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Author Topic: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars  (Read 10565 times)

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Offline CaptainBigWood

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Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« on: October 14, 2014, 05:47:30 AM »
I am running a Stilh 026.
Looking at a narrow kerf Stilh PS3 chain 3/8 .050 for a 20" bar.
What size sprocket is best?
Also considering upgrading the clutch to a rim sprocket.
Any thoughts on this combination?

Offline mad murdock

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Re: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« Reply #1 on: October 14, 2014, 08:36:48 AM »
You will like the switch. I run narrow kerf on my medium sized saws, really helps keep the cutting speed up when the bar is buried. I like them.
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Offline webgal

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Re: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« Reply #2 on: October 14, 2014, 09:05:33 AM »
Though you can use picco on longer bars for cutting, I've heard that the chassis is a bit weak and they are prone to break in conventional cutting after 20".

If you do want to try narrow kerf without the sprocket change there is .325 narrow kerf chain. You'll get the sturdy chassis, conventional chain lengths and narrow kerf performance. You'll need a narrow kerf bar to suit to take advantage of that nicer slice. 

Just another option.

Gotta know when to fell em, know when to tell em, know when to walk away, know when to run....

Offline HolmenTree

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Re: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« Reply #3 on: October 14, 2014, 09:25:30 AM »
I am running a Stilh 026.
Looking at a narrow kerf Stilh PS3 chain 3/8 .050 for a 20" bar.
What size sprocket is best?
Also considering upgrading the clutch to a rim sprocket.
Any thoughts on this combination?
3/8 -7T Picco rim part # 0000 642 1240 at your Stihl dealer.
024/026  rim sprocket drum kit with 7T  picco rim # 1121 007 1004
If the Stihl kit# doesn't work then order a Oregon drum kit for a 024/026 from our sponsors Bailey's.  They won't have the Picco rim though.
The 0000 642 1240 Picco rim is available through your Stihl dealer though. While there ask about the Picco guide bar available for the MS241CM which has the 63PS chisel chain setup as an option which is available here in Canada. Not sure about the U.S.
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

Online DR_Buck

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Re: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« Reply #4 on: October 14, 2014, 05:37:18 PM »
I am running a Stilh 026.
Looking at a narrow kerf Stilh PS3 chain 3/8 .050 for a 20" bar.
What size sprocket is best?
Also considering upgrading the clutch to a rim sprocket.
Any thoughts on this combination?
3/8 -7T Picco rim part # 0000 642 1240 at your Stihl dealer.
024/026  rim sprocket drum kit with 7T  picco rim # 1121 007 1004
If the Stihl kit# doesn't work then order a Oregon drum kit for a 024/026 from our sponsors Bailey's.  They won't have the Picco rim though.
The 0000 642 1240 Picco rim is available through your Stihl dealer though. While there ask about the Picco guide bar available for the MS241CM which has the 63PS chisel chain setup as an option which is available here in Canada. Not sure about the U.S.

Bailey's hasn't been a sponsor for a while now.
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Offline CaptainBigWood

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Re: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« Reply #5 on: October 14, 2014, 08:00:40 PM »
Thank you for the great information, including part numbers.     
On a standard 3/8 .50 chain 20" bar is takes 72 drive links. 
Since the gauge is the same, would the narrow kerf would also be 72?
Thank you for the education.

Offline HolmenTree

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Re: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« Reply #6 on: October 14, 2014, 08:11:43 PM »
Thank you for the great information, including part numbers.     
On a standard 3/8 .50 chain 20" bar is takes 72 drive links. 
Since the gauge is the same, would the narrow kerf would also be 72?
Thank you for the education.
Yes 72 Picco drive link chain on a standard 3/8 20" bar .

My first question is do you already have a 20" 3/8 bar on your 026?
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

Offline SawTroll

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Re: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« Reply #7 on: October 15, 2014, 05:59:56 AM »
Thank you for the great information, including part numbers.     
On a standard 3/8 .50 chain 20" bar is takes 72 drive links. 
Since the gauge is the same, would the narrow kerf would also be 72?
Thank you for the education.

Yes, if it was equally long and had abiut the same profile - but be aware that stated bar lengths are just nominal, and often quite a bit off......
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Offline mesquite buckeye

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Re: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« Reply #8 on: October 15, 2014, 11:19:01 AM »
One small comment. I like the narrow kerf bars with one caveat. They bend easy. If you get your saw stuck regularly and have to yank it out of a cut, such as in limbing or just pinchy, hard to judge lean in a thinning deal, treat them with kid gloves.

In any work where the cutting is predicatable and binding is minimal, they cut faster with less power needed.

Just sayin' ;D 8) 8) 8) :snowball:
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Offline HolmenTree

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Re: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« Reply #9 on: October 15, 2014, 12:37:56 PM »
Yes, you have to be careful with that NK stuff especially when you go over 16"b/c.

I've had good luck over the years with the .325 NK semi chisel Oregons and Carltons on my smaller saws up to 18". But the OP C.B.W. of this thread is looking at 20" with the little Picco chisel chain which I think he'll have a hard time finding a 3/8 Picco sprocket tip bar in that length .
Stihl has introduced the MS241CM with a 18" Picco setup but I believe that's as long as they go.

I do have a good supply of 16" Windsor/Sandvik Mini Pro bars with .325 and 3/8 LoPro [Picco pitch] replaceable noses, even have a few 1/4" and standard 3/8 noses too for them.
But the bars are fairly thick so when the little 1/4" or Picco chain is filed down to half sized cutters or less there's a lot more chance of pinching with that reduced kerf related to the thickness of the bar.

