Ginseng

timberbeast · April 18, 2002, 03:57:17 AM

Always been reading about it, since I was a frequent subscriber to Fur-Fish-Game. My pop planted some up on a shady slope on the small piece of hardwoods (15 acres, maybe). Keep looking for it, since I'm curious if it's grown, can't seem to find anything resembling the descriptions from the reading materials. I've heard from some people in Virginia that tresspassers will clean it out REAL fast if they find it. Anyone with any experiences??? Pop's gone, I have a general idea of where he planted it, but I was maybe 15....that's almost 30 years ago!

Bibbyman · April 18, 2002, 06:29:47 AM

Here is what it looks like.

http://www.altnature.com/gallery/ginseng.htm

My dad hunts it each spring and summer and digs it in the fall. He's shown me many times what it looks like but I can't ever find it.

Ron Scott · April 18, 2002, 06:38:08 AM

It was picked fairly heavy when I was in West Virginia during the mid 70's. I believe it is much more restricted picking now.

Bibbyman · April 18, 2002, 08:22:32 AM

It has been badly over harvested here in Missouri too. They keep putting more stringent restrictions on digging to try to maintain some crop. Now the plant must have three branches to the stalks and you must bring out the stalk with the root to prove it or you're liable for a heavy fine.

Dad was able to dig quite a few lbs. each year because he knew were a lot of patches were and he'd only dig a few mature plants and bury the seeds. He'd come back next year and again take only a few mature plants and bury the seeds. But in recent years, he'd get to "his" patch too late and find someone had dug every plant (probably before the season opened). To him it is an outrageous act to dig them all and nothing makes him madder.

Now, when he returns to one of his patches that has not been plundered, he digs the mature plants and beaks the stalks off all the smaller plants and hides them under the leaves. As it is late in the summer/early fall and they are already dormant, it does not hurt the plant.

Here is another web-site with info:

http://www.conservation.state.mo.us/nathis/plantpage/flora/ginseng/

Ron Wenrich · April 18, 2002, 04:01:00 PM

I once talked to a utility forester who harvested ginseng. He said he would dry it and take it down to Washington, DC to the airport. There would be an Oriental buyer there with cash and a scales. It looked like a drug deal.

After the buyer had spent his money, he would get on a plane and fly back home.

The forester said he made pretty good money doing this. One of those NTFPs (Non-timber forest products).

Ron Scott · April 18, 2002, 07:27:27 PM

I know that some did well with it in West Virginia and had their connections with oriental buyers. When big prices were heard, more started picking. I guess the reasons for more restrictions and why its on the black market some now.

timberbeast · April 19, 2002, 02:37:07 AM

Thanks, guys! Not really looking to make any dough, just want to see if it's there! They have some kind of selling convention in Wausau, Wi each year, I believe it's federally overseen. Lots of farmers around here are putting up posts and some kind of "shade fabric" and planting the stuff. Thought of stopping in and asking to look at the plants, but figure they're pretty protective and may get the wrong idea!

Ron Wenrich · April 19, 2002, 10:37:28 AM

I've seen guys use wooden snow fence as a shade. Works pretty well. But, the cultivated kind is only worth half of the woods kind.

If you ask around, you'll find someone pretty knowledgable on the subject. Most times, they are more than happy to talk to you about it. The county extension office probably has all kinds of brochures on it, and might be able to point you in the right direction.

Tom · April 19, 2002, 11:22:47 AM

........and all this time I thought that Ginseng was some kind of Chinese "horseradish" that was only grown there and shipped to everybody else.

Ya' learn sumthin' every day :P

Don P · April 23, 2002, 05:34:00 AM

T-Beast,
The growers you talk about near Wausau met the buyers a generation ago when silver foxes were raised in that area for the same market :-/
We had some growers stop by our campfire one night picking our brains about log homes and we visited awhile. One of the guys asked about 'sang and as a group they just up and walked away :D Secretive doesn't even begin. They were quizzing me about wild seed at the tavern as their's is apparently getting weak and the buyer's can tell. Only part of that deal happens under the watchful eye. Our place in VA got cleaned out shortly after we bought it.

L. Wakefield · April 23, 2002, 03:30:30 PM

This is a different plant and so is technically off-topic but... I had some transplants to put in on Saturday evening- and when I dug a place for them, I dug iout a bunch of goldthread or cankerroot- Coptis groenlandica. I had/had not noticed that it was there previously. That is, a friend of my mom had said it was, and I had looked at pix in a book, and had seen the above-ground parts, but just hadn't put 2+2 together till i saw those tiny golden roots just glowing in the setting sun. So I verified that there was plenty more around in the area, took them home, cleaned them off and dried them to stash till the next canker sore or fever blister appears. 'They' say the active ingredient is berberine. Cool plant. lw

