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Author Topic: Flooring for new workshop, WO vs SYP  (Read 943 times)

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Offline arky217

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Flooring for new workshop, WO vs SYP
« on: October 14, 2020, 11:04:13 PM »
Going to be milling flooring soon for a 20x20 workshop.
Joists are 24" on center. All framing lumber is SYP.
I have SYP or white oak to choose from; the floor will be put down green.

What thickness would you suggest for SYP ?  For oak ?
6" wide boards vs 8" wide boards ? (average tree size is 10" to 12")

Offline LeeB

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Re: Flooring for new workshop, WO vs SYP
« Reply #1 on: October 15, 2020, 12:56:39 AM »
The pine will shrink a little less. Smaller gaps.
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Offline Ianab

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Re: Flooring for new workshop, WO vs SYP
« Reply #2 on: October 15, 2020, 02:25:11 AM »
The pine will shrink a little less. Smaller gaps.
And 6" would have smaller gaps than 8" 
Go a bit thicker with the pine, and it will be plenty strong enough. 
A white oak floor would be awesome, but I'd think you would want that dried and properly machined. 
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Offline farmfromkansas

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Re: Flooring for new workshop, WO vs SYP
« Reply #3 on: October 15, 2020, 03:51:07 AM »
On 2' centers, I would make it 1 1/2" thick. Or, lay one layer of 1", then when the building is done, add another 1" layer. Either variety will make a good floor.
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Offline scsmith42

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Re: Flooring for new workshop, WO vs SYP
« Reply #4 on: October 15, 2020, 06:50:23 AM »
One thing that you may want to consider is milling some 5/4 pine, stickering it with some fans on it for a few weeks in order to accelerate air drying.

It will shrink much less when installed if you can get it dried first. Usually only takes 8 weeks or less if you have fans running on it - even at this time of year.
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Offline arky217

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Re: Flooring for new workshop, WO vs SYP
« Reply #5 on: November 14, 2020, 10:33:14 PM »
Well, the workshop is done except for the floor
and I'm ready to mill the flooring and put it down green
as I mill it.

Here's the plan:
Mill the flooring 6/4 x 6" wide and attach it to the joists
'smily' side up with (1) 3" screw per joist in the middle
of the board.

Then, about a year later, unscrew the boards,
run the top side through my 12" planer (mostly just
to make the floor easier to sweep), then slide the boards
back tight together to remove the gaps and nail
them 3 nails per joist with 3" galvanized ring shank
framing nails. (Won't look fancy, but hey, it's just a workshop)

(If any boards are bowed significantly when unscrewing
them, I will put them back on the mill and edge them again)

Finally, apply a coat  transparent stain or maybe, like my house,
a coat of 'porch & floor' paint, followed by a coat
of high wear polyurethane.

What do you think of this method ?
Is there something I'm overlooking ?
Arky217

Offline JoshNZ

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Re: Flooring for new workshop, WO vs SYP
« Reply #6 on: November 15, 2020, 12:55:06 AM »
I like it. I'm all about using green timber while it dries I try to push that exact idea haha. Put your beer on your rough sawn slab for a year and then dismantle and finish it

Your middle nail will go through your screw hole I take it? You'd probably get away with screwing slightly to the side so you can use 2 nails after finishing

Offline Ruffgear

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Re: Flooring for new workshop, WO vs SYP
« Reply #7 on: November 15, 2020, 09:05:15 AM »
After a year there will be a lot of dirt in the wood and be hard on planer blades. Using what you saw is always the goal, but I'd consider selling and putting plywood down. Add hardwood later after it's dried if you'd like

Offline SawyerTed

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Re: Flooring for new workshop, WO vs SYP
« Reply #8 on: November 15, 2020, 09:32:48 AM »
I like Ruffgear’s approach.  Put down a subfloor of whatever you have pine or oak.  Use the subfloor until you have enough oak dried. Then machine the oak to be straight and square prior to installing.
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Offline RobS

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Re: Flooring for new workshop, WO vs SYP
« Reply #9 on: November 15, 2020, 12:26:56 PM »
I don't know about you, but after a year my shop would be packed wall to wall with "stuff".  Are you prepared to empty the shop in a year to redo the floors?  Planning now may save alot of extra work later.
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Online mike_belben

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Re: Flooring for new workshop, WO vs SYP
« Reply #10 on: November 15, 2020, 02:07:59 PM »
What RobS said
Revelation 3:20

Offline arky217

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Re: Flooring for new workshop, WO vs SYP
« Reply #11 on: November 15, 2020, 05:29:51 PM »
After a year there will be a lot of dirt in the wood and be hard on planer blades. Using what you saw is always the goal, but I'd consider selling and putting plywood down. Add hardwood later after it's dried if you'd like
That's the great thing about this forum; you can get input on things that you never considered.

I never thought about a year's worth of dirt dulling the planer blades; a very good point.
I think now that I will plane the top of the boards now before I install them.
Also, the SYP, being green, should be a lot easier on the planer blades than after it's dried.

As to selling the wood and using plywood, not much market for rough sawn SYP in this area and
I for sure am not going to use plywood at today's prices.
I also thought about after the boards dried of covering them with cheap linoleum, however, there
is no such thing as cheap anything anymore.

