Increased Heart Size

[wiswannabe]

I need some advice.  I am having 80 acres of hardwoods logged and the person grading and scaling the maple logs made the following statement; "We are not getting a lot of veneer logs.  the heart can not be more than 25% of the log.  at the base it looks real good but when we cut up 100" the heart is to big".  I can't say I have heard or seen the heart size increasing higher up on the tree.  I'd appreciate if y'all share some of your advice.  Thanks in advance
wiswannbe

[beenthere]

Are you seeing what the grader is seeing, as well? How much greater is the size of the heart at the height he is talking about?  

Now, would that be less than 10" diam of heart on a 20" diam log (small end) to be under 25%?

[wiswannabe]

I have not been there to see what he is seeing, we are going to meet this weekend so I can see what he is talking about.
The grader is saying that the heart is at or less than 25% at the base but over that at 100" or higher.
You bring up a good question about the 25% calculation - any suggestions on how to make that calculation?  I am confussed (nothing new :D) but am ready to listen to questions or suggestions that I should be asking the grader. thanks beenthere - wiswannabe

[beenthere]

Better to see it and have the grader show you what he is talking about. Sometimes graders involved in buying logs can come up with some interesting 'reasons' why your logs are not as good as these same logs will be when the same person sells them to the 'veneer' mill. Admittedly, not all of the grader/buyers are crooked, and some are just trying to make the spread (profit) as much as possible.
I recall my uncle finding out that his walnut timber wasn't going to be worth much because most all the logs were coming from female trees. The reason turned out to be one that would make the squirrels very hungry, with nothing to bury for winter.  :  

[Minnesota_boy]

I'm a dummy on this one, but if the logs had a lot of taper, wouldn't the heart end up being a higher pecentage of the log at 100"? ???

[Texas Ranger]

Unless I missed something in the past 40 years, the heart will be at the same annual ring the length of the tree, untill the new growth exceeds the old growth.  Exception, where limbs carry the heart out.  

Find another scaler.

[Ron Scott]

Black heart and mineral stain is admitted in hard maple logs when not in excess of 1/2 the scaling diameter, dib small end, logs 8 feet and over.

Have the scaler show you how and what specs he is using to arrive at his veneer grade for various defects etc. Sounds like you may be getting a tight scale. You may want to have other buyers bid on your logs for the best price offered.

[Ron Wenrich]

You say it is being logged, but you didn't say how you are being paid.  Is it being cut on shares?  (So much for the landowner, so much for the logger).

If you were paid a lump sum, then the veneer wouldn't really mean much to you.  

I believe the 25% goes on the dib on the small end.  That would mean that a 16" log would allow 4" of heart.  Have the scaler explain that to you.  

I agree with Don on the heartwood not jumping growth rings.  It could be that the butts have more flare and a little more sapwood due to wider rings at the butt.

[SwampDonkey]

Prime Special sugar maple and yellow birch veneer purchased by Columbia Forest Products, Presque' Ilse Maine. They send the log buyer on site to scale and educate you on their specs and how to cut the pieces for the biggest bucks. They also send their own truckers to pickup your wood road side or they will pay your trucking costs if you haul your own



Small heart diameter in sugar maple brings the big bucks at most mills, since its harder to find. The better price is the birches at Columbia though In my area, maple with diameters above 40 inches or there abouts is starting to mineralize in the heart, since they are 140 + years of age (assuming they are grown in stand conditions). Find some nice bird's eye figures with wood rays to the pith and you better bring them home from the woods at night


Some of these pumpkins yield all pink wood in my region, when peeled they make plywood with the 'flaming birch' pattern. Heartwood in birch can be a greater percentage as long as it is sound.

specs on special prime veneer:

Length 8'9", 9'5", 10'5", 11'5", top diam 12" +, 1/3 heart, straight, no defects.

Our local Forest Products Marketing Board

http://www.cvwpa.ca/search-results-by-mill.asp?MillID=8

regards