Timbco 415ex??

[Riwaka]

How far away are the Husqvarna 592's,new chainsaw or two will be a lower cost than any machine?

Most of the old forest machines appear to be in us$80K to us$100K range, to roll the dice on. A few in the us$100K to us$150K bracket  that are  probably stronger and heavier & not as old. 

[snowstorm]

A few have said it's a bad idea. I say go for it. I would look for a machine in the 15k hr or so. By them the pumps may have been replaced. And buy a nice set of wrench's you will need them but running old gear now you there are things to repair at times. Good luck

[Firewoodjoe]

I appreciate everyone's opinions. That's why I ask I get good debate on here. But in the equipment I can afford I don't look at hours. I look at condition and history. Beyond so many hours all equipment can be good or junk. Just how it is. And there's not much out there right now. I want a Fabtek head period. And I'm not driving all over the county just to save a few thousand if there's machines in my area. Things are getting pretty close on this 415ex. We'll find out if I want it next week. 

[Southside]

I have an older Fabtek on a JD 490 carrier. For sure I would never keep up with anything modern, and the old hose eater has her moments, but it fells trees in the size it was built for just fine and with pine I can process a fair bit larger than she was designed to handle and do just fine. 

Nice thing is she can sit when I am too busy with everything else and I don't have to worry about making a payment. 

[barbender]

Really, don't take my opinion too seriously. I mean that. My observation point is from a low hour machine I get paid to run by someone else. I remember one time on here an Appalachian logger was asking about old JD 450 crawler loaders. He was considering one for loading out trucks with big hardwood logs, apparently they had a huge lift capacity. My opinion was, my uncle had one and with a 6 way blade on it, it would've been a useful machine but with that front end loader I thought it was the slowest, most useless piece of iron I'd ever sat on. Well he ignored my advice and bought one, and it turned out to be the perfect machine for what he wanted to use it for.  Your operating environment, expectations for production, etc. are different in a lot of ways from what I work around every day, and the machine you're considering could be a perfect fit for your outfit. That Timbco Bargemonkey runs has laid a mountain (many mountains, actually) of wood down for him over the years. It's got a barsaw bunching head, not a processor. But as a base machine it seems pretty reliable. You know your operation, contracts, cash flow and mechanical abilities. If you are confident in all of those, I'd say go for it too👍

[BargeMonkey]

"You can't cut wood with a barsaw timbco"... 😄... yeah... 
 @Firewoodjoe  I'm in the same boat buddy, looking at better iron and risking the gamble. The one thing the fabtek 4 rollers have going for them is Crosstrac seems to support them and has the 2 roller conversion. I spoke to them and they seem like good people, a guy 3hrs west of me bought a used Timberpro combo from them and had only good things to say. 
 If I stay cutting wood I've got no choice but to find a decent 6 wheeler and a dangle head, I could be working and finished with this job right now not fighting the mud. 

[Firewoodjoe]

Thanks guys. If all this goes as planed then the next machine will have a larger cutting diameter. Which means it will most like be a dangle head. But! I have to hand cut for a H8HD and a 624 Waratah because the woods to big. They have about 6-8" larger cutting diameter than the Fabtek Head. My area seems to like dangle and fabtek style heads. Go north 1 hour and it's mostly track machines fixed head. Lots of cf18s and cf22s. 

[Skeans1]

"You can't cut wood with a barsaw timbco"... 😄... yeah...
@Firewoodjoe  I'm in the same boat buddy, looking at better iron and risking the gamble. The one thing the fabtek 4 rollers have going for them is Crosstrac seems to support them and has the 2 roller conversion. I spoke to them and they seem like good people, a guy 3hrs west of me bought a used Timberpro combo from them and had only good things to say.
If I stay cutting wood I've got no choice but to find a decent 6 wheeler and a dangle head, I could be working and finished with this job right now not fighting the mud.

That'd be JP Skidmore making the stuff for the old 2000 series heads Crostrek is the dealer for them.

[Skeans1]

Really, don't take my opinion too seriously. I mean that. My observation point is from a low hour machine I get paid to run by someone else. I remember one time on here an Appalachian logger was asking about old JD 450 crawler loaders. He was considering one for loading out trucks with big hardwood logs, apparently they had a huge lift capacity. My opinion was, my uncle had one and with a 6 way blade on it, it would've been a useful machine but with that front end loader I thought it was the slowest, most useless piece of iron I'd ever sat on. Well he ignored my advice and bought one, and it turned out to be the perfect machine for what he wanted to use it for. Your operating environment, expectations for production, etc. are different in a lot of ways from what I work around every day, and the machine you're considering could be a perfect fit for your outfit. That Timbco Bargemonkey runs has laid a mountain (many mountains, actually) of wood down for him over the years. It's got a barsaw bunching head, not a processor. But as a base machine it seems pretty reliable. You know your operation, contracts, cash flow and mechanical abilities. If you are confident in all of those, I'd say go for it too👍

The 415 and the 425/445 the only parts they share is a cab the rest of the machine is completely different.

[Firewoodjoe]

This is more Valmet/Komatsu than a old timbco. Sisu engine and I believe all Komatsu undercarried. It's been ALL resealed some new hoses. Paperwork on engine 3-4 years ago. Newer undercarriage. All mechanics notes and manuals. Only thing I'm not to happy with now, and didn't notice until Friday,  is the main boom has been welded and plated up where the jib boom pins on. I'm going to lay the boom down Monday and see what kind of a job was done. But some weld on a old machine will be enviable. 