I like Ruffgear’s approach.  Put down a subfloor of whatever you have pine or oak.  Use the subfloor until you have enough oak dried. Then machine the oak to be straight and square prior to installing.
That's a thought, but I just don't want to go to all that effort to mill the oak, wait for it to dry, and probably
have to re-edge it to get it straight. This is just a rough built workshop; not taking any pains to make it 
look fancy. In fact, I wouldn't even go to the trouble of repositioning the boards at all except to get rid of
what will probably be 1/4" gaps or more.

I don't know about you, but after a year my shop would be packed wall to wall with "stuff".  Are you prepared to empty the shop in a year to redo the floors?  Planning now may save alot of extra work later.
Well, I really don't have all that much stuff to put in the workshop.
And after the boards have dried, I will remove and reposition the boards a few rows at a time and just
slide stuff over on the repositioned boards as I go along.

Another thought; I think that I will reuse the screws back in the same holes in the boards (they will go into
a different spot on the joists) and use my nail gun to add two ring shank nails, one each about 1" in from
the edges.

Thanks for all the input; really a great forum !



Arky217

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Re: Flooring for new workshop, WO vs SYP
« Reply #12 on: November 15, 2020, 06:05:57 PM »
Planing green is nearly impossible, you'll need to give it a bit of drying time or it just won't feed. I'll do it for a miscut or two, push/pull and cuss but usually even there I'll stand them up in the breeze for a few days.
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Offline arky217

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Re: Flooring for new workshop, WO vs SYP
« Reply #13 on: November 15, 2020, 07:38:40 PM »
Planing green is nearly impossible, you'll need to give it a bit of drying time or it just won't feed. I'll do it for a miscut or two, push/pull and cuss but usually even there I'll stand them up in the breeze for a few days.
I didn't realize that; another good tip.
I might try a board or two just to see how bad it is.
If it refuses to plane green, I'll just forgo the planing.
Or, after the boards have dried, I might try to power wash the dirt off and try planing.
Thanks.
Arky217

Offline forrestM

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Re: Flooring for new workshop, WO vs SYP
« Reply #14 on: November 15, 2020, 09:03:28 PM »
Did you use green SYP for your framing? i just framed a 10x9 "outhouse" with 2x4 poplar right off the mill. I have some SYP I could use, but was worried about the sap if using green. What was your (and other's) experience like with SYP?

btw, I used 2x8 floor joists at 20" OC and put 5/4 thick poplar boards down on top of that for the floor. 3 three inch screws over each joist. I did use a router to cut in a 3/8 deep shiplap to compensate for any shrinking. Some of my boards are 18 inches wide, so I may still end up with a gap!

thanks,
forrest


Offline arky217

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Re: Flooring for new workshop, WO vs SYP
« Reply #15 on: November 15, 2020, 09:54:23 PM »
Did you use green SYP for your framing? i just framed a 10x9 "outhouse" with 2x4 poplar right off the mill. I have some SYP I could use, but was worried about the sap if using green. What was your (and other's) experience like with SYP?

btw, I used 2x8 floor joists at 20" OC and put 5/4 thick poplar boards down on top of that for the floor. 3 three inch screws over each joist. I did use a router to cut in a 3/8 deep shiplap to compensate for any shrinking. Some of my boards are 18 inches wide, so I may still end up with a gap!

thanks,
forrest
I used SYP that I cut this past summer; it was dried to less than 20% when I framed the workshop.
I did have to put some of the bowed and warped pieces back on the mill to get a straight edge.

The size is 20x20; it sits on 9 concrete piers.
I used (actual measurements) (6) 6x10 for the sills, 2x8 for the joists, 2x4 for the studs, 
1x8 for the roof boards, 1x7 for the siding, 1.5x4 for the plates and truss members
 (to be compatible with 3" nailgun nails).
I'll mill 1.5x6 for the floor boards and install as stated above.

I haven't installed the siding yet. I thought about using a router to cut shiplap on the boards,
but I'm going to try a different approach that should be quite a bit faster and make just as tight a joint.
I'm planning to put the 1x7's back on the mill (several at a time) and lean them at about 20 degrees 
over a slanted cant, cut a straight edge, flip them and cut the other edge.

Then nail them flat against the studs. This will make the joints between the boards slanted downward
so as to keep water from entering the joints. The re-edgeing will also make sure the joints are tight as
it will take out any bowed or concave edges.
Arky217

Offline kantuckid

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Re: Flooring for new workshop, WO vs SYP
« Reply #16 on: November 16, 2020, 08:34:52 AM »
Pulling up the floor makes zero sense to me? It might be more logical to pay money for drier wood if the projects stopped based on wet wood?  
You don't say what use the shop will have but if woodworking the surface must be smooth or keeping it clean enough for good health will be nigh impossible.
I used air dried ERC, sawed 1 1/8"x6" for the new porch floors on my home and planed the bad side when air dried then lightly sanded the bandsawed up sides of my floor boards with a DA sander using 180 grit. I also broke the edges of each board with a hand plane to a 1/8" bevel.  It made a surface that can be swept, dust mopped, etc. plus it feels OK on bare feet.
Not sure I understand the siding idea?
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