new WM BMS250MU, won't operate (my issue solved, others still have problems)

[fluidpowerpro]

Whoever is building these for them obviously has no quality control and Woodmizer does not either. With the number of issues reported here on this forum, it's obvious Woodmizer turned a blind eye and kept shipping them. Once quality issues are reported on an item from an outside vendor, it's pretty much standard procedure to flag all incoming shipments and test. You continue doing this until the vendor demonstrates they have the issue corrected. 

[jimbarry]

Man!!!! My story is not much different. ...

@newhollandnut is the board in your bms250mu a Sobanski board or an Elektryk board? 
Does yours have the jumper wires we have been discussing?
Does your machine have the green/yellow wire going into the right side 


 


or the left side of that transformer?



 

[jimbarry]

Ok, so I discovered something after looking over the pictures by @gmmills The terminal block on his circuit board was a different colour from mine. It got me thinking about the Sobanski board and the Elektryk boards. Different coloured terminal blocks, may indicate different sizes?

Test time. I've been trying to fit a jumper wire in the Elektryk board. I have a spare Sobanski board so let's see if it fits on that one.



 

Sure enough, the jumper wire fits in the terminal block of the Sobanski board. I am going to swap out this boards this afternoon (again) and we will see what happens.

[jimbarry]

FWIW, this is the test report that came with this second machine.



 

[Southside]

So just wondering out loud here.  Poland has an electric grid that runs on 50Hz, here in the states we are at 60Hz.  Can we tell if the components in these control units are set up for 50 or 60 Hz? 

[ladylake]

 The box  in the last pis says  50/60 hz.  Steve

[jimbarry]

A small update. I swapped out the circuit boards and put the Sobanski board back in place, with the jumpers 5 to 3 and 6 to 4.

It all started up. I shut it down and installed a blade. It was doing good for 30 seconds and then the P2 switch shut off and will not come back on. Meaning nothing works, motor, pump or advancer. I ran video while doing this so I am in the midst of uploading that to youtube. I put a link on in a bit.

[jimbarry]

Here is the video. If it matters, I was just started to increase the advancer speed when it all stopped working.

20220517 Woodmizer BMS250MU electrical issue - YouTube

[jimbarry]

With jumpers in place, @MattM  I ran those voltage tests again just out of curiosity. Different readings this time outlined in bold below.

Power (M1) on.
M2 switch will not come on as the machine is still in the same state as in the video I posted a few minutes ago.

Results:

Put one lead on 3 and one on 4, you should have 100-120 volts... reads 120-121V.
Put one on M2 Brown wire and one on M2 Blue wire should be 100-120v... reads 0V.
Put one test lead on 3 and one on M2 Blue... reads 121V
Put one lead on 4 the other on M2 Brown... reads 0V.

[fluidpowerpro]

FWIW, this is the test report that came with this second machine.



 

Looking at the report, all it appears to be is a verification that the units internal grounding system is working. In the US we call it a "high pot" test. There is no mention of actually testing the functions of the machine.

[Walnut Beast]

By the time you guys get things figured out your going to be a part of Woodmizer engineering team 😂

[fluidpowerpro]

Unfortunately I learned about high pot tests the hard way when an item we were manufacturing was causing the machine to fail the test. When a small solenoid valve coil was de-energized, it put a transient voltage spike back into the system which caused damage to other more delicate parts of the circuit. 

[jimbarry]

Another little update from this evening.

20220517 Woodmizer BMS250MU more electrical issue - YouTube

[terrifictimbersllc]

The second light not going on is consistent with what happens when the magnet you put on the blade  is in front of the sensor. That sensor is just a metal detector, and can shut the machine off if the blade approaches too closely which happens once in a while.

By no means am I assuming that this is your problem but if you haven't ruled it out it might contribute at times to the machine cutting out.

[terrifictimbersllc]

Also the machine I'm seeing in your hands is not the same as mine even though mine is the 110 V MU variant. The switches are different.

[jimbarry]

Also the machine I'm seeing in your hands is not the same as mine even though mine is the 110 V MU variant. The switches are different.

