new saws

[Northern hills]

Not the dealer , its the head guy for stihl Canada for warranty , I know the man . The head place of stihl is about an hour from here ans when I use to race I was there lots as I built engines for them .

My ported 562 is one of the very first 562's that came to Canada , I figured out how to stop the bog and built I would guess 25 or so 562s , but I have not ported any of the new 562s as I have been running stihls mostly for the last 8 or so years , I built a pile of 365's thou and I mean a pile as they work very well

My 20+ year old 365 has apparently packed it in, dealer closes noon Friday, so is supposed to look at it today. If it's only head/piston, Amazon sells the kit for $56, so it'll become a back up saw. He's recommending the 562, am still tempted to buy another 365, has been absolutely trouble free, but your opinion would be appreciated,  thanks.

[ehp]

If your 365 is 20 years old then it should be the older style saw, is your decompressure on the top cover or on the side of the cylinder , I'm guessing on the side. The new 365xt is the same cylinder as the 372 just has a divider on the door on transfer ports to slow air down , its the same cylinder and piston so not 65cc . They are a very good easy saw to run and will last , the 562 is lighter . they 562 should be abit cheaper to buy but if you want a saw to last another 20 years I would go with the 365 but either one is a good saw

[Northern hills]

Yes, decomp on the side. The usual Husky problem,  bearing on crank, then pieces into the cylinder, no rebuilding it I guess. He says he's had saws ordered since last October, both Husky & Stihl, hoping to have some by the end of next week.
 I have used pretty much all, pioneer, oleo-mac, partner, 034 & 038 Stihls, Johnsred 630, 451, 90, 266, 372 & 365 Huskys, Now use an Echo 501 for small stuff but do a fair bit of 20+" poplar, oak & maple, so still need something with some get up & go, but passing the 60 mark this past summer, the body won't take anything any heavier than it has to. 
Filled in for an injured cut-up man on a crew a few years ago where the owner swung the trees to me with his clam to cut to log length, using 372's, had to pry my left hand off the handle when they ran out of gas, weight is now more important than power.

[ehp]

Then go with the 562 mark 11 make sure the saw has Mark 11 on the rewind , I would go with the 20 inch bar set up on that saw , they work well and are quite light

[barbender]

Yep I just bought one set up the same. Although I've only put a tank of gas through it. I have an original 562 that's probably 5 years old that I like so much, I bought another.

[Rhodemont]

I have been finding that each year as I get older they turn up gravity making my saws heavier.  My Stihl 362 felling saw is at least 3 lbs heavier than when I bought it.  My Stihl 039 bucking saw is at least 5 lbs heavier.  I go to the Echo 361p limbing saw more and more but it got heavier also.

[SwampDonkey]

I use a Husqvarna 555 XP for firewood and I only use a 16" bar because my woods is mostly about 30 years old and younger. A few older ones scattered hither and yond. I can cut something 24" on the but no trouble, those are mostly old fir. Old for our fir anyway, only live for 80-90 years, not as long as that south of here in lower ground. Most of it's longevity is to due to site, where as a spruce can grow well on a rock pile or down with old cedars. Being in the land of old farms with rock piles, I've seen a good many spruce on rock piles, I can tell ya that.

[jb616]

I have been finding that each year as I get older they turn up gravity making my saws heavier.  My Stihl 362 felling saw is at least 3 lbs heavier than when I bought it.  My Stihl 039 bucking saw is at least 5 lbs heavier.  I go to the Echo 361p limbing saw more and more but it got heavier also.

DanG, my saws are getting heavier too.  Always thought I wanted a big ol saw with a long bar to tackle the 36in White pine that I have but now I am content to see how big they can get...My personal limit is 25in with my manual mill and it drops a couple inches every year.

[arojay]

I have a few 562s of different generations.  I do like the newer style air filter/horn.  I think the older, leaky system caused my first one to croak.  Anyways, does anyone take these chipped saws in for computer updates?  I never have but, 200 mile round trip to my nearest dealer so, it slips my mind.

[ehp]

So the one stihl dealer also tried to help but Stihl is not doing anything, but on another note I fixed the primer ball system on my new 500i's and the saws work very well, start very easy and never stumble like before and prime very fast

[ehp]

well I had the other guy contact me that had the other 462 Arctic out of the 11 that were sold in my area , It blew up in about 3 hours run time , Stihl is not going to fix it , blaming fuel but he was running their fuel in a can . Another guy that I knew quite well that cuts firewood just for himself that has bought a lot of stihl saws and weed wackers bought a 500i that had a problem , he took it back to dealer and dealer told him No Stihl was not going to fix it , Saw was 92 days old , When he bought it they told him it had a 1 year warranty now they told him they changed that rule to 90 days even thou I'm sure his saw would not have 10 hours on it cause he works a lot of hours at his real job . He phoned Stihl head office here in Canada and they told him to bad so sad. I can tell you every stihl machine he owns is now for sale and the Husky dealer is loving it , the group of guys around here including me have bought a fair number of husky saws in the last 4 months 

[SwampDonkey]

Been hard to even get Stihl parts for clearing saws. What used to be 3 days is weeks or months or not at all. And that is not old model saws.

