The Forestry Forum is sponsored in part by:

iDRY Vacuum Kilns


Forestry Forum
Sponsored by:


TimberKing Sawmills



Toll Free 1-800-582-0470

LogRite Tools



Norwood Industries Inc.




Your source for Portable Sawmills, Edgers, Resaws, Sharpeners, Setters, Bandsaw Blades and Sawmill Parts

EZ Boardwalk Sawmills. More Saw For Less Money!

STIHLDealers.com sponsored by Northeast STIHL


Woodland Sawmills

Peterson Swingmills

 KASCO SharpTech WoodMaxx Blades

Turbosawmill

Sawmill Exchange

Michigan Firewood, your BRUTE FORCE Authorized Dealer

Baker Products

ECHO-Bearcat

iDRY Wood Lumber Vacuum Drying for everyon

Nyle Kiln Dry Systems

Chainsawr, The Worlds Largest Inventory of Chainsaw Parts

Smith Sawmill Service

Dynamic Green Products Inc.





Author Topic: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working  (Read 496 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline TFordALA

  • member
  • *
  • Posts: 7
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« on: September 14, 2020, 06:15:04 AM »
 

 I have a 2002 Hydro Ax 670 with a Feller Head on it...Everything works fine on the cutting head but the cutting wheel motor..I have found a switch with 3 wires cut off and they are Red Green And Yellow..The head is a Blount Model # 22BSAWSC and Serial # SA14962..I cannot find any thing on this cutting head to tell me the name of the switch or a wiring diagram..I will insert a picture of machine and switch..its located just behind the cutting head motor with the main feed line running to it..

 

 

 

Offline mike_belben

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 5611
  • Location: Middle TN
  • Pulp Friction
    • Share Post
Re: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« Reply #1 on: September 14, 2020, 06:36:58 AM »
Revelation 3:20

Offline kiko

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1022
  • Location: Middle Georgia
    • Share Post
Re: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« Reply #2 on: September 14, 2020, 09:06:56 AM »
That plug on the head is the wiring for the saw speed sensor.  Completely unnecessary. The control to turn the saw on is located behind the cab.

 

 

Offline kiko

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1022
  • Location: Middle Georgia
    • Share Post
Re: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« Reply #3 on: September 14, 2020, 09:46:23 AM »
Correction , that switch in saw head is related to the side cut door. Still not necessary to operate saw disc.

Offline TFordALA

  • member
  • *
  • Posts: 7
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
Re: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« Reply #4 on: September 14, 2020, 10:24:06 AM »
Do I need to jack the cab up to find the control for the saw? Im not to sure on what im looking for.

Offline TFordALA

  • member
  • *
  • Posts: 7
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
Re: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« Reply #5 on: September 14, 2020, 10:33:44 AM »
When I flip the switch to kick on the saw head..it pulls engine way down..I can then click on the hydraulic button and motor evens out. If i click off the hydraulic button it pulls the motor right back down but head wont turn at all.

Offline kiko

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1022
  • Location: Middle Georgia
    • Share Post
Re: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« Reply #6 on: September 14, 2020, 01:02:47 PM »
The saw solonoid is behind the cab mounted to the support


 
It accessed from the engine cover closet to the cab left hand side. One of the hoses from the solonoid will go directly to the saw pump compensator. The saw pump will be on the bottom of the gear box on the  same side.  The saw circuit and the hydraulic circuit are seperate each with its own pump.  And when I say saw it means only the saw motor that spins the disc. The clamp and accumulator arm work off the hydraulic pump same as the boom and tilt. I don't know the your history with the machine, but it seems some lines are crossed going to the head.

Offline TFordALA

  • member
  • *
  • Posts: 7
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
Re: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« Reply #7 on: September 14, 2020, 04:29:25 PM »
I found that and when I click the switch in the cab..the 1 line going to pump attached to bell housing makes a crazy noise like gears slipping...I hit the hydraulics button inside and the noise stops..the pump and lines get hot real quick as well.

Offline kiko

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1022
  • Location: Middle Georgia
    • Share Post
Re: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« Reply #8 on: September 14, 2020, 05:04:38 PM »
I don't have a factory diagram so I drew this . I am not an artist.  Is it the saw pump that gets hot . Or is all if them?  The pumps are not actually attached to the flywheel housing but rather the pump drive gear box that is attached to the flywheel housing. I don't think that low oil in the gearbox is your issue but is very important to check oil regularly as that gear box is supper expensive and hard to come by.  Uses 90w gear oil should be a dipstick to check.  It is odd that pilot button makes the noise go away. 


 

Offline TFordALA

  • member
  • *
  • Posts: 7
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
Re: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« Reply #9 on: September 14, 2020, 05:21:05 PM »
Just the pump and lines the control switch is running to..the other pump stays cool but the 1 for the saw will be real hot to the touch and lines as well...

Offline mike_belben

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 5611
  • Location: Middle TN
  • Pulp Friction
    • Share Post
Re: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« Reply #10 on: September 14, 2020, 08:40:20 PM »
Something is deadheading and going over a relief. 
Revelation 3:20

Offline kiko

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1022
  • Location: Middle Georgia
    • Share Post
Re: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« Reply #11 on: September 14, 2020, 09:30:15 PM »
^^^^^ , the saw works off the setting on the pump compensator but has a main and port relief

 

Offline kiko

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1022
  • Location: Middle Georgia
    • Share Post
Re: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« Reply #12 on: September 14, 2020, 09:34:36 PM »
Try this one

saw pump is called attachment pump 

Offline mike_belben

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 5611
  • Location: Middle TN
  • Pulp Friction
    • Share Post
Re: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« Reply #13 on: September 15, 2020, 01:21:39 AM »
I think you have a valve spool on there that is bent, broken or otherwise hung up.  Something seems to be not making a full shift.  


