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Author Topic: Circle Mill Knee Height?  (Read 2642 times)

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Offline SPD748

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Circle Mill Knee Height?
« on: March 15, 2010, 08:04:33 PM »
Ok, so I think that I finally have a design for my mill foundation... a flat concrete pad with enough space to setup the mill and engine. It seems that I will have to set the knee height at 37" in order to allow enough space for a 54" - 60" blade. Does this seem too high? I'll have to build a platform walkway as the handle for the set works will be too high to comfortably reach from the level of the concrete pad. I was thinking something around 20" high which will leave 17" from the top of the walkway to the knee height. This height would put the set works handle at a good, easily reachable height. I have CAD drawings of the whole works but I can't seem to upload them to this forum. What do you guys think? Thanks.

-lee
Frick 0 Handset - A continuing project dedicated to my Dad.

410 Deere, 240 Massey... I really need a rough terrain forklift :)

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Offline Mooseherder

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Re: Circle Mill Knee Height?
« Reply #1 on: March 15, 2010, 08:22:32 PM »
What height will that put your Carriage at?
For turning Logs is why I'm asking.  Do you have a Log Turner?
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Offline John Bartley

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Re: Circle Mill Knee Height?
« Reply #2 on: March 15, 2010, 08:35:00 PM »
It seems that I will have to set the knee height at 37" in order to allow enough space for a 54" - 60" blade.

Any reason why you couldn't dig a little pit under the blade to let the blade down into? That way your mill track and carriage could be at a more easily reached height. If you've got a sawdust auger, you could set the pickup down in the pit also.

cheers

John
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Offline Ron Wenrich

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Re: Circle Mill Knee Height?
« Reply #3 on: March 15, 2010, 08:54:39 PM »
Build the platform.  When I put in a handmill, I had the log end higher than the lumber end.  You don't want to be too high, or you'll have a hard time turning logs by hand, or setting the dogs.  They'll be harder to set than pulling the setworks handle.  I can't remember how high it was exactly, but I do know that it was about mid thigh for me to push logs with my legs.  I'm thinking its about 25-26" to the top of the knee. A lot depends on how tall you are.  If you're short and stubby, you might want if lower.  If you're tall and lanky, you may want it higher.

On the lumber end, you'll want your out rolls to be about waist high.  That prevents you from bending over to push the wood out.
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Offline SPD748

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Re: Circle Mill Knee Height?
« Reply #4 on: March 15, 2010, 09:28:31 PM »
I could dig a pit however I plan on using a blower to handle the dust and that may make it difficult to install the saw pot around the blade. I have a design/drawing to build a chain type log turner. I can make the frame what ever height is required to center the chain on the logs. If I set the knees at 37" I can set the roller table at 34" to 36" to make it comfortable to offbear. I need to try and figure out how to upload my drawings to you guys can see what I'm talking about. I can't set the knees any lower because the blade would get too close to or hit the concrete. With the knees at 37", a 54" blade will be 5" from the pad. Is that too close?
Frick 0 Handset - A continuing project dedicated to my Dad.

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Offline captain_crunch

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Re: Circle Mill Knee Height?
« Reply #5 on: March 16, 2010, 12:46:29 AM »
On subject of pit around here that = water hole. My belsaw carrage is 7 ft off ground on low side and about 5 ft on hi side. But I have walk way all way around and this sure helps with clean up
M-14 Belsaw circle mill,HD-11 Log Loader,TD-14 Crawler,TD-9 Crawler and Ford 2910 Loader Tractor

Offline bandmiller2

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Re: Circle Mill Knee Height?
« Reply #6 on: March 16, 2010, 07:52:59 AM »
Lee,I always figured mill knee hight at my knee hight for the sawyer,offbearer as stated around hip hight depending how tall the lad is.Don't be afrade to set the mill up high adjust the sawyers hight with a good wood platform,you don't want to work on cement all day,and its much warmer in the winter.A little spring in the boards seems to be less tiring.Frank C.
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Offline bandmiller2

