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Author Topic: girdling a walnut?  (Read 3154 times)

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Offline Brad_S.

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girdling a walnut?
« on: January 03, 2006, 05:47:46 PM »
I was asked by a potential client whether griddling a walnut will cause it to die slowly and change the light sapwood to dark heartwood in the process. I didn't know what to tell him. What say you pros?
"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans." J. Lennon

Offline beenthere

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Re: griddling a walnut?
« Reply #1 on: January 03, 2006, 05:57:42 PM »
I would have serious doubts about that having any effect on the sapwood.
Not sure upon what basis one would think that it could happen that way. 
If you get a chance to try it, let us know how it works out. :)

 :D  I am sure you meant 'girdling' and were not trying to make this a 'food' topic and throw it on the griddle.  :D
south central Wisconsin
 It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Offline Ron Wenrich

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Re: griddling a walnut?
« Reply #2 on: January 03, 2006, 06:11:39 PM »
Girdling, when done properly, isn't a slow death.  Its pretty quick.  You cut thru the bark and prevent water and nutrients to flow up to the leaves.  They curl and die.  But, the roots stay working and will cause stump sprouts.

As to discoloring, that might happen.  I've cut walnut where the sapwood had pretty well turned, but don't recall whether it was from a dead tree or not.  I always thought it was from old logs.

The girdling will keep the bark in tact for a while.  There is no place for it to lose very much moisture, as there is in a cut log.  That could turn the wood.

A nice experiment.  A lot might depend on the diameter of the tree.  The smaller the diameter the higher the sapwood/heartwood ratio.  It might be a factor.
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

Offline Brad_S.

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Re: griddling a walnut?
« Reply #3 on: January 03, 2006, 07:13:18 PM »
Thanks for the prompt answers. Yep, I did mean girdling, spell check is only good for words that don't really exist, not mis-used words. :D

The guys' thinking is that walnuts dying slowly limb by limb often have little sapwood and vigorous trees have large amounts of same. and, as stated, wondered if girdling was an artificial way of forcing the issue. Made sense to my uneducated mind!

Thanks for the replies. smiley_thumbsup
"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans." J. Lennon

Offline Ianab

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Re: griddling a walnut?
« Reply #4 on: January 03, 2006, 08:03:30 PM »
Quote
The guys' thinking is that walnuts dying slowly limb by limb often have little sapwood and vigorous trees have large amounts of same

Ahhh....

What he's seeing is that when a tree is in decline it's growing very slowly, so it's creating new sapwood much slower than a healthy tree. Sapwood turns into heartwood after a few years ( 5-20 depends on species). So slowing down the growth wont make any more heartwood - just less new sapwood, and eventually less wood overall.

Cheers

Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Offline Brad_S.

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Re: griddling a walnut?
« Reply #5 on: January 03, 2006, 11:09:57 PM »
Thank you Ian. I'll forward that info to him and I can now answer that question knowledgeably in the future instead of stammering and stuttering like I did. :D
"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans." J. Lennon

Online customsawyer

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Re: girdling a walnut?
« Reply #6 on: January 28, 2006, 05:56:41 AM »
I hate having to give that answer that you get when you ask your kids what happend here and the shrug thier shoulders and say "I don't know" I just don't ever feel very professionl. :D
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Offline Ironwood

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Re: girdling a walnut?
« Reply #7 on: January 28, 2006, 06:42:54 AM »
I have noticed on walnut where water lays, say upper part of a crotch it discolors (darkens the sapwood) much like heartwood but not in a predictable consistant way. Good luck. Reid
There is no scarcity of opportunity to make a living at what you love to do, there is only scarcity of resolve to make it happen.- Wayne Dyer

Offline Larry

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Re: girdling a walnut?
« Reply #8 on: January 28, 2006, 08:03:48 AM »
Ian gets the prize for the correct answer.

There is a way to change the color of sapwood.  It is called steaming and will do it in a few hours if the lumber is green.  If done properly most people would never know.

Larry, making useful and beautiful things out of the most environmental friendly material on the planet.

We need to insure our customers understand the importance of our craft.

Offline Ironwood

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Re: girdling a walnut?
« Reply #9 on: January 28, 2006, 08:09:48 AM »
That must be one huge steamer, given it is only girdled. :o :D
There is no scarcity of opportunity to make a living at what you love to do, there is only scarcity of resolve to make it happen.- Wayne Dyer

Offline ohsoloco

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Re: girdling a walnut?
« Reply #10 on: January 28, 2006, 03:19:17 PM »
Steaming also tends to dull the color of the heartwood.

Offline Ironwood

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Re: girdling a walnut?
« Reply #11 on: January 28, 2006, 07:46:15 PM »
Steaming is absolutely a travisty. I understand the big operators need to but in my opinion it is not the same after they abuse the wood like that. Shame on them. While I am at it, I just saw a picture on the opening page of a "clamshell bucket" on a crawler handling a log,YYYYYYYYYYikes :o This wood abuse must stop!

                              Reid
There is no scarcity of opportunity to make a living at what you love to do, there is only scarcity of resolve to make it happen.- Wayne Dyer

Offline Larry

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Re: girdling a walnut?
« Reply #12 on: January 28, 2006, 08:19:19 PM »
Reminds me of a story.  Guy calls and asks if I have any good walnut...yeap best ya ever have seen, clear with a little curl, extra wide boards, no sap wood, kiln dried (I donít steam), but itís gonna cost ya.  $12/bf...he says no problem for premium boards so I pull em out so he can take a look see.  First thing I hear is ďwhatís with all that purple and black colorĒ...donít look like the walnut he has been getting from Paxtons.  There walnut is all steamed to a nice ugly brown.  Took a while for me to find a home for those boards with a real woodworker.

Got the trailer loaded with walnut ready to haul to a steamer Monday morning.  Sapwood no defect and the consumer gets treated to ugly brown.  I donít have to put up with the hobby woodworker that questions the color of real walnut and get to sell sapwood and even a little wane. ;D
Larry, making useful and beautiful things out of the most environmental friendly material on the planet.

We need to insure our customers understand the importance of our craft.

Offline Ironwood

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Re: girdling a walnut?
« Reply #13 on: January 29, 2006, 08:13:31 PM »
All hail to the masses. Glad you found a home for them. I love the purple black brown.

         Reid
There is no scarcity of opportunity to make a living at what you love to do, there is only scarcity of resolve to make it happen.- Wayne Dyer


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