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Author Topic: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed. "UPDATED"  (Read 5114 times)

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Offline 123maxbars

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New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed. "UPDATED"
« on: February 07, 2012, 10:27:34 PM »
I just purchased 5 acres of land that adjoins my farm. Main reason was for the acerage and not the timber. I am a part time sawyer (rookie) who saws on the weekends and after noons on my LT35 Hydr.  I am a stationary mill and do not do mobile jobs. I am a cop by profession and this is a hobby that easily pays for its self and then some. Anyways most of the lumber I sale is for barns and some woodworkers, but mostly for building, barn siding etc. The land I purchased has around 25 tall straight red/white oak trees. These trees are straight and around 24-30diam. The land is flat but is not cleared off and is over grown forest/woods. Thes trees do have branches on some of the butt logs and some after about 10-15feet from the ground. I hope to fell most of these trees and sale them as barn lumber etc. I have attached a few pictures of them. I have always bought from loggers who bring me clear logs so this will be my first eperience at sawing logs like this. My advice I am looking for is, are these trees worth fooling with? I figured Yes since I am not going for grade but just barn lumber etc. Looking for advice and people who have sawn similar trees/logs. Thanks in advance.  And another reason I didn't mention. Would be nice to tell the wife that we can get some of our money back/if not a little out of the timber from the land.



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Offline 123maxbars

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Re: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed.
« Reply #1 on: February 07, 2012, 10:45:48 PM »
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Offline WDH

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Re: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed.
« Reply #2 on: February 07, 2012, 10:48:47 PM »
I saw a lot of oak, and there is a lot of good wood between those limbs knots.  You are going to get some good clear lumber, too, from the butt logs.  The #2 grade knotty stuff I can sell at $1.25 to $1.50 per Board foot to local woodworkers.  Your market may be different, but I like your plan.
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Offline 123maxbars

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Re: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed.
« Reply #3 on: February 07, 2012, 10:58:03 PM »
Thanks WDH. I always value your advice/post on here. I thought so also, I did a rough scale on the trees today and most doyle around 600-800 board feet a tree. Some a little more some a little less. and with 25 of them, I should be good on oak for the next decade, atleast hopefully.
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Online fat olde elf

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Re: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed.
« Reply #4 on: February 08, 2012, 02:55:24 AM »
Always good to see another criminal justice person on the Forum.  I get more money for white oak than red oak. Trailer beds, etc.  White oak stands up to the weather very well, red oak not so well. You can't get any better advice than that from WDH.
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Offline Bibbyman

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Re: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed.
« Reply #5 on: February 08, 2012, 03:42:19 AM »
Looks like theyd make good shade trees.   I have a couple of big black oaks near our mill Ive graveled under and laid out 6x6s to set lumber on.  Its a wonder how well they shade and shed the lumber stacked under them.  The trouble is, the shade is only seasonal.   And in the fall there are bushes of acorns that fall off them.  I picked up a bundle of lumber the other day and Id bet a bucket full fell out and off it.

 

 

The trees are on the right side of this picture with lumber stacked under them.  The picture is six years old and Ive since cleared and graveled under the trees and laid down the 6x6s.  There is enough room for me to put the long beams and decking lumber.
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Offline Ron Wenrich

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Re: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed.
« Reply #6 on: February 08, 2012, 05:37:11 AM »
I went to a mill that used shade trees to store their lumber.  It was supposed to be good quality lumber, that was put on sticks.  When I went through it, it was all stained.  There were leaves between the layers.  I don't think it got the needed air flow.

Shade trees are ok for storing logs and short term lumber, but I wouldn't use it for long term lumber storage.
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Offline Kansas

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Re: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed.
« Reply #7 on: February 08, 2012, 05:48:11 AM »
Elfe had the best solution for the white oaks. Trailer decking. Construction companies are more interested in quality and getting stuff when they need it than price. Many of the orders they put in are longer stuff. Those trees fit the bill perfectly.

Offline Bibbyman

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Re: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed.
« Reply #8 on: February 08, 2012, 07:39:23 AM »
I went to a mill that used shade trees to store their lumber.  It was supposed to be good quality lumber, that was put on sticks.  When I went through it, it was all stained.  There were leaves between the layers.  I don't think it got the needed air flow.

Shade trees are ok for storing logs and short term lumber, but I wouldn't use it for long term lumber storage.

