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Author Topic: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.  (Read 38411 times)

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Offline Old Greenhorn

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Re: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.
« Reply #40 on: May 25, 2020, 09:24:08 PM »
I use 1-1/2 also. I found that the 2" stock seems like overkill, but I could be wrong. The tenon cutter runs onto the smaller stock easier. These legs are red oak, so pretty sturdy.
 As far as that bug goes, I do have some EWP laying about. I guess that is what they are after. I will keep and eye out.
Oscar 328 Band Mill, Husky 450, 372 (Clone), Mule 3010, and too many hand tools. :) Retired and trying to make a living to stay that way. NYLT Certified.
OK, maybe I am the woodcutter now.
I can work with wood, but I am NOT a Woodworker, yet.

Offline Brad_bb

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Re: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.
« Reply #41 on: May 26, 2020, 12:01:42 AM »
@btulloh       Here is the video I used to make my first one.  What I do that he doesn't is that I stack a second vortex barrel on the first for a hotter cleaner burn due to the chimney effect.
 https://youtu.be/-0J0zRiDAmE

Here is my video showing double versus single.  Almost no smoke with the double and burns hotter and faster.
Anything someone can design, I can sure figure out how to fix!
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Offline WV Sawmiller

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Re: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.
« Reply #42 on: May 26, 2020, 12:50:58 AM »
OGH,

  Yeah the heavier legs are likely overkill for the strength and weight requirements but I kind of like the bulkier look of them for rustic benches. I can see where 1-3/4" stock would sure be a lot easier to turn down with a tenon cutter. TEHO.
Howard Green
WM LT35HDG25(2015) , 2009 4wd Dodge PU, Kawasaki 650 ATV, Sthil 440 & 441, homemade logging arch (w/custom built rear log dolly), JD 750 w/4' wide Bushhog brand FEL

Dad always said "You can shear a sheep a bunch of times but you can only skin him once"

Offline Nebraska

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Re: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.
« Reply #43 on: May 26, 2020, 10:15:58 AM »
You retired fellas are making me feel bad with all you are accomplishing..my progress comes in fits and starts...I tried 3 inches but 2 3/4" fit into the throat of my tenon cutter better,  I got 16 legs squared up yesterday on the jointer and cut 8 tennons, between other projects and rainfall. I'm going to try 2 1/2" it should work fine, after all an inch and a half diameter of wood is doing the work.

Offline WV Sawmiller

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Re: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.
« Reply #44 on: May 26, 2020, 10:53:22 AM »
   My favorite legs are actually probably the quarter round ones I get when I quarter a straight 5-6 inch diameter log. I like to turn that rounded side out. 

    BTW, since my tenons often are a little off center I also keep a good size pipe wrench handy to turn the legs once driven into the mortise. Often just turning them a small amount will help line up the leg where I want it to go and sometimes even adjust the angle of the leg in or out a noticeable amount.

    I really like the 1-1/2" auger bit instead of using the spade bit or Forstner bit. I hope one day to find a boring machine to use instead of the half inch wrist breaking drill. I wonder if anyone has ever tried using an old ShopSmith and attaching the tenon cutter head instead of  drill bit on the boring option? I would need about 2' of length as that is about standard for my starting leg length. I may start with a leg as short as 20" but nothing less. I don't know if a SS has the power or how hard it would be to clamp them in the lathe since one end has to be free to cut the tenon on it.
Howard Green
WM LT35HDG25(2015) , 2009 4wd Dodge PU, Kawasaki 650 ATV, Sthil 440 & 441, homemade logging arch (w/custom built rear log dolly), JD 750 w/4' wide Bushhog brand FEL

Dad always said "You can shear a sheep a bunch of times but you can only skin him once"

Offline doc henderson

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Offline Nebraska

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Re: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.
« Reply #46 on: May 26, 2020, 12:43:43 PM »
If I had more than a "mister" drill press sitting on my work bench top. It's better than nothing but no way to do that. Kinda like the "Mr Microscope" I had in Jr high... that is for sure a better setup than mine.