Here's a pic of the little 3/8" Picco chisel chain that everyone wants, I have it comparing up to the .325 NK semi chisel chain. Last pic is my 550XP with one of my vintage 1980's Mini Pro bars.
 

  

 
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Offline HolmenTree

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Re: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« Reply #10 on: October 15, 2014, 12:43:51 PM »
Here's one more Stihl 63PS pic at a different angle with the Husky .325 NK.
 

 
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Offline HolmenTree

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Re: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« Reply #11 on: October 15, 2014, 07:55:17 PM »
.................OOPs something happened here ??? got posted before I hit post button
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Offline HolmenTree

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Re: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« Reply #12 on: October 15, 2014, 08:03:28 PM »
Here I'll try again  :D
This chain I won't recommend for the OP's 026 but works just fine on a wee little MS150 or battery saw.
Here's another pic of a Stihl "mother of invention" sawchain.....the 71 PM3.
It's another  Picco chain but in 1/4" extended pitch. Without the extended cutter the cutter bit would be of about 1/8" pitch equivalent   or less......tiny little chain, another 1st for the industry.
 

 
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Offline webgal

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Re: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« Reply #13 on: October 15, 2014, 09:15:19 PM »
Holmen mentioned finding a 20" bar suitable for low profile would be tricky. Cannon advertises one. They are certainly a rare item though. Hence my .325 narrow kerf option to keep things more standard.

http://www.baileysonline.com/Chainsaw-Bars/Professional-Replaceable-Sprocket-Nose-Guide-Bars/Cannon-RSN-Guide-Bars/Cannon-Super-Mini-Guide-Bars/Cannon-20-SuperMini-Chainsaw-Bar-for-Stihl-72-Drive-Links-CSM-S1-20-50-3LM.axd
Gotta know when to fell em, know when to tell em, know when to walk away, know when to run....

Offline HolmenTree

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Re: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« Reply #14 on: October 15, 2014, 09:29:06 PM »
Holmen mentioned finding a 20" bar suitable for low profile would be tricky. Cannon advertises one. They are certainly a rare item though. Hence my .325 narrow kerf option to keep things more standard.

http://www.baileysonline.com/Chainsaw-Bars/Professional-Replaceable-Sprocket-Nose-Guide-Bars/Cannon-RSN-Guide-Bars/Cannon-Super-Mini-Guide-Bars/Cannon-20-SuperMini-Chainsaw-Bar-for-Stihl-72-Drive-Links-CSM-S1-20-50-3LM.axd
Thanks for finding that and posting it for us Caprice! We now have to look no further.
Very important to run a 3/8 LoPro chain on a bar with the same pitch in the nose along with the drive sprocket.
Here's my Cannon Super Mini bar I bought off you guys at Bailey's a few years back, outfitted on my 562XP. It's a 18" standard 3/8" pitch bar, one of the best bars I've  ever run.
It looks like Cannon took over the design of the discontinued Windsor/Sandvik Mini Pro bars that I showed earlier of the ones I own. Both of these bar's sprocket replaceable tips interchange.
 

  

 
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

Offline HolmenTree

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Re: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« Reply #15 on: October 15, 2014, 09:34:00 PM »
To add to my last post this chain is a standard 3/8" pitch chisel chain called a Oregon 76LG .050
This chain was discontinued about 20 years or so ago. Looks more like a .325 but is an actual standard 3/8 chain.
Beautiful smooth cutting chain.

 
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Offline HolmenTree

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Re: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« Reply #16 on: October 16, 2014, 09:14:48 AM »
A photo here of my 2 Husqvarna's comparing Cannon's copy of the old discontinued Windsor/Sandvik Mini Pro bars. Both noses interchange, only difference is the Cannon's nose is slightly longer for better wear durability.
 

  

 
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Offline barbender

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Re: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« Reply #17 on: October 18, 2014, 09:22:24 AM »
I really like the way Oregon 95vp chain cuts, on my 346xp Husky. However, the bars don't hold up for me. The sprocket tips invariably let go, usually after only running 2 or 3 chains. Holmen, I really like the look of those Super mini bars.
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Offline SawTroll

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Re: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« Reply #18 on: October 18, 2014, 09:43:37 AM »
To add to my last post this chain is a standard 3/8" pitch chisel chain called a Oregon 76LG .050
This chain was discontinued about 20 years or so ago. Looks more like a .325 but is an actual standard 3/8 chain.
Beautiful smooth cutting chain.

 (Image hidden from quote, click to view.)

Oregon 76/77 has low profile cutters on a standard size 3/8" chassis, like the Oregon 33/34/35 in .325 and Stihl Topic in both pitches. Most of those models are discontinued.

Does that bar have a 9 t nose?
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Re: Narrow Kerf Chains and Bars
« Reply #19 on: October 18, 2014, 09:44:38 AM »
I really like the way Oregon 95vp chain cuts, on my 346xp Husky. However, the bars don't hold up for me. The sprocket tips invariably let go, usually after only running 2 or 3 chains. Holmen, I really like the look of those Super mini bars.
Yes these Cannon bars are a superior bar, they definitely improved the quality over the old Mini Pro bars. Like pointed out earlier every pitch of sprocket under .404 is available for them just like the old Mini Pros.
Making a living with a saw since age 16.


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