[Old Greenhorn]

Breaks one's heart to see this happening. This is another company that has changed philosophy and completely forgotten how their status got to the point it is t now. Not taking care of their clients, especially the pros means a quick trip downhill. No doubt this is the bean counters sending down directives to increase the bottom line by not spending money on warranty work, which leads to not making design changes to eliminate these issues going forward. It is a self feeding cycle in the wrong direction.
 It's a shame. When sales drop to a point they need to react to they will blame it on everything and anything except themselves. They reduce workforce and close factories and blame it on the economy of changing markets. Apparently Stihl is treating it dealers nearly as bad as it treats the end customers.

[Spike60]

Curious about a couple things. Ed; are the Canadian saws indeed forced to operate under stricter emissions standards? I've heard of some stihls blowing up down here, but nothing out of the ordinary. Certainly nothing like what you are seeing up there. That failure rate isn't sustainable. Sales will grind to a halt, and the resulting ill will will last a long time. If the issue is confined to 1 or 2 models, I wonder why they haven't stopped selling them until a solution is found.? Plenty of other models to keep guys cutting. 

[SwampDonkey]

Stihl used to send reps around these parts, one place was at local marketing boards because private wood is sold through them. This happened up until about 2003 or so, then that ended. Used to be a forum sponsor if I recall. If anywhere, they must sell a few saws to woodlot owners and small sawmillers and the loggers that post logging photos on here. Is Facebook that great? I mean their Stihl.ca FB page is pushing battery power hard, garden and lawn care stuff. So I guess their big market is lawn care these days. Nothing gas driven has been posted there for some time. I don't see any interaction with posts, like next to no comments, a couple I seen were just off the cuff sarcasm, not someone about to buy a tool.

[SwampDonkey]

I've never blew a clearing saw and they run pretty hard, up to 10,000. They can really scream in thick short fir ground. Like pitching hay with a fork. It don't fall, it rolls like tumble weed. I use regular gas and cheap Canadian Tire mix oil (Irving) these days. I've used the expensive stuff, and never seen any added benefit. I use the saws 7 or 8 years for 6-7 months straight.

[booman]

If Stihl is really this bad they would not be in business.  I have been running an MS261C for a few years and I love it.  Just seems like a lot of hate on this thread.

[barbender]

Ed isn't blowing smoke or a Stihl hater. He makes a living with his saws, there's not many folks left that do that. So when someone like him is having problems, I take notice.

[doc henderson]

Everyone is entitled to an opinion.  I am a Stihl guy, but I have had some close calls that required repeated trips to my favorite dealer.  I have prob. 15 saws but do not use them every day.  I drive 20 miles one way to this dealer and have had 4 owners in 24 years.  It is in a group of Amish businesses, and they have all been great.  there is another dealer at a John Deere dealer.  I go there for my JD tractor 2 miles away.  Stihl, just like JD, decided to make lines of homeowner stuff to reach a bigger market.  With each new technology there is research and development (done by us the owners) and bugs to work out.  A good example is the computer module saws that had many glitches.  It felt like the individual owners figured that out first and the company took their time.  my dealer intervened and let me trade for new value from a 661 to and 880.  after I bought my 261 cm and it would not start hot, they changed the solenoid even though it tested normal, and I have had no further trouble.  Sorry you guys are still having trouble.  It is sad that many good companies are falling into the trap of using their good name and reputation for a few years of increased profit. 

[Old Greenhorn]

.......  Just seems like a lot of hate on this thread.

This comment made me go back and read the entire thread over again. I am not seeing the hate you mention. What I see is concern and disappointment on the part of professional full time users and long time buyers of Stihl products. If anything some of my comments may have been interpreted as being critical, but not hateful. Understand, I retired from my last job as a manufacturing engineer at an OEM hydraulic tool company that made industrial and aerospace assembly used on everything from locomotives to commercial passenger aircraft. When there were problems in the field with a tool those tools would be carefully examined and if needed a small team was assembled to figure out the problem and execute any design or manufacturing changes we found necessary. Yes, the vast majority of things we received for 'warranty work' was bogus and due to abuse, misuse, or just plain worn out. Those claims would be denied with an explanation. You should see some of the stuff that was sent back. But when there was a flurry of failures for a particular model across more than one client, you can bet we jumped on it and found and fixed the issue at our expense. We knew that if we didn't there was at least 2 other companies waiting in the wings to step in and eat our lunch. To stay in business you HAVE to take care of your customers.