Offline Old Greenhorn

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Re: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.
« Reply #47 on: May 26, 2020, 12:46:49 PM »
Nebraska I was right there with just a very few days ago. I was so sick of hearing my retired friends say "When you are retired, every day is Saturday!" I wanted that too, and now I have that. It just dawned me yesterday that in my world, I would spend all my available time during the week setting up for my weekend so I could work like mad to get everything done. Now that every day is 'Saturday' I am working my butt off nearly every day. This is gonna kill me at some point. I work each day until I am too pooped to do more. I have to re-think this. Yesterday i made up 24 legs and cut and tenoned them and did a few other things I have forgotten about. This morning I light sanded the coffee table, put another coat of urethane on the top and legs, made the locating blocks for the underside, drilled and screwed them in place.
 Then I went out and did another coat on the bottoms of those 6 benches and did a first coat on the 24 legs. Pooped by 11:30.
 I just like the appearance of the thinner legs. On the other hand I am coming around to making some benches flat on both sides. I came across some slabs in the pile that just might work well for a test.
 Now I have to fill up the afternoon. :D But the wife wants a live edge planter.
 On that burn barrel, that was more of a short term thing for me. Just cleaning up old rotten stuff that has no heat value. Its been laying around over 5 years. I was thinking about Brad's setup and I could find the thread either. Unless I really have time to kill it's too much for me. The spark plume coming out of that thing makes it tough for me to find a safe place to run it. Too much overhead around here except the middle of the back lawn.Once I am done with the cleanup I can keep up with all the routine burning. Brad, where is that thread?
 OK, break is over, back to work.
Oscar 328 Band Mill, Husky 450, 372 (Clone), Mule 3010, and too many hand tools. :) Retired and trying to make a living to stay that way. NYLT Certified.
OK, maybe I am the woodcutter now.
I can work with wood, but I am NOT a Woodworker, yet.

Offline ljohnsaw

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Re: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.
« Reply #48 on: May 26, 2020, 03:35:54 PM »
I don't know if a SS has the power or how hard it would be to clamp them in the lathe since one end has to be free to cut the tenon on it.
I have the original Shopsmith 10er (actually 3 but 1 is assembled).  The beauty of these machines is the versatility.  In the lathe configuration, it is also a horizontal boring machine.  You keep the table on it and clamp your stock to it.  You can raise and lower the table to get the stock lined up.  You can slide the table and your stock so it hits the tail stock for extra support to keep it from wanting to push away as you drill.  Most have the original 1/2 hp motor but you would have it belted down to half-speed so you should have plenty of power.  I have a 3/4hp on mine.
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Offline doc henderson

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Re: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.
« Reply #49 on: May 26, 2020, 04:10:02 PM »
I made one (fire barrel) like Brads, and it works well.  he posted his video on reply earlier in this thread.
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.  2007 Chevy 3500HD dually, home built log splitter 18 horse 28 gpm with 5 inch cylinder and 32 inch split range with conveyor 12 volt tarp motor

Offline WV Sawmiller

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Re: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.
« Reply #50 on: May 26, 2020, 05:13:00 PM »
   Now you guys are making me envious. I like Doc's set up with the drill press and the clamp/vice arrangement there to make the tenons. I don't think my little 5 speed HF drill press has the uummpf to do that. So @doc henderson when you get a box with 50-60 bench legs you know why. :D Be sure to ship them back by cheap freight. ;D

   @ljohnsaw  thanks for the info on the ShopSmith. One of these days maybe somebody will pay me to haul one off for scrap. I keep trying swap for a load of lumber but for some reason I keep finding the guys getting rid of their woodworking tools are generally not too interested in trading for lumber. Who'd have thought it? ::) ::)

    I have serious shop envy too. I am working mostly outside. I have a rough table built on to the front of my first lumber shed with an outlet there to run a drill, the drill press, belt sander, table saw, etc. I have a RAS built into a table on the other end of the shed about 25' away. When it rains I can have mud inches deep out there to contend with.
Howard Green
WM LT35HDG25(2015) , 2009 4wd Dodge PU, Kawasaki 650 ATV, Sthil 440 & 441, homemade logging arch (w/custom built rear log dolly), JD 750 w/4' wide Bushhog brand FEL

Dad always said "You can shear a sheep a bunch of times but you can only skin him once"

Offline doc henderson

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Re: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.
« Reply #51 on: May 26, 2020, 05:42:05 PM »
the tenon cutter manufacturers really discourage a drill press, but they make little horizontal braces to hole the drill.  I use it the other way to do compound angles on my benches, and do not like to keep changing it back and forth.  send me some.  If I go visit my aunt in Virginia, we will drop them off.   :)  or if VT has a solar drying class!  
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.  2007 Chevy 3500HD dually, home built log splitter 18 horse 28 gpm with 5 inch cylinder and 32 inch split range with conveyor 12 volt tarp motor

Offline doc henderson

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Re: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.
« Reply #52 on: May 26, 2020, 05:57:22 PM »
WV I like the through tenons, but find it hard to get a clean exit with my forstner bits, especially at compound angles of about 10 to 13.  so I make them blind tenons.  if they are loose, I have cut a groove in the tenon, and sized a wedge to go into the slot as I drive the tenon (leg) into the mortice.  I always use glue (titebond 3),  known technique but not sure what to call it.
timberking B 2000, 277c track loader, PJ 32 foot gooseneck, 1976 F700 state dump truck, JD 850 tractor.  2007 Chevy 3500HD dually, home built log splitter 18 horse 28 gpm with 5 inch cylinder and 32 inch split range with conveyor 12 volt tarp motor

