Gonna build a swing mill!

[woodbowl]

I also came up with the idea of using a belt (or 2) to go from the first powered shaft to the other on a two blade saw with a 1/4 twist on it with 4 idler pullies (one spring loaded on the slack side to keep the belt tight) to the second shaft.

Any one out there ever heard or seen a belt used like this or is it not a good idea?

Go for it Hilltop. There are lots of time proven applications that use belt twist. Belts are reliable and reasonable in price. Adjustable tension also turns and ordanary belt drive into a clutch if needed. I've been thinking about this for years and  I am very  surprised that someone has not already built a twist/untwist configuration to "swing the blade" on a swingmill, thus eliminating the gearbox.

Oh, welcome to the forum.  ;)

[okie]

I also came up with the idea of using a belt (or 2) to go from the first powered shaft to the other on a two blade saw with a 1/4 twist on it with 4 idler pullies (one spring loaded on the slack side to keep the belt tight) to the second shaft.

Any one out there ever heard or seen a belt used like this or is it not a good idea?

Go for it Hilltop. There are lots of time proven applications that use belt twist. Belts are reliable and reasonable in price. Adjustable tension also turns and ordanary belt drive into a clutch if needed. I've been thinking about this for years and  I am very  surprised that someone has not already built a twist/untwist configuration to "swing the blade" on a swingmill, thus eliminating the gearbox.

Oh, welcome to the forum.  ;)

I'm thinking that the twist would work if stationary, but I think the swing would throw the belt. Just my $.02 and I aint no belt twist expert :D.
Tinman, you need some rest from real work so you can finish that mill ;D. this is the first mill build that I've been able to read about from the get go and I'm excited about the outcome 8).

[Firebass]

Seems to me all my projects I've ever made have dwell times before I manage to complete them.  I've found that when you get burnt out or don't have much time to dedicate toward your project it helps to find one little thing that dosent demand too much time that you can do.  With some type of goal,  try to complete small projects even if they only take 5 minutes and soon you'll soon find  a new motivation because you can see light at the end of the tunnel.  Most people under estimate the number of pieces and mechanical components it takes to manufacture a piece of equipment. All at once they can be overwhelming.  But, IF one has the time and enjoys making things I think a swing mill is a blast to build.

Firebass

[Hilltop366]

Thanks again for all the welcomes and tips.
Using a twist belt on a swing mill would be a little tricky I'm sure.

I have a background in small gas engine repair (25 years) mostly motorcycle & chain-saw with some auto & heavy equipment & welding ........ I know that  gear boxes can rob a lot of power just look at any higher performance bike it's got a chain or a belt, so I was also thinking belt would also be more efficient.

It has been a long winter so I've had more mill ideas. I would like to give you guys another to get some feedback if you don,t  mind. ( you can laugh as loud as you want)

My current problem is my chain-saw mill is slow and awkward so I don't get much lumber cut for the little time i have to use it.
So I came up with two solutions   1: Faster saw like the swing or two blade mill
                     2: A slow mill that cuts by it self once log is set in place

For idea # 2  I was thinking of a electric reciprocating saw with carbide teeth maybe a 5 hp 220v motor on it, once the log was dogged in,  the saw would cut through it return and reset and make next cut until done and then shut off. A person would only take a few minutes to get the log in place, turn it on and go do something else. A this rate if only cutting a log a day I would get 360 more cut than last year. Ya I know you would have to edge them too.

[TinMan]

Hi guys

Just about settled in at our new place. The boss has been pokin at me to get back on the mill ;D. He is now a member on the forum as well. Cant wait for him to post pics of the stuff he is building in the shop. Logging stuff. ;D ;D ;D ;D Might order some steel this week for the mill..... ??? 8) 8)

[Meadows Miller]

Gday

And Welcome to the Forum Hilltop  ;) ;D 8) 8) 8) I know where your coming from mate ive probobly cut over 100 mbft on the first and second Csm's dad and i had from when i was about 13 They are bloody good on the big sections  ;) ;D ;D 8) But as Slow as a Wet week when you get into sawing 2xs  : :(  ;) :D :D Dad had plans to build somthing similar to what your thiking about using 2 x 22" inserts  ??? :P Before We got the First bandmill when i was about 15  ;D 8) 8)
A good one to look up on youtube is Eco Sagan  ;) they are a nice looking little Twin Horizontal circular mill 

The trick with doing wide horizontal cuts with circs is not to let the Rpm drop too much (no more then about 5 to 7%  ;)) as i can do a full 8" cut no worrys with the 20 hp briggs on my lucas in pine you just have to Go Slow  ;) but i usually jus do 2 passes as i find it quicker and easyer pluss you dont have to worry about heating the body of the  the saw up  ;) ;D 8) as i reckon that alot off the sawdust drops out of the gullet before it exits the cut on the wide ones  ;)

Tinman its good to hear you boss is giving you a ribing about getting it finnished Mate  ;) :D :D ;D ;) Anyway whats his user name  ??? and I dont reckon itll be long till uou have it running Mate  ;) ;D 8) 8) 8)

