Shooting Wolves

[SwampDonkey]

Yeah, I wouldn't argue with you over the redeeming qualities. But it's kind of funny as I reflect on wildlife management in NB. It's spelled "deer" for some reason. Yet, they are the invasive species. Trouble is during the height of the population growth they were a major sport game up here like down south. Then things went bad for the deer: loss of winter habitat, some bad consecutive winters and over harvesting.  And then of course blaming the coyotes. Up here loose dogs were bad near settlements. DNR would shoot deer chasing dogs on site.

[DRB]

Yeah, ..... Up here loose dogs were bad near settlements. DNR would shoot deer chasing dogs on site.

So why would the DNR shoot a deer because it was chasing a dog?

[DRB]

Coyotes are so common in WA that they may be killed 365 days of the year 24 hours a day. Heck I live in a big city and I had one in my backyard once and just a couple months ago driving to church on Sunday morning one ran in front of us. This is very populated area in no way rural just a big city. I know a guy who hunts them almost every other weekend in Eastern WA.  He gets a few most weekends. Wolves on the other hand are protected and scarce but I fear they will be back in force which is not good if you raise livestock. A word of advice if you kill a Wolf and it is not legal to kill one then don't save the hide and don't take pictures like the guy just did here in WA.

Check out the size of this guy

http://www.king5.com/home/Washington-wolf-killer-pleads-guilty-wife-admits-role-in-scheme-148017955.html

[SwampDonkey]

Dogs running down deer are called "deer chasing dogs" or "deer chasers". ;D

[beenthere]

I shoot deer chasing dogs, at least that is a good excuse. So far, only have seen the deer as they must have all the dogs chased away by now. ;)  Venison is great!

[Sprucegum]

I got a visitor;


 

If he/she stays around I won't be seeing many deer or coyotes.

[isawlogs]

Biggest  timber wolf I have seen was while hunting caribou up past Radisson on the Lagrande Riviere ....  He was also hunting for them.

They sure are nice to see from afar.  ;D

[SwampDonkey]

A trapper recently shot an 86 lb coyote in northern NB. It is going to be DNA tested to see if it may be a wolf. The last recorded wolf kill in NB was in 1876. Coyotes in the region are known to be crosses with dogs and wolves. Mom's uncle caught a dog in a conibear that went for a timber wolf on the fur sale.

CBC News Article

Yesterday the canine was confirmed by DNA testing to be the first wolf shot in NB in 136 years.  ;D

[SwampDonkey]

The latest news about the wolf is that it's most probably a pet. This is not far fetched as mom's uncle caught one in a trap by mistake. But he sold the hide as a timber wolf. I have heard of others that have such pets. This being a pet is what I had in the back of my mind all along. ;)

[Jamie_C]

I know a few people that had a pair of wolves as pets years ago here in NS, fiercely loyal, fiercely protective and one hell of a handful when they decided they wanted to challenge you for the alpha position.

[SwampDonkey]

Yesterday it was confirmed that the wolf shot last year was a wild wolf, which was determined to be a cross between the Grey and the Eastern Canadian wolf.

"The last time a wolf had been reported killed in the province was in 1876. They were believed to have been hunted to extinction after the province started offering a bounty in 1858 of 15 shillings for every wolf killed."

Wolf News

[chet]

This last week a federal judge in Washington sided with animal rights groups and issued a decision effectively squelching a 2012 move by the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service to remove federal protections for wolves in nine states in the Great Lakes region.   :(

[red oaks lumber]

one of the biggest things these type of people base their decisions on emotion not science facts ;) within the last 10 yrs.around here it went from a rare sighting of a wolf to i see them maybe once every couple of weeks.the biggest pack i have seen around here at one time was 6. at the same time frame i went from seeing around 30 deer in my field around home now its down to 3 . ;)i realize it's not all the wolf doing the damage  rather all bigger preditor(wolf,bear,coyote)which this deadly combination will lead to a huge imbalance in the food chain.
the way i see it once the dominate food scource has beeen exhausted the preditors will turn to other animals ie cattle, pets , and god forbid humans. when you have preditors that have no enemies to help control their numbers, its' left up to humans to be top preditor to keep the balance. sad? maybe but, true.
hopefully clearer heads will prevail and this ban can be reversed back to the states to control.