Offline Old Greenhorn

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Re: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.
« Reply #53 on: May 26, 2020, 06:52:59 PM »
Howard, you shouldn't be too envious. I like working outside and had begun making a usable workspace at the old mill site and am just now starting to do it over up here behind the shop (refer to all the cleanup photos and references in prior posts) I have no covered outdoor space, so I envy you that. Still have to make a proper bench, maybe this week.I have been working all winter on the inside space as you know, but now when we have these few weeks when the weather is just right, I want to do everything outside (until ti gets uncomfortable). ALso, our outdoor seasons up here are a bit shorter than yours, and even Doc's. 6 weeks ago I was jealous of the weather and work conditions he had (home type work, not his work type work, I would not take that on for any money ;D).
 Those tenons really take a toll on me and my arms. I am seriously considering making one of those rotating table saw jigs that makes perfect tenons, every time. But I find the jig a little scary. What if the blade catches it and everything flies? Maybe I should just try it. If it works, I could really crank out some legs. (There was a thread here about it a year or two ago.)
 I have a confession. I am finding that I seem to be limited to only 6 or 7 hours work a day before I am pooped out. Now to be fully clear, those hours are pretty much flat out work with not a lot of thinking time involved, there is nobody here to talk to or have coffee with, there are no runs out for materials or anything like that. Straight work, but after that, I look around for easy stuff to do like clean something up, sharpen tools, or mow the lawn. (Don't tell the wife, but I might even be watching a movie or something.)
 After dinner I will put up a post with today's misdeeds. But I really need a shower first.
Oscar 328 Band Mill, Husky 450, 372 (Clone), Mule 3010, and too many hand tools. :) Retired and trying to make a living to stay that way. NYLT Certified.
OK, maybe I am the woodcutter now.
I can work with wood, but I am NOT a Woodworker, yet.

Offline WV Sawmiller

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Re: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.
« Reply #54 on: May 26, 2020, 08:31:23 PM »
@doc henderson ,

  Because I make my mortises at an angle I have not had any luck getting the Forstner bit to work so I used the spade bit but I am really liking this 1-1/2" auger. I start from the top and find I really need the bench top resting tightly on a piece of scrap stock so the bit does not break out as badly if at all. Here is the auger bit.



 I feel this is making a cleaner cut even at angles. I also sometimes drive a metal sledgehammer wedge into the end of the tenon after I have cut off the excess. That really tightens the tenon in the mortise. If you don't like seeing the metal wedge you could countersink it with a little flat bar then fill in the gap with wood or putty. Yes, I glue the tenon before driving it into the mortise and cutting off the the excess with the Japanese pull saw.

  If you get to Va Tech you are 66 miles from my house. I don 't know how far it is to your Aunt. :D

OGH,

  The table saw technique for making tenons is impressive but it cuts a flat surface at the base of the tenon while my Lumberjack tenon cutter leaves a 60 degree shoulder which is handy since I am putting my legs on at an angle. Since you are using rounded slabs with the round on the bottom the angled shoulder looks like it would be an advantage for you too.

  I make benches sometimes where the top is only 6-7 wide so the angled legs are critical for stability as they would fall over too easily if drilled in straight. The angled legs make cutting to length on the mill another advantage as the mill cuts the same height an angle on each leg so they sit perfectly square to the floor or deck.
Howard Green
WM LT35HDG25(2015) , 2009 4wd Dodge PU, Kawasaki 650 ATV, Sthil 440 & 441, homemade logging arch (w/custom built rear log dolly), JD 750 w/4' wide Bushhog brand FEL

Dad always said "You can shear a sheep a bunch of times but you can only skin him once"

Offline Old Greenhorn

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Re: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.
« Reply #55 on: May 26, 2020, 08:47:24 PM »
OK, I had dinner and a shower and they were both great. :D The temp hit 87, never saw that coming. My feet were on fire.
I started the day in the shop. I cut some blocks to locate the top on those legs, drilled and screwed them in place. My intent is that these will locate the top centered on the legs and keep it from moving, but make it easy to remove the top for transport. The top is heavy enough that it really does not need to be screwed down.

 

I stood it up to get a look and it doesn't look too bad.


 

I took the top off and threw a coat of urethane on the blocks, then flipped it, did a light sanding on the top and did a second coat on that. I also sanded and touched up the legs in some spots.
Then I headed outside. I took all the legs and laid them out and put a first coat of urethane on them. It's easier to do when they are un-assembled and it goes fairly quick. Then I did a second coat on the bench bottoms.


