Simple Crates

[Don P]

When I worked in the furniture shop we would use an overarm pin router to make handle holes like that. In a home shop a plunge router in a jig would do the same thing, probably in 3 plunge depth passes, then I use a 1/4" radius roundover bit to ease the edges of the hole. That would speed up handhole making a lot over the way I've been doing it on the drill press. That probably is my bottleneck just never pondered on it. A drywall nail has a ring shank, that would probably have better withdrawal strength over a box nail. Maze nails, the yellow box, has a splitless siding nail that is longer and has a ring shank

[Magicman]

 




 
 
I used ¼" crown staples on these.  The ERC edgings for the corners gave them a rustic look.

[WV Sawmiller]

Don,

   Most any screw will hold better than the nails, although I will continue to look for the ringed nails, but the screws are much more expensive and time consuming to install. 

MM,

   Yes the airgun installed staples would likely be as strong and even less time to install as no pilot holes needed. I just have not invested in the equipment to do so and will see how these sell before I do much more.

[Bruno of NH]

WV
Look into a cordless crown stapler

[WV Sawmiller]

Bruno,

   I'll do that. I think I looked at corded electric staplers and did not find much selection so then I checked out the air systems and found several of them and not overly expensive to set up. I will look for cordless, battery powered models and see what is available. My main concern would be whether they have the power to drive a staple 1.5" or so.

[coalsmok]

WV
I use a harbor freight air compressor and brad/staple gun to assemble my bee boxes.  The initial investment was around $60-70. Pretty cheap for what work I have gotten out of it and it will drive up to 11/4" or 11/2" staples. You could staple the top slat on each side and one one the bottom to hold it square then just bang the rest on.  I don't have as much issue with splitting using the staples when nailing thin wood like hive frames. 

[WV Sawmiller]

   Yeah, I had looked at our local HF and found the stapler was about $20-$22 and the compressor varied based on the size but I still think I could buy a decent, middle of the road set up for $125-$150. Lets see if there is a market for these first.

  One thing in my favor is I have a stand of overaged Norway spruce planted for Christmas trees that I can cut to make a bunch of 6-8 inch wide boards. I might get a few 1X10s but very few would make a 12" wide board. I have plenty of poplar for the boards and slats if I want to go that route. Then again, one - two 14-16 inch poplars would make enough wood to build crates till I was in my 80s. :D

[Bruno of NH]

WV
I have used Paslode framing guns and finish guns for years. Had great luck with them.
There are a lot of new tools battery only out now.
They would drive a 2" staple easy. 
I have all the air tools but like working cordless when I can.

[Mean Dean]

Harbor Freight is carrying ring shank nails now for their air nailers. I misaligned a siding board and had a time removing it. They helt good in green elm. 

[WV Sawmiller]

   I will try to remember to take more pictures and add tomorrow although it would be hard to distinguish them from earlier posts. I got out about sunset and made 4 more crates using wide mouth pint jars for measurements. I used spruce boards planed to about 3/4" thick. I cut them to 10.75" which was the final inside width. I cut my 3/8" X 2" poplar strips 16" long leaving inside dimensions of just over 14". I used 1"X 6" end boards (Actually 5.5" is about right). I used 4 strips evenly spaced to make the bottom and 2 per side. That readily fits a dozen pint canning jars even if they are still in the cardboard case they came in. It will work for regular or wide mouth jars. I used one 1.5" ring shank (Dry wall?) nail at each connection - 2 per strip/16 per crate. The ring shank nails held very good even when nailed into the grain on the ends.

[Don P]

This rings a bell :D. I had stuck some pics from the last run of boxes on the computer and then forgot about them.
The first 3 are the way I've been making the handles and tray ends and the simple jigs. Obviously the one in the drill press here is finished I'm just showing how I work from one end stop to the other end stop punching all along the way with a forstner bit, then sand and round over the edges with a router. Theres a scrap of fresh wood underneath to help keep blowout down on the backside. It could be jigged up with a plunge router and probably do it faster and better.