 To compound things, it is not just Stihl that is carrying out these cost cutting measures and ceasing to serve customers, it is across the industry. This creates a downward trend in overall quality that is not serving to advance mankind or our society. I just can't understand the strategy in running companies this way.

[Spike60]

If the failure rate is as bad as described, then sales of affected models should stop. If stihl won't do it, then the dealer needs to "run out" of that model until there's a solution. A dealer can't eat 9 or 11 saws, but IMO ought to have applied the brakes on those things by the 3rd or 4th failure. 

Tom mentioned "at our expence". Occasionally, I had to eat a saw or repair at MY expense. Good customers only  of course. Can't look at everything in a vacuum. Someone who has bought dozens of saws deserves consideration beyond the written warranty. Truth is I'd make more than enough money selling the crash parts and such off the blown up saw. And the guy would buy another dozen saws in the future.

Example: about 10 months of 550M2 production had bearings in which the seal was possibly installed incorrectly by the bearing mfg. Wasn't all of them, so it was a fix as fail issue. Baloney. After 2 failures I called in any saw in that serial number range, and replaced the seals. Seals are cheap, did it myself. No more failures. And you need to understand the timeline is different for a saw that goes into heavy commercial use, and may fail quickly, as opposed to older guys like most of us who won't put that much time on the saw. Changing those seals likely prevented a couple saws from failing outside the warranty period.

Did I allow myself to be taken advantage of? Not in the big picture. Gotta keep everyone happy. Including myself, because it's no fun when a guy brings a saw in and as soon as you pull it over, you just KNOW it's bad. Not painting myself as a saint here either. My regulars got that treatment. Guys that bought stuff online or at logging shows got a different reception. 

[ehp]

I cannot count the number of Stihl chainsaws I have owned in my life time , I'm sure way over 100 . I have never had a single saw ever screw up but both of these were junk right out of the box , Most dealers here right now have no saws to sell or maybe 2 or 3 and no parts , no bars or chains and cannot get them, The 462 was without a doubt my favorite saw to run as I like running it over the 500i but I will never buy another one , I can buy 2 husky 365s for the price of a 500i , if a add a couple hundred bucks I can buy 2 - 372's for that price. . The dealers here are feeling the pinch hardly hard cause no one is buying anything from them , my last bunch of 500i's were 3 years old cause the dealer could not move them . I can tell you if any of the guys that retired from Stihl head office here  were still working I would of had 2 brandnew saws in a day sent to my house cause they took care of everyone , most dealers tell you if stihl warranties anything its at least 1 month but most times its 2 months before you get an answer . I have had a couple dealers tell me they would give me whatever I need to fix these saws but I'm not that kind of guy, I'm not taking food off someone plate to fix a problem that had nothing to do with them. Spike the thing is it was fall just before snow so everyone ordered the saws at about the same time , all saws went down in pretty much the same week but the one that was not ran , guy knew nothing about a problem and when he did run it it went down the same day , there way to lean , I bought a new 261 as well and ran it a little bit but its the same way, its to lean , I can blow that saw up very fast and easy, just lean on it a bit , A 462 arctic once you add tax is like $2 grand now, a 500i is $2 grand plus tax here , far to costly for what your getting , I still own a pile of stihl's but once I'm done with them I will not be placing them with new stihls 

[230Dforme]

Good afternoon all

Want to follow up on Spike60 comments as far as customer service and doing what is right
In the course of business and life, not everything has a dollar amount attached to it, you fix something without asking for payment and you have a loyal customer and he recommends you to others
If you get nothing from your generosity from one customer,
the other ones will make up for it
I retired from construction contracting and do tree work now in the area with a long time logger friend
We work by the hour or give a price not to exceed, recently we quoted a $ 5000 job and billed $ 3200
We work partially on reputation
We also mention at the end of a job to call us if you need a hand w anything, not to be billed
I'm not a do good do'er or a saint, but enjoy people

Don't know Spike, but contacted him once about some gas line and always appreciate his commentary

[booman]

I made the "hate" comment.  Maybe that was a little strong and maybe "disappointment" would be a better word.  Doc, I too have had around 20 saws of various types over the years.  011AV, ms018, MS200, MS260, MS360, MS261, MS261C, MS362, MS650, MS880, and 2 Echo PPT260,  Echo chainsaws, Husqvarna, and McCullough.  Some were more maintenance than others but the Stihls were always the most faithful.  I think the Echos have come a long way and I was impressed with the Husky saw I got with one of my sawmills.  As everything is going overseas we have to deal with what we get.