 



 

It was getting hot, especially in the sun. It was 11:30 so I took lunch. That little burn I got yesterday had blistered up by last evening so I covered it with a gauze pad. This morning I needed to put a clean one on and when I took the old one off, this is what I found.


 
It's a pretty healthy blister now and I know from experience, if these are not protected and kept clean, they can get pretty painful  at least, and easily infected at worst. SO I re-dressed it and was careful all day not to break it. I re-dressed and checked it twice during the day. All good. Even managed to scrub the pine sap of my hands twice today without breaking it. Tonight I left it dressed for my shower and when I went to put a dry one on later, I found it had popped. So I drained it and am letting it air dry. I will cover it again before bed. It worries me a bit because I know a blister this size can sideline me for a few days if I can't keep it clean.
Anyway, after lunch I figured I would keep the wife happy and make those planter boxes she wanted. An hour or so later they were done.


 

Just quick and dirty was what she wanted, and what she got. It's very fresh pine so I was wearing a lot of sap. ;D After that I cleaned up the tools and covered the mill. I did a few odds and ends in the shop, sanded some cookies I have been working on forever, and checked the drying progress on the top (looking good).
Al in all not a bad day. I have to start getting back in the zone to go in and finish up work on Friday. To that end I had an hour long phone conversation today with my new boss ( as of last week, our department was transferred to another manager). So that was a bizarre combination of a 'getting to know you" interview combined with a "nice working with you/ exit interview". :D I am going to have to spend some time shaving to get cleaned up, the beard is getting ugly and out of control. It is actually on my 'things to do' list this week. I just can't seem to make time for it. ;D
Just saw your new post Howard. I had problems with the forstener bits also doing angles, especially in round bottoms. Here is how I do it: I start the bit (slow) square to the surface, then without pushing it to drive it, once the center is holding I begin to lift the drill to the angle I want so it only cuts on the one side, once I hit the target angle, then I begin the push to go through. My problem is getting the same angle on all 4 legs. :D I'll try to get some better detail photos on how I do this, or maybe a video if I get adventurous. ;D To prevent the breakout issues I put a nice flat piece on hardwood under it to drill into. I also do not do any final sanding until the legs are in, glued and sawed off. By then, any little chips seem to never be an issue.
Oscar 328 Band Mill, Husky 450, 372 (Clone), Mule 3010, and too many hand tools. :) Retired and trying to make a living to stay that way. NYLT Certified.
OK, maybe I am the woodcutter now.
I can work with wood, but I am NOT a Woodworker, yet.

Offline WV Sawmiller

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Re: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.
« Reply #56 on: May 26, 2020, 09:09:58 PM »
   When I first started making benches I experimented with a jig to cut the mortises all the same angle but I quickly abandoned that and now I just free-hand them. The tenons also often cut at a bit of an angle instead of perfectly in line with the leg so angling the leg a bit with a pipe wrench also adjusts the angle of the leg in or out.  Cutting on the mill resolves the final angle making it, the base cut, 90 degrees to the deck even if the legs are not all perfectly aligned at the same angle. I can honestly say every bench is one of a kind and not a boring assembly line product.
Howard Green
WM LT35HDG25(2015) , 2009 4wd Dodge PU, Kawasaki 650 ATV, Sthil 440 & 441, homemade logging arch (w/custom built rear log dolly), JD 750 w/4' wide Bushhog brand FEL

Dad always said "You can shear a sheep a bunch of times but you can only skin him once"

Online thecfarm

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Re: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.
« Reply #57 on: May 26, 2020, 09:11:07 PM »
I am looking so forward to being retired!!!!!
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

Offline Old Greenhorn

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Re: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.
« Reply #58 on: May 26, 2020, 09:36:57 PM »
Howard, you mentioned square corners in the tenon. This is the jig type I had in mind. There is a thread here on the forum with a different jig, but I just can't find it.

Oscar 328 Band Mill, Husky 450, 372 (Clone), Mule 3010, and too many hand tools. :) Retired and trying to make a living to stay that way. NYLT Certified.
OK, maybe I am the woodcutter now.
I can work with wood, but I am NOT a Woodworker, yet.

Offline moodnacreek

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Re: Staying Busy and out of trouble, 2020-21?.
« Reply #59 on: May 26, 2020, 09:40:44 PM »
I tell people I am retired to get them to back off. Need to close to get caught up sawing. The walnut logs [4000] feet are starting to slip the bark and crack and I have beautiful cedar that is end checking. I have everything I wanted 30 years ago.


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