I use it for storing finished orders - waiting on the customer to pick up. Better than setting out in the hot sun when just a day or two an it starts to gray and curl up.
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Offline bandmiller2

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Re: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed.
« Reply #9 on: February 08, 2012, 08:15:11 AM »
Max,are you going to clear the lot for agriculture or just have a woodlot.?I would only cut the oaks as you have a need for them.Time spent on woods roads is time well spent.Looks to me like ther ideal place for an old tractor and logging arch.If you have any timber framers in your area,may be a good outlet for good quality timbers. Frank C.
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Offline thecfarm

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Re: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed.
« Reply #10 on: February 08, 2012, 08:25:25 AM »
You say red oak,the red oak I have takes a few smarts to bring them down without splitting the butt log. Not a good idea to just put any notch into them and do the back cut. But than you say red/white oak too.
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Offline Okrafarmer

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Re: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed.
« Reply #11 on: February 08, 2012, 08:54:41 AM »
I don't know where you've been getting those premium logs, but you should be able to get quite a few premium boards out of these trees by sawing around the knots on the lower logs. The upper logs will be increasingly pallet-like material, but still have their uses, some of which include low-grade lumber, firewood, pulpwood, or selling as pallet logs to a pallet mill.
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Offline tcsmpsi

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Re: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed.
« Reply #12 on: February 08, 2012, 09:29:52 AM »
 

 

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Offline 123maxbars

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Re: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed.
« Reply #13 on: February 08, 2012, 07:22:04 PM »
Max,are you going to clear the lot for agriculture or just have a woodlot.?I would only cut the oaks as you have a need for them.Time spent on woods roads is time well spent.Looks to me like ther ideal place for an old tractor and logging arch.If you have any timber framers in your area,may be a good outlet for good quality timbers. Frank C.

This land is mostly overgrown with brush etc. I plan on clearing it off and maybe running some goats/horses on it and replanting some trees and building a log cabin someday.

I appreciate the responses on here. Some of the trees I will keep but I plaon on milling alot of them to offset some of the purchase price for the land. 
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Offline 123maxbars

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Re: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed. "UPDATED"
« Reply #14 on: February 22, 2012, 10:47:32 AM »
I had a forester/timber buyer come to my woodlot a few weeks ago after making this post. I was just curious on what the offer would be. We spent a few hours walking the land and identifying every tree and what type of use it would bring. After a final tally here is what the lot has

24 Red/White oak trees, straight logs, some knots on the lower parts of some of the trees and average diam of 28in.

4 Ash trees. Straight logs, diam of about 22-28, no knots/limbs up to about 15feet.

4 Poplar trees, good straight logs, diam of 24-30. barn wood, which sells great in my area, and I cant keep enough poplar on hand as it is.

4 Walnut. Small trees, that I do not plan on harvesting anytime soon,

4 Hickory, 20in diam, straight.

I know these are not ideal trees, but in my local market I can sell (over time) all the lumber that I will harvest out of them, and the rest will be pulpwood/firewood. I did hear back from the buyer today who gave me an offer which I was surprised with at the least. He offered me 1k for all of them.  That was about a month ago when he looked at my lot. Since then I sawed up one red oak and was able to sale the two main logs out of the tree for barn lumber for $1.00 a foot which yielded me a profit of $800.00.  No way I will let all these trees go for 1k, i had non intentions of letting anyone harvest them but myself, but I was curious. Anyways, just wanted to update this project I am working on here and see what you guys think about the offer of 1k. Thanks for reading, 

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Offline Ron Wenrich

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Re: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed. "UPDATED"
« Reply #15 on: February 22, 2012, 05:58:21 PM »
$20/tree.  Sounds a tad bit low, especially for those sizes.  If the oak only had 1 logs, it would still have 434 bf Doyle.  It comes out to about $50/Mbf.  Those trees don't look to be much more than pasture trees and that effects the price.  But, $20/tree is low, at least in my area. 
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Re: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed. "UPDATED"
« Reply #16 on: February 22, 2012, 06:23:34 PM »
Quote
But, $20/tree is low, at least in my area.

Sound's like he didn't really want them?

More work to harvest and process them yourself, but it seems to be the way to go.

Ian
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Offline Clark

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Re: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed. "UPDATED"
« Reply #17 on: February 22, 2012, 06:33:38 PM »
You've got some nice trees on your land there and cutting some of them is probably a good idea.  After all, it's rare that someone stumbles onto a patch of timber that can't be improved in some way and that often times involves cutting the poorer trees.  While it is relatively easy to come up with a figure of what they are worth or how many bd-ft they contain, I would suggest thinking about how much they are worth to you still standing.  Once you cut them you will never see that big of a tree there in your lifetime. 

It seems like your not really sure what you will do with the land down the road 10-20 years.  If you do end up building a cabin I can assure you that several 30" oak nearby will greatly increase it's value and usage.

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Offline cutterboy

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Re: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed. "UPDATED"
« Reply #18 on: February 22, 2012, 07:39:12 PM »
123maxbars, I have two comments. First, if you own good timber trees and you have a saw mill, and you have proven to yourself that you can sell lumber...... then never sell trees or logs.....saw them up yourself. You'll make 10 times the money and have a good time doing it.

Second, I have never had a problem selling poor quality oak lumber. By poor quality I mean defects in the boards (knots, cracks, etc.) So, go ahead, harvest the trees and sell the lumber if that's what you want to do.

Offline 123maxbars

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Re: New Land Purchase with lots of Red oak, advice needed. "UPDATED"
« Reply #19 on: February 22, 2012, 07:51:04 PM »
That is my plan cutterboy. I have never priced/sold timber from my farm. I was only curious on what type of price i would be offered for it. And it was wayyyyy lower than I imagined. 
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