Complete Novice qustions

[dablack]

Ok guys.  I used a friends saw last week.  Used it for a couple of hours.  Now I need to use my own.  My brother in law passed a couple of years ago and his chain saw came to me.  It is a craftsman 50cc with a 20" bar.  That is all I know.  From the looks of it, it might have been used once.  I put fresh mixed gas and bar oil in it and it ran like a top.  I cut some junk that needed some cleaning up around the property and then bucked a big oak into 8' lengths.  The chain came off twice and it was TOUGH getting through that oak.  Today I picked up a 7/32" round file to sharpen the saw. 

That was the back ground and here are the questions. 

I want this saw to last.  Where should I be lubricating this thing.  I know it has the chain oiler but is that all it needs?  What about the "turning wheel thing" on the end of the bar?  Anywhere else?  This saw sat in a garage for YEARS. 

I tried finding some videos on youtube for general maintenance but they weren't very helpful.  What else should I be doing to this saw to make it last.  I will obviously change the air filter and keep it sharp.  I will also keep the chain adjusted.  Past that, I really don't know. 

I'm going to be felling 20 something trees in the next couple of weeks.  Any advice would be helpfull. 

Also, where should I pick up a spare chain and how do I know what kind/size of chain to pick up? 

thanks for the advice,
Austin

[sharkey]

Hi Austin,
Chain is sold by Pitch, Gauge and Drive Link count, ie 3/8 x .050 x 70 or .325 x.050 x 78.  Your bar should have some numbers on it somewhere for guidance.  As for the maintenance, the best thing is to keep it clean.  You may need to replace the fuel/oil lines and the filters.  There have been too many different Craftsman saws to guess without a model number or picture to tell you exactly what you need.  Can you post a picture?

[Ianab]

Where should I be lubricating this thing.  I know it has the chain oiler but is that all it needs?  What about the "turning wheel thing" on the end of the bar?  Anywhere else?  This saw sat in a garage for YEARS. 

All the lube the saw needs should come from the chain oiler. That will be dragged along the bar and end up in the tip sprocket as well. So main thing is to make sure the oiler is getting oil into the bar groove. A common problem is the little hole in the bar that carries the oil getting blocked up with fine packed sawdust. Then the chain runs out of oil, and bad things happen.  This comes back to what Sharkey said about keeping things clean. Remove the bar occasionally and clean out the bar groove, and the oil hole with a suitable implement. (piece of wire etc). Air cleaner, check that, blow out the dust, replace if needed. Keep the cooling fins around the piston clear of wood chips so the saws cools properly.

And number one cause of saw death. Forgetting to put oil in the fuel    :D

People will argue all day about what oil mix to use, but one thing that's certain, if you forget to use any, the saw will die, and quickly.

Don't forget safety gear, and make sure you know what  you are doing before you go tackling any serious trees. If you need advice with basic (and safe) felling methods, just ask.

Ian

[John Mc]

You should also double check the file size you are using to sharpen the chain.  Different pitch chains can use different file diameters.  7/32"our files are usually for 3/8 pitch chain.  I'm betting your 50 cc Craftsman came standard with something else.  Possibly a .325 pitch (which typically uses 3/16" files), or some other smaller chain which may use an even smaller file.

If you post whatever numbers are likely stamped on your bar, someone here can probably help you out with what file to use to sharpen it, and what to get for a replacement chain.

There is also occasional maintenance to do on the bar as well, though as lightly used as your saw sounds, I'd guess the bar is OK for now.

[dablack]

Thanks guys.  I didn't get home until dark yesterday so I wasn't able to get much info or anything done.  I'm hoping to take a picture and post the info for the saw tomorrow.  I really appreciate the help.