Sawyerfortyish · April 27, 2002, 07:19:30 PM

Timberbeast
We buy sang in the north east along with hides and leather. We stoped buying fur .There`s no money in that anymore. Last year we bought hundreds of pounds the year before tons.There are more restrictions and digging seasons now. We only handle wild. In addition there is woods grown and cultivated each having a differant price range.When looking for it in the woods there are many plants looking similer but sang is the only one with a cluster of berrys growing out of the center also about late august around here the plant turns golden yellow and is the only plant that color in the woods at that time. Once you find it you`ll never forget what it looks like. The leaves are narrow and pointed and if you have ever seen pictures or the pot plant it self you would say they look very similar. Although I`ve never seen but pictures of pot thats what it reminds me of.
Sang can also be cloned so I`m told by digging the root carefuly you will find a tiny almost hair like root just under the crown rings you must break the root off below this and plant the crown back with the hair like root atached and it will grow another root like the one you took.

timberbeast · April 28, 2002, 08:01:17 PM

Thanks again!! Sawyer, I remember back in my trapping days, the fur houses would also buy Ginseng as well as May-Apple roots, and I did dig some May-Apple roots in late summer. I sold to a place in St. Louis called Maas and Steffen. Can't remember for the life of me what the roots paid, but I remember averaging about 4 bucks for muskrats and 40 bucks or so for red fox. Long time ago, but I sure earned more than my friends with paper routes!! I'll do some poking around in August. I need to know if it's there, might be an inheritance for my kids, who knows?

johnjbc · May 07, 2002, 03:51:08 PM

Was out to my woods this weekend getting the road ready for my septic tank to be delivered. Was setting in my pickup camper having lunch and looked out the door at this plant. I remembered reading this thread about ginseng having 5 leaves.
Could this be it? If so I have sure dug up a lot of it. :'(
John

Ron Wenrich · May 07, 2002, 04:07:35 PM

Looks like May apples to me. Now is also the time to be hunting morels.

bjorn · May 07, 2002, 04:07:47 PM

That looks like May Apple. Watch out! It's poisonous.

Jeff · May 07, 2002, 06:21:34 PM

There is a large patch of Gineng on a north facing hill (river valley) down to my Moms. About 10 years ago my Brother in law and I dug up a sample and sent it somewhere. They told us they were not interested because of the quality.

Is this something I should be looking back into? As I remember the roots had holes and other things about them that made them unsaleable.

L. Wakefield · May 07, 2002, 07:28:45 PM

Well, I for one would be quite interested in obtaining some live rootstock regardless of the quality to attempt to start a patch or 2 here. I am wondering if the root would transplant and continue growing. Are you at all interested in trying? I couldn't pay huge amounts but- as with other valuable plants- I'd like to give it a home. lw

Jeff · May 07, 2002, 07:40:47 PM

I am not sure I can I.D. it until the berries are on it now, I am going down there for Mothers day. I will try to remember to take a look. If I can find it, I will send some to you. Might have to wait till the stuff blooms so I can find it.

Any Ideas on how to keep it viable?

Sawyerfortyish · May 07, 2002, 08:21:13 PM

That picture is not of ginseng like I said in my earlier post theres lots of plants that look like it. Ginseng grows a single stalk out of the ground that comes to a crotch or better known as prongs mature plants usually have two to four prongs all branching off at the same point on the stalk at the point of the crotch in the center will be the berries they will be very small and green before growing and turning red in the fall. I always plant the berries or seeds just under the leaves around where I found the plant. If you want to grow ginseng plant seeds don`t transplant. Anyone that knows what there looking at can pick transplanted right out because of the way the root is deformed from transplanting. Transplanted root is valued at much less money than wild. If you dig up one of the plants in the picture I`ll bet it has a tulip type bulb

CHARLIE · May 07, 2002, 08:23:41 PM

Well Jeff, most plants like moisture. :

;D

Maybe wrap it in some wet paper towel, put it in a baggy and ship it 1 day delivery or something like that.

Sawyerfortyish · May 07, 2002, 08:24:38 PM

At second look it does look like may apple

Ron Wenrich · May 08, 2002, 04:24:45 AM

Sources for ginseng seed:

http://www.ncf.carleton.ca/~bh295/seedsetc.html#Books

How to grow plus root stock:

http://www.wildgrown.com/

Care and planting of seed and rootstock:

http://www.ces.ncsu.edu/depts/hort/hil/hil-127.html

Is it best to start as seed instead of transplanting the root stock? Roots would give a couple of year headstart, but be worth less than seed started.

L. Wakefield · May 09, 2002, 07:39:56 PM

   Well, fwiw from my perspective I am NOT at all interested in selling- but in having a personal stock. I'm getting to the age where ginseng is more valued, and I am tired of buying bogus or questionable material.

   When i got plants from St. Lawrence Nurseries they had the roots wrapped in moist newspaper. I've also seen moist burlap. I've also seen little plants shipped in potting soil proper dampness- and that would work with roots on short term. Just roots and damp soil in a plastic bag.

   I also see the refs for seed and if I have time will look into that.

   Can't say I'm overly intersted in mayapple (Mandragora officinalis, aka mandrake). It has very limited use for the treatment of venereal warts, and it's nasty and corrosive for that.

   BTW, is anyone interested in the goldthread I posted on a bit ago (I think it was in this group)? It could travel the same way.. In the case of the goldthread, I'd be thinking take up a shallow shovelful, find a styrofoam shallow container for it, tuck into that, then in a bag, then put something real light and loose to pad the leaves, seal up the bag and send it off tout suite.

   I love watching my perennials come back. lw