[Skeans1]

@Firewoodjoe 
The sisu was only put in the 415 the pumps are different then the big brothers same with the track frames.

If memory serves the 425 is a 250 sized track frame well the 445 had the 300 or cat 330 bolt on track frames.

[Firewoodjoe]

Yeah I'm not comparing size. I'm comparing timbcos with cat undercarriage and Deere/Cummins engines. Like the 415b/c/d's

[barbender]

I have no personal experience with Sisu engines, but the Ponsse mechanics have a very low opinion of them.

[Firewoodjoe]

I've heard there as good as any other. Google it and they have good things said about them. Also I've found, around here anyways, anyone that has to do with Ponsse at all has a low opinion on anything other than Ponsse. 😂 no offense to anyone. They are good machines but I see them get worked on also😁 and these are new and next to new. It's just how equipment is. 

[snowstorm]

My 646 valmet says sisu logging America on the tag. They owned valmet for a while. The sisu motor was used in the rubber tired machines also. And there are some of them running in lobster boats up this way. I know of one that fished during the week and on race weekends he raced it and did pretty well. Pretty sure he said he turned it up another 1000rpm. The sisu marine distributor is in Farmington maine

[snowstorm]

If you have an interest in hot rod diesels.look up the maine lobster boat races on YouTube. I have been several times. It can get pretty wild. Years ago the 500 hp Mack v8 was the thing to beat now if not at least 1000hp or way more.

[chevytaHOE5674]

The Sisu motors are as good as any of the other non JD or Cummins diesels. They were used in a wide variety of applications with good success. I get parts for them from the "local" Agco dealer. I haven't run into any inherent problems with them. Just usual stuff like injectors, turbos, etc.

I ran a lot of hours in the Ponsses with Mercedes and put my fair share of turbos, injectors, wiring, etc in them. Had one chuck a rod thru the block, one burn 2 gallons of oil a day. They are good but far from perfect.

[barbender]

I'm not trying to plug for Ponsse or Mercedes, as I said I have zero personal experience with Sisu engines. I would say the Mercedes have generally been excellent for our operation. My boss would probably get them in his conventional equipment if he could. 

[Firewoodjoe]

Oh no doubt there good engines. I've ran them. Only complaint I had was in a truck the low end torque was not very good. 

[chevytaHOE5674]

My complaint with the Mercedes is where do you get parts?  Ponsse is the only place within 500 miles of here to get parts in any sort of reasonable time frame. And they aren't bashful on the pricing. Rebuild on a OM906 in an Ergo runs triple or more of say an 8.3 Cummins. 

Sisu can get parts from Komatsu or Agco. Cat, Perkins, Yanmar, JD, or Cummins are even easier.

[mike_belben]

I stopped to help out some drivers ontop the climb at black mountain NC.  A 2020 plastitruck with mercedes.  under 100k and the fan hub let go, fan into radiator.  Not the cheapest day. No other experience with electronic ones. 

[barbender]

I've actually heard plenty of complaints about Mecedes truck engines. I've noticed that certain engines seem to find "happy places" where they do really well. When I worked on a paving crew, Cat 3116 engines were everywhere in the Cat paving equipment. They were as fine of an engine as you could ask for. However, Ponsse ran them for a few of their early years, and people hated them. I also heard a lot of bad about them in medium duty trucks🤷🏽‍♂️ Mercedes does well in Ponsse CTL equipment, that I've seen firsthand. Our company finally sold one Buffalo forwarder we had that had 30K hours, original engine and still healthy. My buddy's Ergo was estimated over 35K hours when his finally started using oil excessively and was replaced.

[chevytaHOE5674]

Our first Ponsse Ergo ate a turbo at 18k, and lifted/warped a head at 19k (needed complete rebuild). Or first Ponsse forwarder roached 3 injectors before 20k and blew a rod thru the block at like 24k. 2nd forwarder started using 2 gallons of oil a day at 15k hours turned out it cracked a piston. Did a complete rebuild on it only to have it burn to the ground a few K hours later. 

Last week sent a 22k hour OM906LA from an Ergo to the machine shop and hauled a buddy's 30k hourJD 6068 there also. When I go pick them up I'll bet that Mercedes is at least 3x the bill.

[nativewolf]

Well maybe I am crazy but I think both the MB in the Ponsse and the Sissu are both fine engines.  Our valmet has a Sissu and it ran just fine (need to get it started again and sell).    I find that the freightliner folks have parts for the MB engines most of the time and that the others from Ponsse really are not that bad in terms of price and you are getting made in germany parts, no cheap chinese knock offs and like most things you get what you pay for (usually).  

[JLeBouton]

"You can't cut wood with a barsaw timbco"... 😄... yeah...
@Firewoodjoe  I'm in the same boat buddy, looking at better iron and risking the gamble. The one thing the fabtek 4 rollers have going for them is Crosstrac seems to support them and has the 2 roller conversion. I spoke to them and they seem like good people, a guy 3hrs west of me bought a used Timberpro combo from them and had only good things to say.
If I stay cutting wood I've got no choice but to find a decent 6 wheeler and a dangle head, I could be working and finished with this job right now not fighting the mud.

That'd be JP Skidmore making the stuff for the old 2000 series heads Crostrek is the dealer for them and US Forestry is the distributor for them.

That's not entirely true anymore. Yes, JP Skidmore is producing parts for the four roller heads. US Forestry is no longer involved, as they merged with another dealer out of Laona. JP Skidmore is working with many dealers as well as directly with loggers. Crosstrac, CJ Logging Equipment, and LMS Equipment are just a few examples. They do not have a distributor.