Austin

[AdkStihl]

I'm willing to bet that saw came with 3/8LP chain which requires a 5/32 file.
If not, it came with .325 chain (which I doubt) which would require a 3/16 file

7/32 is not the right size file for that saw

[mad murdock]

If it is a little older craftsman it could be a solo or a Poulan.  Probably a good one. A picture of it would tell us all. On some bars, there is a small hole on one or both sides of the bar near the sprocket nose, that is for greasing the sprocket. I try and give the sprocket tip bearing a shot of grease a couple times a day at least. The other thing to check at least every other time you flip the bar over( to allow for even rail wear) is to look the clutch over good, clean it, and take the clutch drum off, inspect the clutch bearing and re-grease it before reassembling everything again. If it has a rim and sprocket setup on the clutch, change it with every new chain you put on (the rim), if the sprocket is integral to the clutch drum, you should change it with the chain as well, you will get more mileage out of everything and have fewer breakdowns if you do. One final thing I do when I flip the bar, is check the rails for evenness and debut and file the rails as required to bring things back into square, that way the saw will be able to cut straight and won't start giving you fits in long cuts especially.

[Lanternguy]

i just spent the weekend getting all my power equipment ready for the winter storage, for saws just a good cleaning and blow out with air compressor, oil the noise sprocket.  If you have a gas hedge clipper or trimmer its a good time to grease the internals but saw's are the easiest to maintain just keep them clean.   

[John Mc]

i just spent the weekend getting all my power equipment ready for the winter storage, for saws just a good cleaning and blow out with air compressor, oil the noise sprocket

I've heard two schools of thought on oiling/greasing the nose sprocket.  One group says to grease it regularly.  The 2nd group says never to grease it (and points out that some good bars don't even have the grease hole). The latter guys say that the grease just attracts dirt and grit, shortening the life of the nose sprocket, and the sprocket gets enough lube from the bar oil anyway.

I used to grease the nose sprocket regularly, but I was convinced to try not greasing. I haven't touched one in several years, and haven't seen any problems on any of my saws.

but saw's are the easiest to maintain just keep them clean.

And run them out of gas if you're going to store them for a while (a good idea with any gas, but especially important with ethanol blend gas).

[clww]

We use a 13/64" file on our 3/8" chains at work on our Stihl-brand chains.

[Oliver1655]

A simple way to get a new chain & the appropriate file / filing system/jig is to simply take the saw to your saw shop & have them help you identify it.  Most saw shops have knowledgeable & helpful folks working there.  However if you go to a box store, the odds of finding a truly knowledgeable person to assist you is low.

As you are new to working with a chainsaw, I would recommend a semi-chisel chain.  It will take a little bit more abuse & stay sharper a little longer than a full chisel.  I also prefer the Stihl brand of chain.  To me it seems to hold an edge & carry the bar oil along the bar a little better.

Chain comes in 2 classes: Professional which is identified as "yellow" & safety chain which is identified as "green".  Most folks on this forum use "yellow" chain.  The big thing to remember is it has a greater risk for kick back. Kick back occurs when you are using the upper/outer quarter of the bar tip by it's self. If making a bore cut using the tip to "bore" into the wood, start it with the lower portion of the tip then gradually rotate the bar into the wood as a pocket for the tip is created.

The Stihl 2in1 or Pferd CS-X file system (same thing) is a simple to use guide system for sharpening you chain & will also file the raker at the same time- hence the "2in1" title.  The raker is the angled part of the cutter link in front of the chain which works as a depth stop to keep the chain from taking too big a bite which would cause the chain to be grabby in harder woods, cause excessive "push back" while cutting with the top of the bar, & over work the saw.  At $40 the "2in1" is twice the cost of other filing systems at first glance but considering there are 2 round files, a flat file for the raker & it takes about half the time to sharpen the chain/set the raker height, I feel it is well worth the additional money. However you set the raker height, you will want to keep the front edge ofthe raker rounded over. ** NOTE ** Just as different sizes of chain require different sized files, there a different "2in1" guide for different sized chain. As a result, if you go to a Stihl dealer they will probably have to order one in to mach your chain.  It took 3 days for my dealer to get one in. Not too bad & no shipping cost.  The Pferd CS-X is available on-line.

