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Author Topic: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?  (Read 1082 times)

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Offline Brad_bb

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Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« on: November 24, 2019, 05:03:44 PM »
I've dealt with the tree service guys a lot lately.  They tend to cut the tree fairly high leaving a higher stump, then they come back and cut the stump off low for grinding.  I'm assuming that they do this for safety?  Maybe an OSHA thing??  Do loggers do the same thing or do they cut lower to get more of the butt wood?  Do loggers do a different cut than the tree service to preserve more wood?  Please educate me. thanks.
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Offline barbender

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Re: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« Reply #1 on: November 24, 2019, 05:39:41 PM »
Loggers left really high stumps back when they cut our virgin pine forests, for 2 reasons. 1. It was easier on the back to cut at waist height with a two man cross cut. 2. There was a lot less wood to get through when you got above the root flare. You can still see remnants of over 100 year old pine stumps across our forests, most of them are approaching 3' high. In our modern era, we are required on most timber contracts to keep our stump height to a certain level. I can't remember what that is🤷🏽‍♂️😁 I think stump height may not exceed 1/2 of diameter? All that said, even when low stumps are required, a lot of woods, in my experience, are best "butted off" a bit to get rid of the root flare. Some species, when sawn, will curl right up to match the flare.
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Offline Bruno of NH

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Re: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« Reply #2 on: November 24, 2019, 05:54:06 PM »
I get logs from the biggest tree company in the country.
They have the oddest butt cuts on the logs I have ever seen.
I know the log truck driver tells me they have to go to lots of hand holding meetings about every thing.
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Offline WDH

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Re: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« Reply #3 on: November 24, 2019, 06:04:17 PM »
In Southern Industrial Forestry in the Piedmont and Coastal Plain, I believe that the standard for stump height is 6" maximum.  However, 99.9 % of the timber is mechanically felled with fellerbunchers. 
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Offline Skeans1

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Re: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« Reply #4 on: November 24, 2019, 06:12:40 PM »
Its going to depend on the face the size and depth, if a super low stump is required without recutting the stump with a humboldt style face or a block face on a 60 tree its possible but not always the safest thing with the ground we see. In general youll see a tree service high stump something just so they arent bent over like a faller would be to save every inch they can same with a conventional face you loose footage on the logs out here if theyre left. Dont quote me on this but from memory some of the guys Ive cut with over the years said most grounds require a maximum of 18 back cut height if safe on the high side of the tree.

Offline moodnacreek

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Re: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« Reply #5 on: November 24, 2019, 06:46:46 PM »
Professionals cut trees, especially hardwood, at the ground in a way that will not crack, split or cause pull out. The idea is to get as far below the first cat face [or worse] as possible to produce a grade saw log. If you have been sawing logs produced in this mindset you will quietly hate the other kind and certainly pay less and grade them harder.

Offline BargeMonkey

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Re: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« Reply #6 on: November 24, 2019, 06:47:48 PM »
 Most of the contracts I've dealt with say 18" ground permitting. Sometimes we will leave a high stump for a bumper, come back thru later and cut it off. Everyone thinks loggers are bad, you cant get 50% of the tree rat industry to pass a drug test never mind buck logs correctly. 

Offline Grandpa

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Re: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« Reply #7 on: November 24, 2019, 07:10:59 PM »
Most contracts here say less than 12" above ground level.

Offline Don P

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Re: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« Reply #8 on: November 24, 2019, 07:50:47 PM »
"An inch at the bottom is worth a foot at the top"
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Offline Oddman

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Re: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« Reply #9 on: November 24, 2019, 09:36:25 PM »
Used to fall for a real small logging outfit, we cut our stumps low because it reduces waste and because the landowners generally like them low.

Offline Southside

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Re: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« Reply #10 on: November 24, 2019, 09:45:28 PM »
@barbender is any of that due to winter cut snow pack?  Growing up you could always tell when a tract was cut in a bad winter as the stumps would all be the same height and they would be high.  Mechanical harvests obviously changed that.  
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Offline Ron Scott

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Re: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« Reply #11 on: November 24, 2019, 10:35:28 PM »
Most all commercial timber sale contracts here call for a 12" stump height on sawlog size trees and an 8" stump height on pulpwood size trees. 
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Offline barbender

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Re: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« Reply #12 on: November 24, 2019, 10:35:52 PM »
Southside, I don't know how our stump height standards in the contracts are arrived at. Our harvesters tend to leave higher stumps, whereas the bunchers take them down low. We don't tend to get enough snow to affect stump heights with the harvesters very much. In the past, pre mechanical logging, I'm sure the snow did affect the stump height- and just like Maine, most of the wood was cut in the winter. Maybe you could find the year a tract was cut going by the stumps? "Oh, a three footer! Thus must be from the winter of '17!😂" 
Too many irons in the fire

Offline Corley5

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Re: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« Reply #13 on: November 24, 2019, 10:38:07 PM »
Places in the U.P. they go back in the spring and cut a 100" saw bolt off the stump ;) :D ;D :)
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Offline Pine Ridge

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Re: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« Reply #14 on: November 24, 2019, 11:29:20 PM »
I cut as low as possible, landowners here would frown on high stumps. Sometimes you have to cut one higher than normal according to circumstances, but generally as low as you can.
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Offline Brad_bb

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Re: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« Reply #15 on: November 25, 2019, 12:16:54 AM »
Well that answered the logger part of the question - stumps are cut much lower, as low as possible, and they will use a Humboldt cut as opposed to conventional face cut (I had to look those up on google).  Some have indicated that tree service guys cut higher for safety and convenience. 
Thanks fellas. Now I know more.  This came up because I thought I may need to the tree service I've used to fell some walnut trees in a woods by me owned by a neighbor(that he was willing to give me).  It will likely be cleared next year for road, but I just found out there is some dispute between the neighbor and the town.  So It may never happen.  Good info for the future though.
Anything someone can design, I can sure figure out how to fix!
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Offline Ianab

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Re: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« Reply #16 on: November 25, 2019, 02:41:06 AM »
Tree service guys are generally not worried about the log, and in fact usually have to saw it up into manageable chunks for removal. So lopping off a tree at waist height is easier, they are going to have to cut through it there anyway once it's on the ground. Then they can go back and cut the stump off closer to ground level without being concerned about where the tree is going to land. 

I'm sure they could saw them lower if you asked nice and explained you wanted the logs. Just saving the log isn't their usual priority. 
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Offline moodnacreek

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Re: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« Reply #17 on: November 25, 2019, 07:47:34 AM »
"An inch at the bottom is worth a foot at the top"
Never heard that before, very true.

Offline Southside

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Re: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« Reply #18 on: November 25, 2019, 08:36:47 AM »
"An inch at the bottom is worth a foot at the top"
Two feet in pine around here.
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Offline timberking

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Re: Tree cut height, tree service vs logger?
« Reply #19 on: November 25, 2019, 01:29:10 PM »
Did you know stumps can grow.  Cut even with the duff layer then get all the wood behind it.  Presto! 8" stump


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