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Author Topic: Swingblade Input/Advice  (Read 1468 times)

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Offline longtime lurker

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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #20 on: January 14, 2020, 08:39:09 AM »
Here's how ya double cut with a Lucas.... because I've seen a few guys make posts lately that are keen to lock onto it with a couple men and lift it around, or drill holes in the frame and have a winch over the top with presumably a portable tree to hang the winch from. And all that slow hard work is unnecessary ;D ;D ;D

To do this you need
1. Log pretty well centered inside the rails (which you need anyway to double cut)
2. Log well dogged/wedged/ however you want to hold it. It needs to be wobble free (should be anyway but yanno.... make sure)
3. One end of the log to be close to one of the end frames.
4. The top already off the log so you've got a flat surface up there.

And this is how you cut a 2" thick board (could be any thickness but lets say we're chasing a 2" thick double cut.

Drop down your 2" both ends from your last face and do your single cut same as always.

Stop on the end thats close to the end frame.

Turn key off, while blade is slowing center the gearbox (blade horizontal) in line with the middle of your flat on top of the log.

Set that end frame only on the 4" mark (dont touch the other end)

Wind up to 1" on the guage

Let the carriage roll back onto the top of the log (because it's now higher than your previous cut face) so your blade is fully on the log longways (dont matter if it hangs off the sides a bit)

Drop your end frame down to somewhere around the 6" mark. (The saw will now be sitting on the log with one side of the carriage free of the rails by a few inches and all the weight sitting on the sawblade.

Steady the carriage with one hand and pivot the whole lot on the blade, using the side shift winder to reposition the carriage frame onto the rails facing the other way. I usually rotate "backwards" because the riving knife rides easier that way but either is good.

Wind up to the 1" mark again
Pull the carriage clear of the log.
Drop the end frame back to the 4" mark where you started... if you havent bumped the scale it's back at the 2" depth you had on the other side of the log.
Saw.

That whole procedure took me 2 minutes 38 seconds today, and I never got out of a slow walk. The only thing you have to do is make sure you don't wind too far up or down at any point and move the vertical scale.

The other week I had to ring Lucas Mill and get a new cog for the sideshift winder... you got any idea how many miles you need to wind that thing back and forth to wear the teeth out on that cog? Somewhere in there I learnt every trick in the book... and a whole lot that aren't. :D

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Offline jeepcj779

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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #21 on: January 14, 2020, 12:14:14 PM »
Any chance that you can post a video of that process? It would be interesting to see, especially for those of us unfamiliar with the mill's controls.

Offline alan gage

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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #22 on: January 14, 2020, 02:30:39 PM »
You're going to have a lot of piles of heavy lumber. How are you going to move them around? Not saying you can't get by without some sort of tractor/loader/forklift but pretty much everyone that buys a sawmill soon figures out that the actual sawing is pretty easy, it's moving (and storing) wood that's hard. 

A swing mill would take off some of the pressure of moving logs but might increase the difficulty of moving lumber since you'll probably be sawing far away from where you'll be drying.

Alan
Timberking B-16, a few chainsaws from small to large, and a Bobcat 873 Skidloader.

Offline ButchC

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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #23 on: January 14, 2020, 03:13:33 PM »
Agreed Alan, something with a set of forks is about the next purchase after the first can of fuel for the new mill😃
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Offline Ianab

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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #24 on: January 14, 2020, 03:20:00 PM »
A swing mill would take off some of the pressure of moving logs but might increase the difficulty of moving lumber since you'll probably be sawing far away from where you'll be drying.


A tractor or similar is of course a very useful thing no matter what mill you have. You can set up the mill around logs (but that takes time). Same as rolling smaller logs into place with hand tools. But it can be done. Being able to quickly place a new log on the bunks with the tractor does make life easier.  If a log is too big for your tractor, then you are back to moving the mill, but then you have a couple of hours cutting before you need to move again. 

When I'm sawing I usually flat stack off the mill on a trailer. How big a load you can take depends on your trailer size of course. But once I've got a load they get hauled home and stacked to dry. Yes you have to handle each board twice, but not for any distance. 
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Offline alan gage

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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #25 on: January 14, 2020, 03:44:25 PM »
When I'm sawing I usually flat stack off the mill on a trailer. How big a load you can take depends on your trailer size of course. But once I've got a load they get hauled home and stacked to dry. Yes you have to handle each board twice, but not for any distance.
 