 



This is the jig I use to slot the ends for the bottom slats. The left router has the 1/2" square bit for plowing the slot. The base rides on that back guide as a "fence". the right hand router has the roundover bit I use for pretty much all the edges, if you ever have a chance to buy one of those old gems grab it, I've worn out several of them, one of the best little 1-1/2 hp routers ever made.




Last pic is a dozen quart canning jar box. I've lightened it up a bit, 3/8" sided 1/2" ends with 3/4" framing. I might lighten up the next batch a little more. I've been sawing a bunch of pine and save all the narrow and thin stuff. It's leaned up all around the sawmill shop drying. When I have time I'll run it all thru the planer to get it uniform thicknesses and make another run of boxes for the farmers market.

[WV Sawmiller]

   Beautiful work. Way more complicated than what I am building. What kind of price do you have to get out of something like that?

[Don P]

They are part of my get rich slow plan :D  I'm giving them away at $20. It's not too bad if I kind of assembly line a run of a dozen or so at a time. It's rainy day work when I want to do something easy. I'll sometimes make a larger run of ends and have them in a corner ready to go.

[Walnut Beast]

Looks nice Don 👍

[thecfarm]

I bookmarked this thread so I can make some. I won't post pictures because I know the boxes I make won't come out as good as the ones you guys make.  ;D
My wood working skills stop when the tree hits the ground.  :D

[WV Sawmiller]

@thecfarm ,

  Surely you can make them as good as mine. :D They don't get much simpler than 2 boards with 4 strips nailed across the bottom and 2 strips nailed across each side.

 There is a little slack between the jars above because they are regular mouth jars and I made the crate big enough to accommodate wide mouth ones which are a little bigger. Also it is big enough to accommodate the cardboard box the jars came in you still have it.

   I make the strips by edging 8/4 flitches in 1/2" drops. With the 1/8" kerf this leaves me a 2" X 3/8" strip. You can gang cut them by "edging" 5-6 each 8/4 flitches at a time. I sticker and air dry them a few months just like I do my boards. It doesn't take long with this thin a "board" to dry. I cut them to length on my RAS then go drill a pilot hole with my drill press about 3/8" from the end in the center of the strip so I don't split the strip during nailing. You could use a pneumatic nailer or staple - I'd recommend the staple over the brad/nail so the nail doesn't pull through under a load. I typically drill the pilot holes in 2-3 strips at a time. I could do more if I put a longer bit on. I plane the boards just to help keep them easier to dust/wipe clean. The 1-1/2" ring shank nails have a little bigger head which I like. Nailing the pieces together by hand could be a fun project for your kids or grandkids. I like the ring shank better than any smooth shank nail or staple because the sides are nailed into the grain of the soft boards used for the end. I will likely make a jig to lay everything on to keep in place when nailing them together.

  Routering out handholds is a nice touch but can readily double, or more, the time spent prepping the ends for nailing. You could nail a 4-6 inch square 1"X 1" strip on the end for a hand hold but that uses more shelf space when stacking them. I may try dadoing a simple groove 3/4" wide and about 3/8" deep in the ends for fingertip gripping similar to the handholds on beehive supers/hive bodies. That would not require more material and should be faster than routering.

[Bruno of NH]

Don
What are the dimensions of your boxes ?

[thecfarm]

I thought about that strip of wood for a "handle" too. Limited to an old table saw.
Good idea storing the jars upside down.  ;) I might make the bottom so that it sticks out a little so if I stack them, they cannot slide off. Or just run 2 boards the witch of the boxes. That would be easier.
Kinda like the corners that Magic Man did.

[Don P]

Bruno, I took a survey of the quart jars we had, they do vary a bit, and made it for a dozen of the largest. I'll give you interior dimensions in case you want to vary the wood thickness. Inside the canning jar box is 11-1/4 x 15" x 7" deep. On the ends under the floor is a 3/4x 3/4" strip glued to the bottom and the end panels.

