OWB Generator wiring setup

Logging logginglogging · September 24, 2012, 09:33:22 AM

What do you guys use for a panel / wiring for your outside boilers / other electrical needs when the powergoes out and u need to run a generator?

stumper · September 25, 2012, 08:13:02 AM

My set up is not legal but I have a power inlet wired into the boiler. As I wired in two circuits when I installed my eclassic I feed 220 to the house through this circuit. I throw the main to isolate it from the grid. This powers the key circuits in the house and the boiler.

I have since purchased a tranfer switch and will wire that is when I get the chance but that will require hiring an electrician to pull the meter as it need to be installed between the meter and the main. Unfortunately a 200 amp transfer switch does not come cheap nor does a master electrician, so it will wait for now.

upsnake · September 25, 2012, 10:15:01 AM

Same as stumper.
Ran a line to the edge of my garage, and put the 30 amp generator plug there.
Just have to roll the genny out of the garage, connect it and flip the main breaker, then power my panel.

More or less power the whole panel, and just be careful and monitor what i am running.

We have plans on getting a whole house propane genny, in the next few years, just have to get the funding. (we lose power a lot and need the sump pump to run).

Logging logginglogging · September 25, 2012, 12:00:43 PM

Quote from: stumper on September 25, 2012, 08:13:02 AM
My set up is not legal but I have a power inlet wired into the boiler. As I wired in two circuits when I installed my eclassic I feed 220 to the house through this circuit. I throw the main to isolate it from the grid. This powers the key circuits in the house and the boiler.

I have since purchased a tranfer switch and will wire that is when I get the chance but that will require hiring an electrician to pull the meter as it need to be installed between the meter and the main. Unfortunately a 200 amp transfer switch does not come cheap nor does a master electrician, so it will wait for now.

Yeah, I honestly dont care what leagle...(Thats for the folks that want to be involved with the crasy laws) long as I dont have a fire thats all i care. I will probally just do it the same or do the transfer switch right away. I definatly would like to power the house and the stove on the same generator. I wonder if I can backfeed 110 into the house from the stove intes self and just plug the generator in there.

stumper · September 25, 2012, 02:24:44 PM

I doubt back feeding the house with 110 will work. Generally houses are fed by two 110 or 220 (single phase). Back feeding the house with 110 as you discribed, will only feed one of the 110 circuits not both. Additionally, you will need to be sure that the wire you are back feeding through is of an appropriate size. Pushing 20 amps though a wire designed for 15 will create a potential for a fire. Mine is sized appropriately as I hope to eventually have a shed by the boiler and want to be able to fun a welder there, so I planned on having 50 amps +. Please be aware of what is protected by a fuse or a breaker and what is not. In my case I go through a breaker at the generator which proectes everything from the generator to the box in the house. Every thing in the house has a breaker on its curcuit so it is protected. My boiler has a fuse so it is protected. I understand that the circulator pum is internally protected, so the only thing that is not "protected" is the circulator pump cord. This is very common. Generally if the pump interal protection kicks that solves the issue, but if I were truely fanatical I could install an inline breaker when running on the generator.

WH_Conley · September 25, 2012, 03:14:57 PM

Feeding 110 back to the panel will just make 1/2 of your house, one side of the breaker box , have juice.

upsnake · September 25, 2012, 03:18:15 PM

Log
So you have a 110 line from your house out to your boiler right?

Why not run a 30 (or 50 depending on genny size) amp wire from your panel to a location that is convenient for your genny.
Mine runs from the garage door along the wall in the garage into the basement to the side of the basement to the panel. It was easier to run the wire, rather than dragging the genny from the garge to the other side of the house each time.

Then you power your panel, you can choose whatever circuits your want energized, just pick your owb as one.