You must be more organized than me. After stacking my lumber goes into the drying shed. It's rare that I don't have to move any given pallet of lumber at least 6 dozen times before the lumber has air dried because I need to either get at lumber that it's blocking or reorganize the shed to make room for more lumber. Once it's air dried and flat stacked I'll move it another 6 dozen times before I use it.

Alan
Timberking B-16, a few chainsaws from small to large, and a Bobcat 873 Skidloader.

Offline Don P

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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #26 on: January 14, 2020, 10:15:41 PM »
We can spin the carriage and be cutting again in under 30 seconds. The rails are not moved which is more accurate, many fewer steps and faster. The key is on, throttle back below clutch cut in. Hook, winch up, spin, winch down, unhook, throttle up and sawing again. No extra holes were drilled in the carriage. This is mid spin;


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Offline LexusLuther

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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #27 on: January 14, 2020, 11:01:48 PM »
Thank you all for the good information on Lucas and Peterson swingblades.  I wish some Turbosaw guys would give their thoughts on the 6-13.  Based on the videos, it seems like it would be easier to double cut with and be plenty portable.  TS may be more limited if you want to cut longer logs.  Maybe they are all good machines and I should just make my decision.

Offline Ianab

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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #28 on: January 15, 2020, 12:19:40 AM »
Maybe they are all good machines and I should just make my decision.


That's about it. The various mills have some different features, and some have more power, wider cuts, automation etc. But that increases the cost and limits the portability etc.

But they all work like they are supposed to. 
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Offline jimbarry

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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #29 on: January 15, 2020, 06:09:33 AM »
Lex, 

Welcome to the forum. Your described scenario was me 3 years ago, wanting to go solo, hilly terrain, etc. All the points about material handling are true, actually sawing the log is the least amount of work.  Having machinery to move material helps... a lot. With a tractor at hand, plan your work flow so that you're handling the least amount possible. I stack and sticker right off the mill onto pallets and move with skid steer.  



 



 

I bought a small manual bandsaw mill (SMG) that will cut a 23" slab off of a 36" log. When I started out I rarely if ever seen logs that big. A couple years in now, I am sourcing bigger logs. Problem for me is turning them on the bunks, so with the boss's approval, I just put a deposit down on a D&L SB1020 Super Pro. Should arrive just in time for spring.



Jim
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Offline ButchC

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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #30 on: January 15, 2020, 07:06:23 AM »
  Maybe they are all good machines and I should just make my decision.
Yes, 
If I have come across as bashing Lucas mills it was not intended. You have made the major decision (correctly😃) in that a swinger is the right mill.  I have watched all 3 brands mentioned work at the trade shows. Each one has high points. You just decide which one fits your needs best get out the checkbook and enjoy.  I am sure that they all offer good support. Peterson is excellent, that I know for certain.
Peterson JP swing mill
Morbark chipper
Shop built firewood processor
Case W11B
Many chainsaws, axes, hatchets,mauls,
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Offline Dakota

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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #31 on: January 15, 2020, 09:42:30 AM »
@Don P How are you hooking to the carriage in order to lift it.  I can't see from the picture.  Have you found a perfect balance point on the engine and installed a lift point ?
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Offline LexusLuther

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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #32 on: January 15, 2020, 06:13:58 PM »
Lex,

Welcome to the forum. Your described scenario was me 3 years ago, wanting to go solo, hilly terrain, etc. All the points about material handling are true, actually sawing the log is the least amount of work.  Having machinery to move material helps... a lot. With a tractor at hand, plan your work flow so that you're handling the least amount possible. I stack and sticker right off the mill onto pallets and move with skid steer.  


(Image hidden from quote, click to view.)
 


(Image hidden from quote, click to view.)
 

I bought a small manual bandsaw mill (SMG) that will cut a 23" slab off of a 36" log. When I started out I rarely if ever seen logs that big. A couple years in now, I am sourcing bigger logs. Problem for me is turning them on the bunks, so with the boss's approval, I just put a deposit down on a D&L SB1020 Super Pro. Should arrive just in time for spring.
Love the pictures and work flow advice.  It is becoming obvious that I need to have forks: tractor, skid, or otherwise, to really make this work. 

