homemade mill and autofeed

[Rickcnc]

What roll does the output frequency play on the speed controllers and dc motors?   The one revid showed us is rated a 100hz.. and Kbeitz is rated at 15000 hz..
I played with brushless motors and controllers in my days of RC flying, every one I saw had three wires.

[Kbeitz]

You could try one of these. No electronics.

200W 10 OHM High Power Wirewound Potentiometer

E-bay has them for $32.00

[revid]

Kbeitz, what do you think might of happened? Do you think I wired it wrong? If I did I did,just would like to know whats going on. Iam thinking of ordering one of these:
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/12V-50A-dc-Reversible-DC-Motor-Controller-4Q-DC-Motor-Controls-Froward-Reverse-Braking-Soft-Start/32654338839.html
what do you think?

[Kbeitz]

Looks ok but you could get it for 1/2 that price on E-bay.
But if it was me I would go foe the 100 amp board.
That would be so much stronger.

[fishfighter]

Got this thread book marked. Great info. I looking to automate things on my mill in time.

[pineywoods]

Speed controllers 101

These controllers do not actually reduce the output voltage to the motor. They use Pulse Width Modulation. Think an on-off switch with a fast little monkey flipping the switch at a high rate of speed. 50% on to 50% off gives effectively half voltage out. That pulsed voltage needs to be filtered to smooth out the spikes. Otherwise, when the voltage to the motor suddenly drops to zero, the motor windings act like a reverse polarity generator and throws a negative voltage back to the transistors in the regulator. MOSFET Transistors don't like that and tend to let the magic smoke escape..Two methods of preventing this. A big husky diode (one way valve) in series with the power lead to the motor to block the reverse voltage OR connected across the motor windings to absorb it. Abig filter capacitor in conjunction with the diode effectively smoothes the pulsing voltage to something resembling smooth DC. For maximum effiency, the filter capicitor needs to be matched to the motor windings and the amount of current applied...AND the frequency of the regulator. Be carefull with off-the shelf speed regulators, most of them will NOT have the protective diode and filter cap on board. The protective diode must have a current rating (amps) at least as high as the current draw on the motor and a voltage rating several times the supply voltage..They ain't cheap...

[fishfighter]

revid........

Here is a power feed I put on a Norwood Mark 4 that I had a few years ago.
I used a wheelchair motor and the speed controller off of the wheelchair.
The motor would run on 12 volts but I had to use 24 volts for the controller
to operate. Good control on power and speed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ImwGDHLBC_U

If you were to do this again, would you used two motors to drive the mill?

I'm looking at a wheelchair that is 24V with twin motor drive that I thinking of buying for a set up like you did.

_______________________----
Charles

[fishfighter]

Just about finish my trailer. Just need to do jack stands.

I was in need of two tires. No place around had any used 15". Was told they are hard to come by these days.

Went to Wally World and they had two new ones that I just knew that they would work out great leveling out the trailer. Yep, good call, they did. ;D Paid $105 out the door for the two. At this point, I have around $200 total in the trailer. ;D



 



 

Woodland does have plans at there web site, but kind of hard to read them on a laptop. :D Tried zooming in with little to no help. :( Still, it was a good start off point for me to go by. ;D

[Josh3760]

I was down at the mill working today. Figured I would get a pic of the mill with auto feed and power lift on and working. By far the two best mods yet since I built it. also put an electronic selonoid on the   blade lube actuated by a toggle switch.

https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/41293/IMG_20160425_163809239.jpg

[revid]

Nice job. I am giving up on the auto feed motor I have cause I can't get a speed controller to work. Looking to get some wheel chair motors like you have . What # gears you have on your height adjustment ? I gues it doesn't matter on the auto feed cause you can slow it foe with controller. Did you use controller that came with wheelchair?

[fishfighter]

Josh, nice clear job. Your motors, are they 12V or 24V? Are you happy with the speed when cutting? Gear sizes? We need more info. ;D

Got the mill installed on my trailer. Just need to install the stabilizers maybe today. I have the metal, just need to cut everything up.



 

I can already see that this is going to help my back big time. Adding a auto feed, I see that will take a lot of extra work out when sawing. ;D

[Josh3760]

Nice job. I am giving up on the auto feed motor I have cause I can't get a speed controller to work. Looking to get some wheel chair motors like you have . What # gears you have on your height adjustment ? I gues it doesn't matter on the auto feed cause you can slow it foe with controller. Did you use controller that came with wheelchair?

No i used the same controler as kb. I dont remember what size gears i used next time im down there i will check

[revid]

so no problem using one motor with the controller? I guess if the motor goes on the right side of your mill looking at the direction you have to saw you need the right side motor of the wheelchair? Did you use joystick of wheel chair also or can you rig up another directional switch? any difference between wheel chair motors,I mean does some have more power or are there certain you have to look for in the specs of the motor so you can use it for autofeed? Reason Iam asking is cause iam about to buy one and its controller for my mill and want to make sure it will wotk.lol

[fishfighter]

Getting there with the trailer. Still looking around for parts and pieces to automate.

Welded a bunch of these. Drilled, welded a nut and then tapped them. Tubing is 3/16, so that will give some extra bite for the stabilizer legs which are 2"x2"x3/16.



 

Of course my welding sucks, but it is kind of hard to weld and spinning in circles. DanG vertigo. >:(

I do have two sets in place.