If its open centered the path to tank gets blocked and path to saw motor should simultaneously be revealed but part 2 is not occuring and all flow is forcing the relief open, that is your crazy noise and source of heat.

If its closed centered with a piston pump then i think a swash plate is tilting as it should to turn the pump output flow from no to whoa, but somehow the flow path to saw motor is unavailable.  If you acquired the machine like this or some "mechanic" fooled with something and this was the outcome, suspect incorrect hose routing.  Any other malfunctioning circuits?  Make absolutely certain that the flow has not been routed to a case drain port on the hydraulic motor.  


If it was working and then this change happened on its own, start looking at all valve spools in the saw circuit.  If they are servo controlled figure out what the voltages should be vs what they are.  If its magnetic coils that pull spools, pull the end coils off and check the voltage, resistance and magnetism.  You may have a dead solenoid coil or failing wire that cant carry sufficient amps to generate the necessary volume of magnetic flux to shift the spool over. Look for any [safe] way to manually shift the spool.  Little shifter buttons or holes intentionally there by the manufacturer for a screwdriver or allen wrench to change the spool position for troubleshooting arent uncommon in solenoid hydraulic valves.


If the spool is spring centered/returned, pull the backcap or solenoid endcaps and be sure it isnt a bungled spring, rust ball, frozen detent or dirt dauber nest inside.


If this is a hydraulic pilot control look for leaking in the control pilot side and check pressure, stroke and return of control piston and so forth.


Hope this helps you get some general ideas anyway.
Revelation 3:20

Offline kiko

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1022
  • Location: Middle Georgia
    • Share Post
Re: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« Reply #14 on: September 15, 2020, 08:46:59 AM »
I think figured it out.  There are multiple issues. There is an electrical problem. You should never be able to turn the saw on prior to turning the hydraulics on. There is a malfunction or someone has bypassed some wires. The hydraulic button only turns on the pilot pressure. The spool on the valve is activated with pilot pressure, so if you engage the pump with hydraulics off the valve spool is centered thus the deadhead.  However, the pump is internally regulated piston pump so even if it went against a dead head it should destroke to minimum displacement and not load the engine. The pump could be hung on displacement as Mike said. For now the hydraulics need to be engaged first then the saw on and diagnosis can be done. Gotta get a guage and caps and plugs.

Offline TFordALA

  • member
  • *
  • Posts: 7
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
Re: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« Reply #15 on: September 15, 2020, 06:34:02 PM »
Today we cleaned it up alot so we could see stuff better..the saw pump gets hot within a few seconds of running..Flip the switch and the control switch for the saw pump comes on..Small Hyd line goes from it to the Saw pump and 1 coming from main line feeds the control switch..its vibrates real bad and boggs the engine down..so I can flip the Pilot switch inside and turn on Hyd's..and the control switch for the saw pump cuts off..thus letting engine come back to normal idle. You 2 guys have a real help and thank you both..

Offline mike_belben

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 5611
  • Location: Middle TN
  • Pulp Friction
    • Share Post
Re: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« Reply #16 on: September 15, 2020, 09:54:57 PM »
Are there any check valves in the saw circuit @kiko ?   Any chance the saw hoses are backward and flow is hitting a directional check?
Revelation 3:20

Offline kiko

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 1022
  • Location: Middle Georgia
    • Share Post
Re: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« Reply #17 on: September 15, 2020, 10:37:35 PM »
There is a check valve in the circuit. It is only used to create a loop when the saw is turned off so it can coast to stop, other wise cutting off the saw momentum  would turn the motor into a pump which would have to vent at the port relief. Violent and bad on the motor esp shaft seal.  If this check was stuck open the saw would not work at all because oil sent out of port A would be open to port B.

Offline mike_belben

  • Senior Member x2
  • *****
  • Posts: 5611
  • Location: Middle TN
  • Pulp Friction
    • Share Post
Re: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« Reply #18 on: September 16, 2020, 07:27:06 AM »
I gotcha.. So its sorta like a motor spool center to allow the rotor inertia to wind down. 

Well i hope the OP gets it sorted soon and makes some chips. 
Revelation 3:20

Offline TFordALA

  • member
  • *
  • Posts: 7
  • I'm new!
    • Share Post
Re: Hydro Ax 670 Cutting Head not working
« Reply #19 on: September 16, 2020, 09:08:33 AM »
 
<

I need to find the red switch. They have a piece of tape holding it in the "On" position and its for the Hydraulics. Where can I buy this switch and can fix 1 problem easy I hope.  Thanks again..


Share via delicious Share via digg Share via facebook Share via linkedin Share via pinterest Share via reddit Share via stumble Share via tumblr Share via twitter

xx
Old Hydro-Ax 520 with 8' cutter head

Started by john_bud on Forestry and Logging

1 Replies
2133 Views
Last post December 22, 2007, 02:02:25 PM
by Gary_C
xx
Hydro-ax shear head. where do I buy knives?

Started by Sam Strom on Forestry and Logging

3 Replies
385 Views
Last post February 28, 2020, 09:12:49 PM
by timbco68
xx
Lt40 head feed/drive not working well

Started by Dan_Shade on Sawmills and Milling

4 Replies
637 Views
Last post March 07, 2018, 02:26:08 PM
by terrifictimbersllc
xx
Mill head Cutting speed

Started by opticsguy on Sawmills and Milling

3 Replies
359 Views
Last post September 25, 2018, 03:19:21 PM
by ladylake
 


Powered by EzPortal