Offline LexusLuther

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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #33 on: January 15, 2020, 06:17:30 PM »
 Maybe they are all good machines and I should just make my decision.
Yes,
If I have come across as bashing Lucas mills it was not intended. You have made the major decision (correctly😃) in that a swinger is the right mill.  I have watched all 3 brands mentioned work at the trade shows. Each one has high points. You just decide which one fits your needs best get out the checkbook and enjoy.  I am sure that they all offer good support. Peterson is excellent, that I know for certain.
I did not take it as bashing-- I appreciate your insight on double cutting.  That is just the kind of real practice information I was looking for.  I think Lucas makes a great machine and I have some regret for not buying a used one I had found recently.   

Offline Don P

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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #34 on: January 15, 2020, 07:44:36 PM »
If I had a penny for every time something "got away"  :). Your mill will come along.

@Don P How are you hooking to the carriage in order to lift it.  I can't see from the picture.  Have you found a perfect balance point on the engine and installed a lift point ?

If you look at the pic we welded up a frame (painted black, old piece of bedframe angle) on the back of the carriage opposite the front push bar and at the same elevation. It shares the far carriage wheel bolts. Across the center we ran a square tube bar from that rear frame to the front push bar. There is a U bolt bolted to that bar at center of gravity front/rear. We have marked on the carriage the CG left/right with a sharpie. Before lifting, the engine is centered left/right and lock handle applied. The winch is on top of the "swingset". Its a little ~2000 lb ATV winch running on a motorcycle battery. It is charged with a little solar battery charger panel or in the barn we hit it with the plug in charger every few days of use. There is a shackle with a spring loaded gate hanging from the winch cable.

We usually saw as a 2 man team. As I'm finishing the 1st cut my tail man is holding the hook and winch control. I'm throttling down and centering the engine. We are on opposite diagonal sides of the carriage. He lifts the carriage wheels clear of the rails we both walk around spinning the carriage with us. I pick up the winch control and lower as he guides his wheels and I guide mine back onto track. He unclips as I move the engine into place left/right and throttle up.

The legs of the swingset are just slid up into the next size of pipe that are welded to the top horizontal pipe, there is a winch and battery platform welded on top of that top bar. We took the upper bolted on part of the swing handle off to clear our parts.
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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #35 on: January 16, 2020, 08:03:41 AM »
I wish some Turbosaw guys would give their thoughts on the 6-13.


TS is the newest to the game in that group, so fewest in the field by numbers.  However, the key people at TS came from Peterson if I remember right, so the experience is there and there are people on here who have them and have reviewed them if you search.  ;)
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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #36 on: January 16, 2020, 08:35:08 AM »
@Don P Thanks for the description.  I like the idea of a single lift point, instead of the four straps I use on the corners of the carriage.

 

 
Dave Rinker

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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #37 on: January 16, 2020, 05:57:00 PM »
Hi,

Just to clarify a couple of points regarding Turbosawmill:

1) The modern manual version can be extended to any length due to its cantilevered design. You just add additional legs (extra vertical winch posts).
2) The M12HD is also extendible due to this same design.

The only mill that is restricted to 26ft of cut length is our standard Automated range. This is due to the fact that the frame is located at the very end of the beam.

With regards to double cutting: In my opinion, the automated option is the best machine for this as you can set the feed rate while you lift the slab off the blade (at the other end of the log) without wedges. The guard can swing partially up to allow the double-cut too (without completely removing it). Also because of the worm drive which raises and lowers the unit you can adjust out the horizontal lead which matches the cut without playing with your blade settings.

Here is a quick video of some sawing I did while I was down south a week ago. It's our computer sizing option that we can fit with any of our automated mills.
The new section feature is now standard with the computer system. This same section option is also achievable on our hand-crank/drill operated option.

We will be at the Kentucky Farm show and the Oregon Conference showing our Automated mills in February.

Turbosawmill computer sizing - YouTube
Wife says I woke up one morning half asleep uttering thin kerf and high production, I think I need a hobby other than milling?

Offline Biocmp

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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #38 on: January 24, 2020, 09:46:51 PM »
Jake, I wish you'd bring a manual mill to the shows (specifically the midwest shows). I want to take one off your hands but i want to see it in action.  Do you have any videos setting it up on uneven ground? 

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Re: Swingblade Input/Advice
« Reply #39 on: Yesterday at 01:46:30 PM »
Wife says I woke up one morning half asleep uttering thin kerf and high production, I think I need a hobby other than milling?


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