Your's look like this?  This was the first one we bought in 2018. The new ones are like the one's in the videos I have be presenting.

[gmmills]

The issue you are having now is indicative, as Terrifictimberllc stated previously, of the shut off sensor being tripped.  Get the blade out of machine and then try again. If all works properly, the blade is tripping sensor. Adjust the sensor further away from blade.

  The whining you are hearing is coming from advance motor. this is normal. 

[jimbarry]

The second light not going on is consistent with what happens when the magnet you put on the blade  is in front of the sensor. That sensor is just a metal detector, and can shut the machine off if the blade approaches too closely which happens once in a while.

By no means am I assuming that this is your problem but if you haven't ruled it out it might contribute at times to the machine cutting out.

I think you have found the problem here @terrifictimbersllc . It seems the sensor for the stopping of the machine is not quite right. I pulled out on the blade a little bit and the switches come on and I started the machine, it went for about 30 teeth then stopped. I pulled out on the blade again a bit and held it out, turned on the switches and proceeded to continue sharpening again. I let go of the blade and it sharpened a couple teeth and stopped again. Did that a couple times on that blade.  Late here now, so tomorrow I will adjust that sensor back a little bit. 
This might be the end of this nightmare.

[MattM]

@jimbarry that's great news! Just out of curiosity was the machine half working in that video with or without the jumpers? 

[terrifictimbersllc]

Also the machine I'm seeing in your hands is not the same as mine even though mine is the 110 V MU variant. The switches are different.

Your's look like this?  This was the first one we bought in 2018. The new ones are like the one's in the videos I have be presenting.

Looks like mine, yes, green and  red switch buttons.

[jimbarry]

@jimbarry that's great news! Just out of curiosity was the machine half working in that video with or without the jumpers?

Jumpers in a Sobanski board by that time.

[jimbarry]

Looks like mine, yes, green and  red switch buttons.

Right, that's the older design. Our BMS250MU from 2018 looks like that. The newer ones from 2021 onward will look like this one in the video. About the same functions but the POT1 switch (blade advancer rotatory dial) behaves a lot different. It's rotary dial is smaller, a lot more effort required to turn it and the speed is greatly reduced. On the older model if you accidentally happened to brush the cuff of your shirt or coat on that dial and sent it rotating too fast, well, it was not a good thing to do. On the old model, the quickest I would set the blade advancer was about 2.5. I always wondered why it had speed faster than 3. So this part of the redesign I see as an improvement. On the new machine, the blade advancer at full speed is only about the rate of 2.5 or so from the older model.  The motor for the blade advancer may have some additional torque upon initial observation. It seemed last evening that on slower motion the blade advancer was more capable of pushing the blade through. Down side is it makes a higher pitch whining noise at about the midway speeds. Doesn't affect me much because the tinnitus in my ears is  a symphony of fire alarms.  

[jimbarry]

Now, it's time to hone in @Crossroads machine problem. 

That 5A glass fuse in the F3 position, on our older BMS250MU I had to replace the regular fuse that was filled with silicia sand. That stopped the fuse from constantly blowing. The new machine has the regular glass 5A fuse, we'll see how long that lasts.

If you have a blade in the machine, take it out. Then try to start up the machine. If it all works, then it's the magnetic shut off that needs to be adjusted because when a blade is in place, the sensor is too close to the blade causing it to turn off the machine. 



 

Also, if a blade is installed, a bend in the blade that brings it closer to the sensor or if the right side blade guide well is not in its proper position, will also trigger the sensor to shut things off.



 


What is the brand name of the circuit board on your machine @Crossroads ?

[MattM]

@Crossroads  somehow I missed the posts where you said that you were having issues with your machine. I have a pretty busy day today but later tonight I'll try to give it some thought. That's it you don't have it figured out already  

[YellowHammer]

The sensor in mine has a little LED on it to indicate it is working.  Does yours not have that?  When you get a chance I'd like to know what was the final answer?

Missing or Not Jumpers?
Wrong fuse?
Adjust Sensor?
Else?