[Jeff]

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Dec. 22, 2014

Contact: Debbie Munson Badini, 906-226-1352


Federal court order returns wolves to endangered species list
Ruling suspends Michigan’s lethal control laws and permits

A federal court judge has ordered the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service to immediately return wolves in the Great Lakes region to the federal endangered species list, making it illegal for Michigan citizens to kill wolves attacking livestock or dogs.

Under endangered species status, wolves may be killed only in the immediate defense of human life.

Two state laws allowing livestock or dog owners to kill wolves in the act of depredation are suspended by the ruling.

Additionally, lethal control permits previously issued by the Michigan Department of Natural Resources to livestock farmers to address ongoing conflicts with wolves are no longer valid; permit holders have been contacted regarding this change.

The return to federal endangered species status also means DNR wildlife and law enforcement officials no longer have the authority to use lethal control methods to manage wolf conflict.

However, non-lethal methods – such as flagging, fencing, flashing lights and guard animals – may still be used and are encouraged. Compensation for livestock lost to wolves continues to be available through the DNR and Department of Agriculture and Rural Development.

Citizens in need of assistance with problem wolves should contact their local DNR wildlife biologist or DNR wolf program coordinator Kevin Swanson at 906-228-6561.

Friday’s federal court order came in response to a lawsuit filed by the Humane Society of the United States challenging the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service’s decision to remove wolves in the Great Lakes Distinct Population Segment from the federal endangered species list in January 2012. The ruling affects wolves in Michigan, Minnesota and Wisconsin.

“The federal court decision is surprising and disappointing,” said Russ Mason, DNR Wildlife Division Chief. “Wolves in Michigan have exceeded recovery goals for 15 years and have no business being on the endangered species list, which is designed to help fragile populations recover – not to halt the use of effective wildlife management techniques.”

The DNR will work closely with the Michigan Attorney General’s office and the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service to determine the full impact of this ruling on the state’s wolf management program and identify next steps.

“In the meantime, the Wildlife Division will continue updating the state’s wolf management plan, which includes the use of hunting and other forms of lethal control to minimize conflict with wolves,” Mason said. “Although the federal court’s ruling prevents the use of these management tools for the time-being, the Department will be prepared for any future changes that would return wolves to state management authority.”

For more information about Michigan’s wolf population and management plan, visit www.michigan.gov/wolves.

**************************
Subject:  Urgent: Western Great Lakes Wolf Delisting Overturned

Looks like it is time for a rewrite of the Endangered Species Act. It clearly is not working as intended.
It's my understanding that the Feds have some pretty lame lawyers and HSUS has slick million dollar lawyers. I'm sure the outcome would have been different if this were brought to District court in Marquette, Ashland or Duluth. These lawyers shop for what they think they have the best chance of getting a ruling in their favor.
  These people believe they are saving an animal, when in fact rulings like this just further drive a wedge, and more will be killed through 3S management then would have been killed through regulated take. Thru earlier rulings, we are already 10 years behind with managing these animals. This will just further pith people off, and you will have more grandmothers shooting wolves from their back porch because they see no other option. The value of wolves has just been degraded to vermin. What a shame.
George Lindquist


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Amy Trotter <atrotter@mucc.org>
Date: Fri, Dec 19, 2014 at 4:53 PM
Subject: Urgent: Western Great Lakes Wolf Delisting Overturned
To:





Sorry to be the bearer of bad news on a Friday, but attached is the US District Court’s opinion, plus the order accompanying the opinion on the case of HSUS v the US Dept of Interior et al.

Today, the DC District Court has vacated the Western Great Lakes wolf delisting in a harshly worded opinion that says that wolves cannot be delisted regionally when the broader population is still threatened. So this ruling impacts state wolf management not only here in Michigan, but also Wisconsin and Minnesota. As you probably recall, other states that are currently conducting wolf hunts were delisted through Congressional action.