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Re: Circle Mill Knee Height?
« Reply #7 on: March 16, 2010, 08:40:40 AM »
Lee is your 671 a truck engine or a power unit with a clutch.?? Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

Offline jdrum

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Re: Circle Mill Knee Height?
« Reply #8 on: March 16, 2010, 01:24:03 PM »
keep the mill on higher ground for good drainage and save the money wasted on a concrete pad and put it into a good roof.
carraige knees should be about knee hight., think about comfortable working hight for turning logs, if to low you have to bend over to far to get a purchase on the log, if to high you have to reach to finish a turn,
then build your log deck, rollway, or whatever you want to call it a couple inches higher than the carriage.

jim

Offline SPD748

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Re: Circle Mill Knee Height?
« Reply #9 on: March 16, 2010, 03:43:31 PM »
Lee is your 671 a truck engine or a power unit with a clutch.?? Frank C.

Engine's a power plant on a skid with a clutch. On that subject, I learned (thankfully not on a DOT scale) that the engine, clutch and skid weigh just under 5k lbs. Thats with no fuel in the 100 gallon tank. I was thinking that it weighed maybe 2500 lbs. I guess I shouldn't attempt weight estimation as a living.  :)
Frick 0 Handset - A continuing project dedicated to my Dad.

410 Deere, 240 Massey... I really need a rough terrain forklift :)

Sawing Since 1-19-2013 @ 3:30 pm
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"Some police officers give tickets, some gave all."

Offline SPD748

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Re: Circle Mill Knee Height?
« Reply #10 on: March 16, 2010, 04:02:50 PM »
keep the mill on higher ground for good drainage and save the money wasted on a concrete pad and put it into a good roof.
carraige knees should be about knee hight., think about comfortable working hight for turning logs, if to low you have to bend over to far to get a purchase on the log, if to high you have to reach to finish a turn,
then build your log deck, rollway, or whatever you want to call it a couple inches higher than the carriage.

jim

Most of the mill setups I've looked at seem to be on a hillside using treated poles as a foundation. I can see where this design would lend itself to the operation of the mill. Before I started this project, I set aside cash to finance everything. I ended up getting the mill for considerably less that originally projected. That being said, I have enough to go with a concrete foundation, all steel supports and an 'oversized' shed. (on that note, I've been told that there is no such thing as 'oversized' when it comes to the shed.) At any rate, I already have the metal and truss's for the roof. I plan on sawing the rest (hopefully). There is a treatment facility near my home that will take care of my posts for me. Again, I looked at numerous mills both privite and commercial. I have yet to find a commercial unit on a wood foundation. That is not to say that wood is a poor choice as I looked a numerous mills which have been on wood for two or three times my lifetime. To me, concrete seems like the quickest, most simple foundation. My pad will cost me around a grand to install. The steel for the supports will cost just over $400. I didn't price treated poles but I would expect enough material for that type of foundation to run close to what my concrete pad will. I'm not flaming anyone, I'm just attempting to explain the thought process which led me to choosing concrete over other foundation types. Thoughts?
Frick 0 Handset - A continuing project dedicated to my Dad.

410 Deere, 240 Massey... I really need a rough terrain forklift :)

Sawing Since 1-19-2013 @ 3:30 pm
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"Some police officers give tickets, some gave all."

Offline bandmiller2

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Re: Circle Mill Knee Height?
« Reply #11 on: March 16, 2010, 04:53:10 PM »
Lee,sounds like you have all your ducks in a row nothing wrong with your plans and concrete.Treated poles are just less perminent should you ever want to move it.You should have plenty of power if you can stand the drone of the Detroit.You can build a enclosure around the engine with doors for ventilation in the summer,it will make working around the mill more pleasant and give you a secure place for small items.Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

Offline jdrum

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Re: Circle Mill Knee Height?
« Reply #12 on: March 16, 2010, 05:02:55 PM »
  i'll stand corrected,  i have a bad habit of thinking on a lot tighter budget.
and i didn't mean to come on so strong for a first post but was in a hurry and wanted to get my 2 cents worth in before i got sidetracked and forgot.

jim

Offline SPD748

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Re: Circle Mill Knee Height?
« Reply #13 on: March 16, 2010, 05:06:11 PM »
Lee,sounds like you have all your ducks in a row nothing wrong with your plans and concrete.Treated poles are just less perminent should you ever want to move it.You should have plenty of power if you can stand the drone of the Detroit.You can build a enclosure around the engine with doors for ventilation in the summer,it will make working around the mill more pleasant and give you a secure place for small items.Frank C.

