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Author Topic: no excuses  (Read 5656 times)

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Offline red oaks lumber

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Re: no excuses
« Reply #40 on: April 08, 2012, 09:59:28 AM »
why would you grade saw a customers pine? or grade saw a customers wood that will be clearly used in a size specific  manner?
 the only one that benfits from grade saw in the hardwood mills, thats it. where else can you sell some thing that doesnt exsist?
the experts think i do things wrong
 over 18 million b.f. processed and 7341 happy customers i disagree

Offline Jim_Rogers

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Re: no excuses
« Reply #41 on: April 08, 2012, 10:21:09 AM »
If we go back to the original situation the customer who was talking to the sawyer, told him I want three sizes but they can be random. That to me is saying two different things. If it's random width then it's random width. If he wanted three sizes then it isn't random width, it's three sizes.

It's like saying I want my house painted red orange. Well which is it red or orange? You really can't have it both ways.

What the sawyer obviously heard was "random" only, and that's what he did. It was most likely wrong but that is what he did.

When I begin a job with a new customer or a previous customer, I go through a list of questions that I have typed up on a sheet.
The first question is what thickness do you want your lumber?
The second question is what widths do you want your lumber?

If some of the logs, or all of them, are hardwood, I explain to them that the standard for softwoods is that it usually comes in even widths, such as 4", 6", 8", 10" and 12" widths. But with hardwood you can get whatever width that the log will make. But that I try and do it in full inches, such as 4", 5", 6", 7", 8", 9", and on. But I try not to do between inches like 4 1/2" or 5 and 1/4" like that.

Most customers understand this. And another question I ask if hardwood is being sawn is "odds and even widths ok?" This just follows up on the width question to make sure they understand that they will be getting odd inch width pieces, in their pile.

I write down all these answers on the printed paper to make sure that I have it right before they leave my sawmill yard.
And these are the guidelines I use to do my best to saw the lumber the way they want it.

I am currently sawing out some red pine and white pine logs for a future timber frame, on site. The customer didn't talk to me. I was told to do the job by the builder's project manager. He told me to saw as wide as possible. And he provided me with a stock list of timber sizes for the future timber frame, which hasn't been designed yet.

On this list were 7x7 and 7x9s. So that means I'm going to have some odd width lumber. If I have a good 1x7 piece 22' long, I'm not going to saw it back to a 1x6 to make it a softwood standard width, because they told me to saw it as wide as possible. To me that meant odds and evens were alright with this order. I had to use my own judgment on that question. And so far no one has said that odd widths were wrong.

I don't want to say the customer was at fault, but he did say, in my opinion two different things. If it was me I would have not let it go and I would have questioned him more to make sure I understood what he wanted. The sawyer who did his job didn't do that. So that could be his fault for not following up on the subject of widths.

But even if he did hear the word "random" he should have sawn it to a softwood standard, such as 4", 6", 8" and up. None of these 5" or in between sizes should have been in the pile. That is what standards are all about.
Whatever you do, have fun doing it!
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Offline WoodMiller

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Re: no excuses
« Reply #42 on: April 08, 2012, 10:29:43 AM »
Hey, Red Oak -
You're right, of course.  I thought about that after I went to bed last night.  You're talking softwood (plantation trees) and I don't saw much softwood at all - mainly hardwood - grade and/or utility/fence boards.  I guess I assumed you normally dealt with hardwood, too, given your handle.  Trying to educate customers on the sawing standards and grading rules is a hard task.  If the customer is not totally ignorant of them, he/she often has misinformation loaded as fact.  A real good example is hardwood vs softwood standards.  Any Sawyer worth his sweat should understand these standards and try and educate the customer.  BUT, in the end, the customer should get what he asked for, even if it's wrong.  Case in point: sawing FAS grade white oak boards into fencing - it's his wood, and his money, so his call.
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Offline red oaks lumber

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Re: no excuses
« Reply #43 on: April 08, 2012, 12:48:18 PM »
the customer said he wanted 3 sizes and random width is ok. what part of that is confusing? when he told me that my first thought was this. he wanted 3 sizes but didnt care what those 3 sizes were to be .
 when in doubt ask questions
the experts think i do things wrong
 over 18 million b.f. processed and 7341 happy customers i disagree

Offline red oaks lumber

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Re: no excuses
« Reply #44 on: April 08, 2012, 01:00:24 PM »
woodmiller
 i actualy  came up with red oaks lumber  when my great great  grandfather settled in this area there was a picture with his homestead  on the hillside in front bordered in white rocks there was the name of his farm "red oaks farm"  from that moment i decided to call my buisness  red oaks lumber. at the time i never even thought about that might sound like all we do is rol :)
 sorry for the short history bit
the experts think i do things wrong
 over 18 million b.f. processed and 7341 happy customers i disagree

Offline Magicman

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Re: no excuses
« Reply #45 on: April 08, 2012, 07:55:34 PM »
My original take was that he wanted 3 sizes and he would install them randomly on the wall as paneling.  Same as I will do with 4 different sizes for my Cabin wall paneling.

Different words mean different things in different context.  Communication and understanding is the answer.

This all reminds me of something I read long ago:  "I know that you think you heard what I said, but you do not understand that what you think you heard is not what I meant".
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Offline customsawyer

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Re: no excuses
« Reply #46 on: April 08, 2012, 08:54:06 PM »
The only thing I can add is there is some frustration in following some sawyers as they tend to give the whole industry a bad name in some circles. This is one of the reasons that I try to help a less experienced sawyer. If I can help them to produce better lumber then it tends to come back to me. Most times it is a job that is to big for them so they call me to come help or when the logs are to big. ;D This is one of the reasons that I love this forum as we are all able to help and to learn from each other, thus making us all better at what we do.
Red oaks I would be willing to take a lesson. ;D
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Offline red oaks lumber

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Re: no excuses
« Reply #47 on: April 08, 2012, 10:09:20 PM »
customsawyer.. there ain't no teachin you but, i;m willing to give it my best shot :D
the experts think i do things wrong
 over 18 million b.f. processed and 7341 happy customers i disagree


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No more excuses

Started by Jeff on Technical Support Topics

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