The trays were made to hold those plastic plant starting trays, although no one seems to use them for that. They mostly get used for hauling and displaying produce at the market and customers use them for lunch trays and whatever. Interior dimensions are 11-1/4 x 22-1/2" and 3-1/2" deep. The end blank is 11-1/4 x 4-1/2". That 1/2" groove is 1/2" off the bottom edge.
Here's some pics of them;


 



A lot of em get given away. Someone needs something to carry or display on, does good or a good deed and poof annuder tray done gone :D. Up to the boss and I don't keep score, she just lets me know when she's low on them.

A bee super has a shallow rout plowed in but most folks don't have the hand strength to make that safe with a loaded box. The outside frame on the canning jar box is really enough to grab.

I made boxes to hold 30 dozen eggs which is a commodity box size back when we were moving more eggs. I made some with handholds and that was actually a problem, fingers came back all yolky when they went into the box :D. I stuffed most of them full of kindling and sold them at the local store, they were a pretty good hit.

[WV Sawmiller]

I thought about that strip of wood for a "handle" too. Limited to an old table saw.
Good idea storing the jars upside down.  ;) I might make the bottom so that it sticks out a little so if I stack them, they cannot slide off. Or just run 2 boards the witch of the boxes. That would be easier.
Kinda like the corners that Magic Man did.

Cfarm,

    I don't understand the comment about extending the bottom so it sticks out so if you stack them they can't slide off. Are you concerned one end might fall down into the crate of the one below? If there are jars in it, it could not drop over about 1/2".

    The MM corners are nice and would not be  a problem for jars as they are round and don't fill the corners anyway. They could be in the way if you stack them still in the cardboard boxes the jars came in.

    My dimensions are basically: 

Pints - 10.75" W X 14" long X 5.5" tall. 

Quarts: 12" W X 16" long X 8" tall

   I haven't made any for half pints yet but can see that coming. I may make them deep/tall enough to stack 2 jars deep.

   I use 3 strips on the bottom and two on the sides for pints and 4 strips on the bottom and 3 on the sides for quarts.

[Bruno of NH]

Thanks Guys
That's my next rain day projects
Going to use black locust and ash

[Don P]

Watch the weight. I made those trays above out of red oak, I made a bunch out of nice hardwoods, and got complaints about the heft. Yeah I know, what did it amount to half a pound :D, but there it is. I come from "If a 2x4 works use a 2x8 :D". Cedar, sass, thuja, pine, walnut cause, well its walnut, have all been greeted happily. The egg boxes, we were sending them to co-ops and restaurants so there was the opportunity for dropping off a box and picking up the empty. The cardboard case was $2 on top of the price of the 30 cartons or dozen flats inside the case. A big part of the cost of stuff is the one trip packaging. So I made those case boxes to save everyone money. The chefs liked them cause they were tougher in the cooler, less egg breakage. We got a new driver that whined about the "heavy boxes" and put an end to it, back to the one trip cardboard boxes :.

I've made them with box joint corners before, really cool but a major PITA. If I ever see a used hauncher at the right time that would be neat.

People are logo oriented, I've thought about getting someone to burn the market logo on some sides or ends. I think that would help them move but at another added cost.

[WV Sawmiller]

Bruno,

   I agree with Don on that weight issue. I am using spruce and poplar to keep the weight down on my crates. I'd sure think you could find more valuable projects especially for locust. 

    I am thinking we need to reject Don's work from this thread as his look more like fine furniture than simple crates like mine. :D :D

[Don P]

A little routering draws the eye away from all the other sins :D

[btulloh]

Roundover bit does give it a polished look.  Wouldn't take two minutes a crate if the bit was already in the router table.  But there's an appeal to the more rustic version too.  Let the customer decide I s'pose.

Cutting that hand-grab hole could be the time waster unless you set up to run a bunch.  Pretty quick if you're jigged up for it.  That's why I figure a person can never have too many routers.  :D