The Court’s lengthy opinion is attached.   The remedy here is appeal and/or federal legislation. From our understanding, this is not something USFWS can fix on remand given the Court’s rigid interpretation.


   


   

What this means: Michigan wolves are back under federal management. This is not any fault of what we have done here in Michigan or any state in how they have managed wolves, this is a different interpretation of how a population gets delisted. And hopefully we can win on appeal. This does not mean that all of our work is for naught here in Michigan. Our law still stands, until such time that wolves are federally delisted.



Thanks again for all of your work and wishing you all a Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays.

Amy Trotter

[coxy]

most every one is going to get a 3s permit  :D :D I would be the first   thanks for posting

[red oaks lumber]

when i have lost cattle in the past , ya i could have pursude finacial recovery from the state but, if they don't know i have a problem then i can  handle the problems on our own. i make no effort to hide my intentions.kinda like clyvin bundy with the blm

[loghorse]

Just remember if your weapon goes off,save the cartridges.

[sawguy21]

Yeah, ..... Up here loose dogs were bad near settlements. DNR would shoot deer chasing dogs on site.

So why would the DNR shoot a deer because it was chasing a dog?

:D Good one. Deer populations have become a real problem in several parts of B.C., they have been known to get aggressive with dogs in urban areas. The real fear is moving on to humans, children in particular. The natural predators have been hunted or poisoned to the brink of extinction to protect live stock but that has opened another can of worms. A pack of Canadian wolves was introduced into the Bitteroot mountains to help restore the balance, the ranchers are most unhappy.

[SwampDonkey]

The term "deer chaser" is a lable given to dogs that chase down deer. The deer is not the target in this case. ;)

The boys that asked about hunting coyotes after deer season ran out of puff and steam several weeks ago. I knew them coyotes were safe when walking was the only mode of transportation, plus or minus some snow. :D

[Barney II]

3S----I think that it is about time for the States to start shoving back to the feds.  This is by far the most extreme case of rape that has been put on anyone.  We got along just fine when there were no wolves in our area and we had a healthy population deer---wolves all over the place and the worst quality of venison that shouldn't be used by any human.    NO  I do not intend honor anyone by discussing the wolf issue -----the case is closed at my end and will not rest until they are gone---going to be a while I would bet---nevertheless

[beenthere]

wolves all over the place and the worst quality of venison that shouldn't be used by any human.

Barney
What changes the quality of venison for eating?

Buddy of mine hunts in the Herbster area and did get a nice buck this year.

Agree, that we were just fine without the introduction of wolves. The elk herd (also not a fan of that introduction either) could do a lot better without the wolves (and da bears).

[OneWithWood]

Personally, I would welcome wolves back to Indiana.  The deer are rapidly degrading the forests and the hunters are having a tough time controlling the population even with the bonus permits.  In my county you can take one buck and seven doe.  Unfortunately most of the hunters feel the need to shoot a buck and never go on to harvest the doe.  Consequently the problem continues to grow.
Plus a nice population of wolves might keep some of the city folk in the city!

[coxy]

Personally, I would welcome wolves back to Indiana. 
a nice population of wolves might keep some of the city folk in the city!

that right there is some funny    ill agree  with you on that 

[red oaks lumber]

oww
be careful what you wish for ;) once wolves get estabilished in an area, everything that was normal will be gone. it's like uncorking the genie ain't no going back.
the word i'm starting to hear is law suits might start flying. going after people personally that have shown to suppoprt the re enlistment. suing for loss of income, mental angiuse you know the usual stuff.

[Barney II]

Been there-----I said that I would NOT discuss anything relative to wolves----I like to equate them to terrorists or worse---not worth one dedeeming cent----lived next door to them for two years, they finally disappeared.

To the meat, if you have ever eaten venison that comes from totally relaxed deer versus one that has been chased for months on end and kept in a state of anxious getting ready to run and no fat on their bones what so ever----no different than wounding a deer and chasing them for tweo counties---the meat smells rotten in all cases and is so tough and stringy-----just of no use----That is my last word and I could give a good hoot about discussing it and meeting someone halfway---there is no half way    The only good wolf is a dead wolf!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!