Reguards Chris

[okie]

WELCOME TO THE FORUM HILLTOP[/b]
I may be misunderstanding you but if you intend on using the 16 hp motor on a swing mill or  a double blade dimension mill I think you will be greatly dissappointed. I have a 18 hp on my 6" swing blade and I would love to have 10 more hp on it. Of course I cut all hardwoods, mostly red oak and honey locust so that may be the issue but on the full 6" cut it struggles in the vertical cut and absolutely crawls if I try for 6" in the horizontal, I usually make my 6" horizontal cuts with 2 passes. I would love to lay it into some softer less dense wood and see what it can do. Personally, I think a double blade get up would be easier to make than a swing blade mill. If you opt to try making a swinger, try and find someone that has one and spend some time studying how they work. There aint just a whole lot to mine, but everything has to be just right. There is a double blade mill that sets up alot like a Lucas mill, I beleive its called a Rinu? I posted a video on here when I saw them. As far as power plants and gear boxes, you can find that stuff used at a good price if you look hard enough.
Good luck.
 

Here is a link to the Rimu saw I was referring to.
https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,34378.0.html

[TinMan]

Chris

his user name is rigginrat97526. You will bee seeing pics of his shop built logging toys soon. 8) 8) 8) 8)

Tracy

[Hilltop366]

Okie

Thanks for the link the Rimu is a real nice saw.I also went to their web site lots of great pics there. It would be nice if you could lift the vertical blade out of the way to double cut with the horz. blade for wider lumber. I guess that would be an advantage to a swinger.


Chris

Thanks for all the info I think I seen the Eco Sagan before but  had no luck this time, it could just be me.

[mad murdock]

does anyone have a single source or web blog that shows how they built their mill?  I too want to build a swing blade mill.  I have some big douglas fir on my place that Ai want to be able to mill, one tree is about 220 ft tall and 7+ ft in diameter at breast height.  Plus i have alot of smaller stuff to mess with.  I have a granberg mill set up for my chain saw, it cuts nice boards, but is painfully slow.  there are some good pictures on this post, thanks to all who have given input on this subject!!
Maybe we can figure out some way to get this country out of the mess we are in by the grass roots efforts of the common folk in developing real goods and manufacturing abilities on a local scale.  Kind of how this country was made great in the first place!

[Chico]

Hilltop you can always use jack shafts instead of gerboxes saves weigt and movinparts in so far as the belts a lot of line shaft mills twisted the flat belts back in the day to make them do what they wanted them to
Chico

[Hilltop366]

 Chico I think we are on the same train there. I'm still looking for a engine, something with lots of torque thinking 4 cyl diesel like VW jetta or an Isuzu from a small GM truck.

Once I get an engine I can start the layout an figure out what parts I need to order like: bearings, shafts and pulleys etc.

Another idea I'm thinking of is a way to raise the vertical blade up out of the way to do double cuts on a cant to get wider lumber (this seem to be the major complaint of the two blade or swing saws).

Hilltop

[bandmiller2]

Electric motors can be heavy to rotate but an arbor mounted right on the shaft would eliminate alot of rigging, 3 phase more the better.Find its pivot point.A three point 3 phase PTO driven gen.would be handy not only for milling but to run heavy duty plainers jointers est.Only throwing ideas out there.Frank C.

[DanG]

Hilltop, the Mobile Dimension Saw uses v-belts with quarter twist to run the edger blades.  The main blade runs off of 6 belts directly from the engine, and the main blade's shaft doubles as a jack shaft to run the edgers via another 6 belts.  This system works extremely well, so you might want to borrow some ideas from it.

I'm fairly familiar with both the Lucas and Peterson mills, and have been wondering about something.  In order to double cut with the Peterson, you have to take the blade guard off.  The guard on the Lucas can't be removed, so you cannot double cut without turning the saw head around.  What I wonder is, why not make the guard movable, so you could just swing it to the other side for double cutting? :P

[bandmiller2]

Dan,I've wondered about that too its probibly liability in case someone left it in the wrong position.I'am sure it could be failsafed but that would complicate a simple mill and drive up the price.Liability is real and costly and gives night sweats to those who build sawmills.

[Meadows Miller]

Gday

I reckon thats the main reason also with the lucas the motors mounted low in the frame so double cutting is imposible after about 2" even after abit of workshop trickery on the guards  ;) :D Probobly to stop ppl trying  ;) Ive only herd of acouple of accidents with swingers usually through stupididty in modifying somthing or the other being A Idiot and not bolting the stops in when using the std tracks  : ::)Some Mothers Do Ave Em and you cant Idiot Proof Anything  ;) :D :D :D

Reguards Chris

[Hilltop366]

Where is the TinMan I have been waiting to see how his mill is coming along.

Anyone know?

[Meadows Miller]

Gday

Hilltop Its been about two months hopefully Tinmans just been a little buisy Mate  ;) I know time can get away from you real quick  : ;) :D :D

Reguards Chris