it with the allen keys. When I do the bolts up, my cordles has 24 torque settings on it so I dial the torque to 14 out of the 24 and I use the 2nd gear in the gearbox (not the high torque first gear) over the 10 years of Lucas milling I havent had a bolt come out when done up this way

[tjhammer]

sigidi I always like you clean out the allen head and when installing I tighten the bolts down sugg to squeeze out the never seeze and then retighten with a 3/8 ratchet,when I first started sawing that spinning blade scared the bejesus out me, I mite have tighten them a little to tight but now I just snug them, maybe a little tighter than snug
tj

[Ianab]

I only even tighten them with a pocket hex wrench, snug them down well, but not really leaning on them. The lock nut on the back is your insurance against them working loose. You can snug that down properly with a ring spanner, and it will come loose the same way.

Ditto on the copper anti-seize of whatever flavour you can buy locally.

Ian

[LeeB]

ring spanner = box end wrench.

[fstedy]

Sometimes whatever you do you will get stuck screws or bolts. You can drill it out to the minor diameter of the screw with a left hand dril bitl. Works like a charm. The heat from drilling and removing most of the metal from the screw body releives the tension and when the drill starts to break thru it just  winds it right out. If its hardened material drill almost thru with carbide then finish with high speed left hand drill.

[bandmiller2]

I don't own a swinger,but have had simular problems with the countersunk bolts holding on hay baler knives.I don't think its the threads but rather the tapered head causing the problems.The big thing is not rounding out the hex.A flat punch and a sharp hammer rap to the head,very quick heat to the head,but not enough to soften it.Fully engauged good hex wrench if that won't do it your scrawed [past tense for screwed].I am surprised never seeze doesn't help much.Possibly try paste wax,and clean the threads with the propper tap before installation. Frank C.

[Al_Smith]

The very best anti galling stuff I've ever used was a product called "lead pate " but I'd imagine it's no longer available because of the lead content .

There are different grades of Never Seeze plus Lubriplate makes several products .

You can probabley gain more "purchase " with a Torx head flat head screw than with a socket head .The problem with a socket head as per size of bolt is they are always one wrench size down from a standard Allen head cap screw .

Whatever design of the fastener you'll do a lot better if you take the time to make certain the hole is free of all debres that would prevent you from getting the tool in full depth  and use a tool with good crisp edges weather allen head or Torx .Good grade too none of of those Chinese two dollar a dozen specials .Hollow Chrome a divison of Allen probabley makes one of the better grades of socket head wrenchs .

Another good plan which few seldom do with fasteners that have tendency to gall up is simpley replace them with new ones .Might cost a buck or two but the frustration it relieves is more than worth it .

[KnotBB]

Been there done, something (slightly) different.

Most every thing has been covered.

Make sure the allen holes are clean before you start to be able seat the allen wrench all the way.

Don't over tighten.  The length of the factory allen wrench can provide plenty of torque without an extension. Too much as a matter of fact.  You're trying to seat the taper, not clamp the saw blade.  Make sure the hub and blade contact area are clean before assembly.  If you spin the allen wrench figure on replacing the screw (and it is a screw not a bolt!)

Anti seize grease grease on threads and taper of the screw. (It's in the book). Just like that used on O2 sensors.

Use a hand impact screw driver on really tight ones.  They work wonders for tight screws http://www.harborfreight.com/impact-screwdriver-set-with-case-37530.html  and a metric allen socket from NAPA or your favorite tool.  supplier that fits the driver, 3/8"?

The driver works two ways.  It gives a "shock" to the screw which all by it's self can loosen it and provides just a little twist at the time of impact and can't pop out and round the threads. 

[logboy]

While I was gone on a deployment for a couple years the blade on my 827 rusted to the head. Had to heat it up to get the bolts out. The blade had to be sent in for hammering because it wobbled afterwards. I give the head an ample coating of anti-seize between blade changes now.

[fishpharmer]

Heating a perfectly fine blade was a concern of mine.  Haven't reinstalled it yet, mill's now in slabber mode.

I appreciate all the input.

[moth222]

 

  I owned a Lucas mill many years ago and sold it due to lack of time. I have recently borrowed one from a neighbour (he recently bought it second hand). The person he bought it off had kept it outdoors for some time and I was unable to remove two of the blade bolts. I searched for and found this forum, looking for help, and now joined up. I tried all advice and could not move the bolts. Eventually, I drilled 4 holes into the head of each bolt (enough to position a punch without slipping) and hit the punch to move the bolt counter clockwise. Success

[schmism]

Here's what always gets me.    If your going to go the weld a nut on method (a fine method for stuck countersunk fasteners)  might as well save the hastle of the welder and try heat first.   After all, you got the nut red hot (hot enough to melt the surface metal eg weld)  so ....

was it the heat from the weld,  or the the ability to put a proper wrench on it that got the screw out?

I often find that after the welding on of a nut or bolt, the torque required to remove the fastener is half or less what i was innitally putting on it to start with.  (leading to the idea that it was the heat of the weld that did you more a favor than having the new bolt head)

[beenthere]

moth222
Welcome to the Forestry Forum. 
Wish that was a clear pic of your job.

Once watched a guy strip a motor block of all studs and bolts getting it ready to put in a steam cleaner. He went quickly around the block with a torch heating the bolts or studs and then touched a candle to them (partly to cool I suspect and the melted candle wax sucked down into the threads). He just had a pair of vicegrips and turned everything out with no appreciable effort at all. Was amazing to watch.

But another good use of the BlueCreeper.. too bad everyone doesn't have their own bottle to save a lot of grief.

[Chuck White]

Welcome to the Forestry Forum, moth222.

[Gasawyer]

Never seez works wonderful after you get the bolts out the first time. Had to take 618 blade off after 3yrs of use and was never a problem to loosen bolts. The mill was being used to put saw marks in finished wood that is why long run time without removal.

[Seaman]

I use a 5mm socket and ratchet, rather than Allen wrench, seems a lot easier to work with.
I also do not overtighten bolts, but snug nuts pretty good. All good answers on here, I tend to change back and forth between slabber and blade that nothing has time to rust ! :D
Also, go ahead and keep a new set of hardware in your yellow box ALL the time ! ;)

Frank