 



 

That is a 3/8" bolt that should hold the leg in place. If not, I will add one or two more. ;D I was thinking of adding a Tee handle to the bolt head, but I think I could get the bolt tighter using a wrench to lock it in place.

Oh, Woodland has plans for the trailer. For the legs, they called for a 20 degree setting. I think it should of been no less then 25 degrees, but went with the 20.

[Josh3760]

so no problem using one motor with the controller? I guess if the motor goes on the right side of your mill looking at the direction you have to saw you need the right side motor of the wheelchair? Did you use joystick of wheel chair also or can you rig up another directional switch? any difference between wheel chair motors,I mean does some have more power or are there certain you have to look for in the specs of the motor so you can use it for autofeed? Reason Iam asking is cause iam about to buy one and its controller for my mill and want to make sure it will wotk.lol

Trailer is looking good!

I'm no expert on wheel chair motors. I'm sure there are differences between them but what they are I cannot tell you. I found a chair localy for less then a $100. It makes no difference on where or what side u mount them as they can be flipped upside down or mount the motors horizontally. Remember most wheel chairs are 24v so u will have to run two battery's to use the chair controler. I'm quite happy with the speed on mine just using 12v.

[Kbeitz]

There is a very big difference in wheelchair motors in size.
Some are way to small and some would be an overkill.
This is the biggest I've had. About 6" dia.



 

Wheelchair controlers would work fine untill you needed to replace one.
Then you would be makeing a trip to the bank.

[revid]

Oh I didn't know you could run a 24 v on 12!! Good to know and no difference in power or speed ?Controller got no issues with the smaller volts ?

[revid]

Ok guys was going to buy wheel chair motor , controller and the joystick on eBay but was told I didn't need the controller just the joystick to use and slow down the motor to use for an auto feed . Is this right? If not what do I need to use one of them motors for an auto feed ? I got a small dc motor now but can't get a speed controller to work,already fried one. Had it hooked to controller and switch but only lasted a few runs. Got a drum switch now though. Didn't think it would be this *DanG difficult . Lol

[Slingshot]

 
  revid,
           The wheelchair motor on the Norwood Mark4 shown in the video I posted
  earlier in the thread was controlled with the joy-stick AND controller from the
  same wheelchair. The box containing the joy-stick was also the controller.
     I learned later that there were actually 2 controllers in the box, one for each
  motor. The instructions stated to lean joy-stick to the right for right motor
  and lean to left for left motor. Don't know if they could have been separated
  or not. (pineywoods might know). I sold the Mark 4 with power feed still on it.
     Also, the motor worked fine on 12 volts but 12 volts would not activate the
  controller so had to use 24 volts.


___________________________

Charles

[pineywoods]

Yeah, the motors will run fine on 12 volts, but at reduced power/speed. Controller absolutely must have 24 volts. In fact, the internal processor checks the battery voltage when it' first powered up and will shut off the motors and lock the brakes if the voltage is much lower than 18 volts...Be aware that the joystick is separate from the actual controller, with a cable between them.  The exception is a dynamic controls model DL5, it's all one unit, joystick and 2 controllers in one box, no wiring harness required.

[revid]

Thanks guys.So I guess there's no way in knowing if I buy a motor of eBay if I need the controller and joystick together to run the motor(s)?

[pineywoods]

Thanks guys.So I guess there's no way in knowing if I buy a motor of eBay if I need the controller and joystick together to run the motor(s)?

You will need matching joystick and controller, motor not so picky. On power  up, the controller checks to see if the joystick is there AND is in the neutral position. Otherwise it will disable the motors, lock the brakes and blink an error code. If you run across something that looks ok, go to the manufacturer's web site and download a copy of the installation manual for that model #. Free and you will learn a bunch...Otherwise, best bet is to trash out an entire wheelchair, probably cheaper too..Used chairs are usually cheap, and most of the time all they need is 2 12 volt batteries...

[fishfighter]

Going look at one today. $100, but the batteries are dead. Saw on ebay that I could buy two new ones for around $130. I wonder if those batteries would work out on the sawmill and how long would they last? They are a lot smaller the car batteries and I'm sure I could some how mount the batteries on the mill head. That way I wouldn't have wires all over the place. ;D

Oh, I could pull the on board charger, box it and then be able to use it that way.

Piney, the chair 'm looking at is a Pronto M71. Anything I should look for?

[Kbeitz]

Not all wheelchair batterys are small. I got two large ones on my carrage.
They dont raise with the carrage, but they do ride along.



 



 

[pineywoods]

Wheel chair/scooter batteries normally are 3 different sizes..12-15 amp/hour for small portable jobs, 35 ah standard and 70 ah on heavy duty ones. They are sealed lead acid, sometimes the agm type. Nothin critical at all. I ran one for a while with a lawn mower battery and a 12 volt jumper pack till I could get the proper batteries. Battery capacity shouldn't be a problem. Most wheel chair users ride for a day or 2 between charges. There will be a battery charge level indicator on the control head, usually lights, but sometimes a meter...Plugging in the charger will disable the controller so nobody can drive away with the charger still hooked up..

Fish, one of the wife's chairs is a pronto, I think M6, I do have the manuals. I think the controller and joystick are made by dynamic controls..
We don't like it as a chair because of design problems with the suspension,