Frank, you are VERY correct about the howl of the 2 stroke D. Holy smoke man, even with the largest muffler I could find, it still moans. Most of the noise is unavoidable, I know. An enclosure would help though. It is set for 130 hp and 1600 rpm which helps to keep the sound under control. We ran it up to 2200 for a break-in period and  smiley_lipsrsealed. Whenever this engine was designed I think the engineers started with a required noise level and worked from there. There is no way an engine can make this much noise by accident. Its a strong runner though and pretty simple to work on plus it can be completely overhauled for under $1500.
Frick 0 Handset - A continuing project dedicated to my Dad.

410 Deere, 240 Massey... I really need a rough terrain forklift :)

Sawing Since 1-19-2013 @ 3:30 pm
Serving Since 2002
"Some police officers give tickets, some gave all."

Offline SPD748

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Re: Circle Mill Knee Height?
« Reply #14 on: March 16, 2010, 05:09:57 PM »
 i'll stand corrected,  i have a bad habit of thinking on a lot tighter budget.
and i didn't mean to come on so strong for a first post but was in a hurry and wanted to get my 2 cents worth in before i got sidetracked and forgot.

jim

Jim, no correction necessary. You weren't coming on too strong. I welcome ALL opinions as my knowledge is very limited at this point. Thanks for your input and please, keep your opinions and thoughts coming!!

-lee
Frick 0 Handset - A continuing project dedicated to my Dad.

410 Deere, 240 Massey... I really need a rough terrain forklift :)

Sawing Since 1-19-2013 @ 3:30 pm
Serving Since 2002
"Some police officers give tickets, some gave all."

Offline Tripp

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Re: Circle Mill Knee Height?
« Reply #15 on: March 16, 2010, 10:09:19 PM »
I have a friend near me that runs a big Meadows circle mill with a 671. That is a very impressive powerplant. He runs it with a large straight pipe and it is under a metal building. I can hardly stand the noise with ear protection. What a mixture of sound though. A big diesel and a large circle saw cutting wood.

Tripp

Offline bandmiller2

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Re: Circle Mill Knee Height?
« Reply #16 on: March 18, 2010, 09:01:54 PM »
Lee,after you install your best muffler on that rascal put whats called a resonator near the end of the stack its just like a short muffler that really dosen't restrict,but tends to quiet the exhaust.Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

Offline SPD748

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Re: Circle Mill Knee Height?
« Reply #17 on: March 18, 2010, 10:03:59 PM »
Lee,after you install your best muffler on that rascal put whats called a resonator near the end of the stack its just like a short muffler that really dosen't restrict,but tends to quiet the exhaust.Frank C.

I read about those. I found some on the net for around $100. From what I understand, they work well. The engine is sitting outside my shop at the moment. The muffler is mounted about 6" above the manifold with 3' of pipe above. I plan on running the pipe through the roof on the shed after all is said and done. I'll install a resonator as well. This thing needs all the help it can get. 
Frick 0 Handset - A continuing project dedicated to my Dad.

410 Deere, 240 Massey... I really need a rough terrain forklift :)

Sawing Since 1-19-2013 @ 3:30 pm
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"Some police officers give tickets, some gave all."

Offline bandmiller2

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Re: Circle Mill Knee Height?
« Reply #18 on: March 19, 2010, 09:02:07 PM »
Lee,there are many thing you can do to make a mill handier and more pleasant to operate.My first mill had a Cat power unit in an engine house.The back of the engine house had two doors that could be opened in the winter, that hot air from the fan felt good for me and the offbearer.If you got a good look at a resinator you could probibly make one.Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece


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