Logging logginglogging · September 26, 2012, 10:37:34 AM

Quote from: stumper on September 25, 2012, 02:24:44 PM
I doubt back feeding the house with 110 will work. Generally houses are fed by two 110 or 220 (single phase). Back feeding the house with 110 as you discribed, will only feed one of the 110 circuits not both. Additionally, you will need to be sure that the wire you are back feeding through is of an appropriate size. Pushing 20 amps though a wire designed for 15 will create a potential for a fire. Mine is sized appropriately as I hope to eventually have a shed by the boiler and want to be able to fun a welder there, so I planned on having 50 amps +. Please be aware of what is protected by a fuse or a breaker and what is not. In my case I go through a breaker at the generator which proectes everything from the generator to the box in the house. Every thing in the house has a breaker on its curcuit so it is protected. My boiler has a fuse so it is protected. I understand that the circulator pum is internally protected, so the only thing that is not "protected" is the circulator pump cord. This is very common. Generally if the pump interal protection kicks that solves the issue, but if I were truely fanatical I could install an inline breaker when running on the generator.

I know... I understand this as I wired my entire house and have a good eletrical background. I ran a much heavier guage to my stove so i could back feed if needed. To just a couple circuts (one side) in my house.

Logging logginglogging · September 26, 2012, 10:39:45 AM

Quote from: upsnake on September 25, 2012, 03:18:15 PM
Log
So you have a 110 line from your house out to your boiler right?

Why not run a 30 (or 50 depending on genny size) amp wire from your panel to a location that is convenient for your genny.
Mine runs from the garage door along the wall in the garage into the basement to the side of the basement to the panel. It was easier to run the wire, rather than dragging the genny from the garge to the other side of the house each time.

Then you power your panel, you can choose whatever circuits your want energized, just pick your owb as one.
Yes this is probally what I will do instead of backfeeding. Generator location is tough for me but ill figure it out.

Whitman · September 27, 2012, 05:01:08 PM

the reason it is not legal,backfeed can kill a lineperson who is trying to restore your power.We had it happen one time up by Indy ,he survived by the grace of God.put 120 or240 back thru the pole tramsfomer is multiplyed by60 or7200v.Most insurance dose not cover gross negliance.

sparky1 · September 27, 2012, 05:46:35 PM

the best otion would be put a xfer switch. If you wanna go cheap and safe I would put an outlet in the power unit that is fed from the house power (Normal power). Thn i would put a cord and male plug off the boiler unit. Put this in a convient spot, but protected from the elements. During normal times you would simply plug this into the outlet. When power goes out you unplug it and plug it into the generator. This would only cost around 15 to 20 bucks to do and it would prevent you from putting power back on the grid, and possibly blowing up your generator if someething bad happens.

stumper · September 28, 2012, 08:05:11 AM

A transfer switch is the way to go, but it can be expensive if retrofitting like I am. $500+ for a 200 amp manual switch. 2/0 wire is not cheap and I need to hire a master electrian because we need to pull the meter to do the work. Just to add to that I want to add a 50 amp curcuit to my garage which is where the transfer switch will be and 40 + feet from the main pannel so I will be adding a new panel in the garage. Heck just the burndie's in that size is darn pricy. (sorry for the colorful language).

sparky1 · September 28, 2012, 09:25:34 AM

stumper,
shouldnt utiltiy pull the meter for you? the master electrician shouldnt pull the meter. Utility will have a lock on it, and shouldnt be cut by anyone but the power company. Some areas wont let homeowners pull their own permit, some will. Id check into it if your not sure.

beenthere · September 28, 2012, 04:45:29 PM

In the past, I've pulled the meter.
Just a seal and not a lock.
Let the power company know it needs a new seal. Have never had a big fuss over it.

sparky1 · September 28, 2012, 05:51:21 PM

just be careful pulling the meter. some areas are good about it. some have a real problem with it.

Logging logginglogging · October 01, 2012, 11:05:55 AM

Quote from: beenthere on September 28, 2012, 04:45:29 PM
In the past, I've pulled the meter.
Just a seal and not a lock.
Let the power company know it needs a new seal. Have never had a big fuss over it.

Same here, I always just pull the meter...

Slabs · October 01, 2012, 07:35:16 PM

I built my own transfer panel for individual circuits using 20 amp three-way switches. Picture in my gallery but I haven't had any luck posting pics lately.

Not all circuits need emergency power so I limited myself to about 20. Priorities being beergerator, freezer, coffee maker and several others.

Luck changed.

A #10 cable from the generator comes in through the foundation to the basement where the panels are located and switches transfer from commercial power to standby/emergency.