Keep an eye out on your bar for the edges flaring out with wear. Use a flat tile to remove the flare.  A loose running chain is the reason for excessive flaring in most cases.

Remember to let the chain cut it's way into the wood.  If you have to force it into the wood it is time to sharpen your chain. If you sharpen your chain & it still doesn't want to dig in, check the height of the rakers. If not using the 2in1 system, you will need to check the rakers every 3-4 times you sharpen the chain.

A 50cc saw should do most of what you are wanting to do without any problem.  Just take your time & think ahead about how the tree/limb will react to each cut.

I would encourage you to go to one of the chainsaw manufacture's sites & down load a user's manual.  It doesn't have to be for your particular saw.  They will all cover safe operation of a chainsaw.

If possible have someone within hollering range in case some thing goes wrong. Especially while falling the trees. Keeping a cell phone with you is not a bad idea either.

Take some time to watch YouTube videos on falling trees. (Take a look at the comments below them as an indication of whether the information presented is good or bad.) There are several very good ones out there.

Basic safety equipment / PPE=Personal Protective Equipment: Hearing protection, Eye Protection, Hard hat, Chainsaw chaps, & a first aid kit is minimal. Safety toed boots, gloves are also wise to have.

Everyone will pinch a saw getting it stuck in wood at sometime. Keep an eye out for an 2nd/backup saw to cut it loose.  They are advertized regularly for less than $50.

Wish you the best.

[Weekend_Sawyer]

My Huskey has the hole in the tip for greasing the bar and I do. Haven't had a problem there. My Stihl saws do not and I haven't had a problem there either. ;D

I like to use air and blow out the channel on the bar and clean up the sprocket area. Air also works best for cleaning the air filter.

For replacement chains I took a picture of the numbers on my saw bar, walked into my stihl shop and they knew exactly what to give me. simple.

good luck
Jon

[dablack]

Wow guys.  Lots of great responces for me to study.  Yes, safety first.  I have all my PPE.  Steeltoed boots, safety glasses, gloves, hardhat and chainsaw chaps that I just got from baileys. 

Didn't get home last night until 8pm.  Then I had to cover some exposed pipes and other fun.  Luckily, I had set the saw out to take pictures so I didn't forget.  Got the flashlight and took some shots.

   

 



 

 

 



 

Yes, the last time I used it, the chain came off and I was physically done anyway, so I just put it away.

I really appreciate all the help.

Austin

[John Mc]

Beware some of the YouTube chainsaw videos.  There are a lot of them out there done by well-meaning folks who THINK they know what they are doing, but are just disasters waiting to happen.

Here's a link to a series of chainsaw training videos done by Husqvarna that are pretty good.  (All of them can be helpful. The last one is long, but good.  It does assume you're familiar with some of the info in the earlier videos.) 


These seem to follow a lot of the techniques from the Game of Logging training courses.  The videos are no substitute for actually taking one or more of the courses, but they can still be helpful to give you an idea of how to approach using a chainsaw and felling a tree. Some folks love these techniques, some don't, but I think all would agree that getting some exposure to safe cutting techniques is helpful, especially when first starting out.  That can come from taking a class, or getting an experienced friend to give you pointers. 

There are good classes and bad ones, but in general, the advantage of a class is that they've probably put a good bit of thought into what should be presented, and how to present it. With an individual, you may get some fantastic, one-on-one training, or you may just get tips on what happens to occur to him/her (or worse yet, you may be asking someone who is an accident waiting to happen, and you don't have the experience to judge for yourself whether they are giving you good advice or not).

