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Author Topic: Tree service guy wants serious money for walnut logs!  (Read 3479 times)

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Online thecfarm

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Re: Tree service guy wants serious money for walnut logs!
« Reply #20 on: March 16, 2014, 12:59:41 PM »
If offered firewood price,he would make more money than sawing,it spliting it into firewood. Than he would still have to deliver the firewood to the customer's home too.
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Offline shelbycharger400

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Re: Tree service guy wants serious money for walnut logs!
« Reply #21 on: March 16, 2014, 01:02:34 PM »
yep,  i tried to bite and buy a yard tree yesterday,  had reflectors in it.  You could tell it had a bacteria problem the black ring of death.   all of it was scaled about 832 bd foot.. a few odd lengths,  i bid 50cents delievered  lost it to another that bid 60 and picked up   ::)   

Online thecfarm

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Re: Tree service guy wants serious money for walnut logs!
« Reply #22 on: March 16, 2014, 01:10:47 PM »
I think a member said,he never lost money on a bid he did not get.  ;D
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Offline stumpy

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Re: Tree service guy wants serious money for walnut logs!
« Reply #23 on: March 16, 2014, 01:17:18 PM »
I rarely pay for logs from tree services.  The economics and risk of quality are the reason. I carry with me a price sheet showing what the hardwood mill pays for logs(delivered to their door). I use that as a guideline for a price.  By the way, they pay between .25 to .75 per board foot for walnut. That's after THEIR grader determines the grade.  Also, they will not take a log if they know it's a yard tree. They also will not pay veneer prices if the log is not fresh cut and will only pay after a third party veneer buyer grades it.
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Offline BBTom

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Re: Tree service guy wants serious money for walnut logs!
« Reply #24 on: March 16, 2014, 02:53:37 PM »
Stumpy, 

That sounds like the stumpage price for walnut.   

I just sold to a hardwood mill over 30,000 bdft of hard maple @ .80.  Tree length picked up at the landing.
and then the Walnut to a different mill 16,000 bdft @2.00 again it was tree length picked up at the landing.

Might be an old price list? 
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Offline POSTON WIDEHEAD

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Re: Tree service guy wants serious money for walnut logs!
« Reply #25 on: March 16, 2014, 03:10:27 PM »
I think a member said,he never lost money on a bid he did not get.  ;D

LIKE  smiley_thumbsup
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Offline Okrafarmer

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Re: Tree service guy wants serious money for walnut logs!
« Reply #26 on: March 16, 2014, 08:14:10 PM »
I rarely pay for logs from tree services.  The economics and risk of quality are the reason. I carry with me a price sheet showing what the hardwood mill pays for logs(delivered to their door). I use that as a guideline for a price.  By the way, they pay between .25 to .75 per board foot for walnut. That's after THEIR grader determines the grade.  Also, they will not take a log if they know it's a yard tree. They also will not pay veneer prices if the log is not fresh cut and will only pay after a third party veneer buyer grades it.

This sounds like the prices from around here, although I doubt you'd get prices that good from the closest sizable hardwood mill. I pay more than they do.
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Offline Okrafarmer

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Re: Tree service guy wants serious money for walnut logs!
« Reply #27 on: March 16, 2014, 08:18:49 PM »
I just sold to a hardwood mill over 30,000 bdft of hard maple @ .80.  Tree length picked up at the landing.
and then the Walnut to a different mill 16,000 bdft @2.00 again it was tree length picked up at the landing.

You are blessed sir. What I want to know is, what prices are that mill receiving for their green grade lumber when they sell it? I sell my green walnut lumber (#1 common or better) for $5 / bf retail, and $6 if dry. I see planed walnut (1Face and better) in the store going for around $8-9 / bf.
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Offline Okrafarmer

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Re: Tree service guy wants serious money for walnut logs!
« Reply #28 on: March 16, 2014, 08:25:06 PM »
I agree with Cedarman on principle, and Okra on price. 18 in is not big enough to bring  big money.
FRank
+1 on Okrafarmer.  Why purchase a log that you can't sell for a profit?   Regards, Clark

Good to see I have some regional support here!  ;D

I also agree with Cedarman's post. STUFF of any kind is worth precisely what someone is willing to pay for it. Unless you are a charity, and have other means of support, your job when selling something is to receive the highest price you can manage, divided by the amount of effort it takes to receive that price.

