On becoming a "Forester"

[Engineer]

A little background.  I have a degree in Civil Engineering, which has nothing to do whatsoever with forestry, other than most civils can identify a tree (as opposed to, say, a utility pole or a fence post).  I do have a lifetime background in the woods, thanks to my dad, a land surveyor for forty years.  I can identify almost any tree in the Northeast US on sight even in winter, and I am about to get my license as a land surveyor as well.  I'm also in the process of converting a 12 acre parcel of my own land into a managed tree farm, trying to get a nice stand of white pine for future harvest.

  I have a full hands-on approach right now, taking trees from stump to finished product through selective logging, milling, drying, and storage of lumber.  I also cut a dozen cord of firewood annually.  The more time I spend in the woods, the more I see forestry as a viable addition to a land surveying and engineering office. I like being out in the woods, walking through the forest any time of the year, and looking at trees.  I'm comfortable in knowing I can answer basic questions about general topics.  I know there's a lot more to forestry than just "looking at trees", though.

I think what I'm asking is, what dos it take to legitimately offer forestry as a service to the general public?  I know several land surveyors who advertise as both surveyors and foresters, and I know that most forestry programs offer rudimentary land surveying classes as part of the curriculum.  I'd like to know if all foresters have college degrees, if there is a licensing program and how to obtain said license (are they state-offered or private?) and what I would need to do to get there.  :P  I'd like to be able to offer basic services and be able to prove I'm legit, not only through licensing, but also knowing what I'm doing and talking about.

Thanks for any help or advice you guys can offer.

Jon E

[Tom]

Jon,
Speaking from a farmers perspective, I would consider a college education in Forestry almost a necessity to provide management advice.  Forestry practices change and so do the markets and politics.  Even a college educated Forester should be concerned about continued education.

I may hire a Forester who had no college education but he would be an old=timer and carry the blessings of his comrades in arms.

As a tree farmer in the South East, I would expect help in things other than tree identification.  I would expect expert advice on rotation, which species to plant, markets, thinning, sales (probably expecting the forester to handle the sale), disease treatment,  BMP's, proper equipment, tax program advice, Government programs and a general feeling that he knew what he was talking about (backed by his membership in certain professional organizations.)

I would also expect him to have my interests at heart and even stop by for a cup of coffee once in a while.

[Ron Scott]

Yes, you should have at least a BS degree in forest management and then at least 5 years field experience to become certified, registered, or licensed, depending upon any legal requirements for such in your state.

See http://www.safnet.org/certifiedforester/cfprogram.cfm#SAF

[Engineer]

Thanks, guys, that cleared things up nicely.  I can't afford to be going back to school for that, so I think I'll stick to my own property and leave the forestry to the guys who are qualified.

[Ron Scott]

You might not take as long as you think if some of your engineering and surveying courses are transferrable.

Engineers and land surveyors seem to be doing better than many foresters here though  ;)

[SwampDonkey]

Up here Land surveys for forestry operations is very busy. We have alot of woolot owners (over 40,000) and a large proportion of them harvest timber annually or sell stumpage. This is about 40% of the forestry land base.  Tresspass is a major issue so lines are always a number one priority for sureyors. I've been to Virginia in Blacksburgh area and I was amazed that properties were indistinguishable and hardly a stick cut. I only found one boundary line and it was marked white, which blended in real good with some of the bark of certain tree species. Didn't take too long to realize that everyone down there had a heat pump and wood burning was just a novelty for hobby farmers or smokin deer meet

[Ron Scott]

I make work for land surveyors here since I "won't touch" any timber until the landowner can show me a registered survey  or obvious and agreed upon property lines with their neighbor.

I tell them that a registered survey is the best "first investment" in their property. They often find that managing "all their" timber up to their surveyed boundary line pays for their timber survey as well as being a deductable cost on the price received for their timber.

[SwampDonkey]

Ron:

Same approach I use, if you've ever read my website under woodlot maintenance or timber inventory. Most owners don't know that this expense can be deducted on their income tax if they have a management plan and are using their woodlot as a business.
Anyone messin up a property line is breaking the law, that also includes anyone making out that they are a surveyor and marking trees as a line. You can only repaint, brush or blaze above existing evidence with the permission of all adjoining owners, otherwise call the surveyor guys.
My lines are always painted every 2 to 3 years. Some states and provinces may have programs available for line surveys, but everyone should take responsibility for their lines and keep them up to date.

cheers

[Ron Scott]

After the registered survey and when doing management plans I always make the point to advise the landowners to permanently mark and "maintain" their property lines. Some will let their surveyed lines "go wild" and then need to find them again in 10-15 years and they again have to hire a surveyer to resurvey the lines that they once paid for.

Of coursr the surveyors like this kind of work.

[SwampDonkey]

Yup Ron. I recommend 3 to 5 years for maintenance of road right-of-way and lines. I can do this service quite cheap for landowners, with a spacing saw. Cover the ground quickly with a spacing saw versus bending over all day on the chainsaw. On the way back out to the truck touch up the line with paint on the old evidence. I don't blaze trees unless its on an existing line marker tree.

cheers

[slowzuki]

Spacing saw = thinning saw?