Regardless of how you gain knowledge and experience, one of the most important things you can learn is when to walk away.  The ability to assess a situation and decide "this tree or situation is beyond my skills and/or beyond the capabilities of the equipment I have available; I need to either leave it alone, or bring in some help" is the kind of thing that can help assure you're still around to cut another day. In short: using your brain and knowing your limits is the best tool in your toolbox.

[Weekend_Sawyer]

Your chain may be loosening quickly because the bar nuts aren't tight enough, but be careful, don't stand on the wrench or you will probably break something.
Also, when I tighten the chain I check tension while holding the nose of the bar up with the bar nuts loose.
On all my saws if I let the bar settle down before tightening the bar nuts, the chain will seem tight but as you use it the bar will work it's way up loosening the chain.
Clear as mud eh?

[thecfarm]

In my area the small Vocational center at the high school has chainsaw maintenance classes. Saw sharpening is covered too. This is a night course. The guys at work was asking me where the school was. They said it was a good class

[John Mc]

Weekend Sawyer is right, if you're throwing a chain, one of the first tings to check is the chain tension.  You should also make sure the drive links (the parts of the chain that stick down between the rails of the bar) weren't damaged when it was thrown off.  If one or more of the drive links are chewed up, that can cause the chain to jump off as well.

The numbers on your bar give us an idea of the chain you need.  Just below the "Adjust" circle you see the numbers: 20 .325-78 .  The 20 means it's a 20" bar. The .325 refers to the pitch (basically, each link is .325" long).  The 78 means you need 78 drive links in a loop of chain (not all chains for 20" bars have the same number of drive links, since he bar design varies slightly depending on the chainsaw it's made to fit).

What we don't know is the Gauge of the chain.  This is the thickness of the drive link. You might find it stamped on the bar somewhere, or you can measure the thickness of a good drive link with a micrometer or caliper.  Common thicknesses are .050", .058" and .063".  You may find one of these numbers (or the metric equivalents: 1.3, 1.5, or 1.6) stamped on your bar.  There is also at least one narrower gauges out there (.043")

If you can't find the gauge, or don't have something to measure it with, here's a $0.36 trick (spotted on forum sponsor Bailey's website):  If your bar is in good shape - not badly worn and the rails aren't sprung or pinched, the following coins should fit snugly in the slot between the rails
Quarter: .063" gauge
Penny: .058" gauge
Dime:  .050" gauge

This worked when I checked it several years ago. Some coins have been redesigned, but I'm pretty sure the thickness remained the same (otherwise all the vending machines would get screwed up).  If you can't get a dime in, and the rails aren't pinched, my guess would be it's an .043" gauge, but I don't have a coin to verify that.

[dablack]

Ok.  I got the model number 358 350203.  With that I was able to find a manual and a parts list.  Looks like the chain part number is 20BPX078G (Micro-Chisel Saw Chain .325-Inch Pitch .050-Inch Gauge 78 Drive Link Count).

What would be the correct size file to sharpen this chain?  I'm going to order a spare but I need this one sharp today. 

thanks
Austin

[John Mc]

Most .325 pitch chains use a 3/16" file.

BTW... if you do wear out or damage a bar, or wish to have a spare bar, you may want to consider at 16" bar on that saw. I would not get rid of the one you have now. It sounds as though it's in good shape. It's just that a shorter bar may be a better match for the power of that saw.  (Also, having a spare bar and chain can be helpful if you get your saw stuck - it happens to everyone sooner or later.  With a spare bar and chain, you can just remove your power head, leaving the stuck B&C in place, put on your spare, and cut your stuck bar out of the tree). I also find a shorter bar more convenient to use in the woods, as long as I don't have a lot of large diameter trees to cut down.

[7sleeper]

Here is the alternativ from Stihl.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MUW7JNk7zVw&list=TLmGzNbEsVY-qlTyH7YoxkUZKukLYpQsnx


I would go with a shorter bar on that saw. 18" max!

Good luck!

7

[beenthere]

That video is a good primer for knowing a lot about the chainsaw. Sharpening is covered well too.