Sales price = maximized $$$ / (time * effort)

Ok, that didn't really make sense as a formula, but it's fun to pretend to be inteligent.
 ;D :P
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Offline Ron Wenrich

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Re: Tree service guy wants serious money for walnut logs!
« Reply #29 on: March 16, 2014, 09:28:51 PM »
Its nice to think that you'll make a profit on any particular log.  The problem is, even with tons of experience, you will have logs and lumber you will lose money on.  Sometimes its just as good to minimize your loses.  We always had alternative markets for our low quality wood.  Some slipped into the mill, and we milled it.  I'm sure some good logs made it to the lower grade markets. 

If I would have tried selling just to a retail market, I would have been gone quickly.  I've seen a mill go down the tubes just with that thinking, and they got the logs for free.  It all depends on how much volume you can do, and how much inventory you want to carry.  There are carrying costs associated with that.  As well as the cost of selling much smaller lots.  We would sell a trailerload of lumber with a phone call.  Trying to find enough retail customers would require a sales staff, which would cost us production time.  Lots of tradeoffs for that higher dollar value.

Profit = sale price - log costs - mfg costs.  Carrying costs go into the mfg costs.  We always felt that we made more money by moving product than trying to search out for a little better price.  To us, cash flow was very important.  Material that is paid for and sitting on the stump, in the log yard or on the lumber pile does not bring cash flow.  It is capital intensive, and you need to be well financed to pull it off.  I remember watching a wholesaler lose quite a bit of money as the value of oak dropped while he was waiting for it to dry.  Sometimes you make money as a lumber speculator, sometimes you don't. 

In this case, I would suspect that another log buyer looked at the logs and found metal, or it was below par for his markets.  Just a hunch.
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Offline drobertson

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Re: Tree service guy wants serious money for walnut logs!
« Reply #30 on: March 17, 2014, 07:46:45 AM »
I have used a tree service for buying many times, in fact we are now pretty good friends, he uses a bucket for his work, this past week while in SC my dads neighbor had a twin oak taken down, both were in the 20"dbh, Now if this fellow that was doing the work got the money, I would pay a premium, he did it the ole fashion way, with ropes and pulleys, jibs and whatever else you call them, in the tree for close to four hours, tree spikes and a harness, pretty impressive, they sawed the wood into firewood length down to two clear saw logs, the rest was piled up for Bill,  a very neat job, for $2800.   Not sure where the logs went, they had a picker that loaded and off they went.  I have to think if a guy had a way to load logs, some of which are large, they could be had for cheap. If the clean up is quick and clean. jmo.
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

Offline Philngruvy

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Re: Tree service guy wants serious money for walnut logs!
« Reply #31 on: March 17, 2014, 07:50:38 AM »
Always amazing how the value/quality of logs can change so much from the point of buying to the point of reselling the sawn product.
 

My 2 cents.
Yes, the tree guy was paid up front to take down the tree, but why is it less acceptable for him to make a bonus on the job.  That might be a birthday present for his kid which he may not be able to afford otherwise.
Haggle the price until both parties are happy, happy, happy!  Or walk away feeling good.
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Offline dboyt

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Re: Tree service guy wants serious money for walnut logs!
« Reply #32 on: March 17, 2014, 08:42:32 AM »
If you have the means to get logs without tearing them up the yards, you have a huge advantage, though you have more time & equipment tied up.  If your time & equipment expense is $100 per hour and it takes two hours to get the log to the mill, it has cost you $200 before paying anything for the log.  I do work some with tree services, but haven't paid them for a log yet.  As far as veneer, I would NEVER sell a yard log to a veneer buyer, even if it passes the metal detector test.  Anything that comes out of a yard is grade lumber.
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Offline ely

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Re: Tree service guy wants serious money for walnut logs!
« Reply #33 on: March 17, 2014, 09:40:39 AM »
the most I have paid here is .45 cts for walnut. I have heard the old veneer this veneer that story for ever... only thing is there is not a veneer market here. I have known a few folks who put wheels on the walnut logs and went to sw mis. and found out the logs they had were not veneer grade. big expense but no money. :-X

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Re: Tree service guy wants serious money for walnut logs!
« Reply #34 on: March 18, 2014, 10:27:26 AM »
As usual, Ron is on the money. Personally, I would never buy logs that I didn't have a market for. When I have bought logs (which is rare), it is to fill an existing order. A note about veneer logs...the two buyers that I know only buy standing timber. There is no market around here for veneer logs that are already down.
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