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Author Topic: 353 Detroit oil recommend  (Read 5731 times)

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Offline Timbercruiser

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353 Detroit oil recommend
« on: August 07, 2016, 10:26:10 PM »
Hi everyone I have a timber jack with a 353 .  It gets cold where I live and I used a propane engine heater to get started it works good.  But in the cold I had trouble with 30wt oil and getting oil pressure.  So I switched to a syn multi grade oil.  Lots of guys say don't use multi grade in a detroit.  So has anyone ever used a straight 20 weight or a straight 10 oil ??    I feel using 30 wt and not having oil pressure is no good. So what's worse no oil pressure for a min or multi grade oil. 

Offline Oliver05262

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Re: 353 Detroit oil recommend
« Reply #1 on: August 07, 2016, 10:44:07 PM »
  Detroit always specified a straight 40 weight, low ash content oil for the summer temps, and said you could use SAE 30 in the winter. If you have a long, skinny gauge tube from the engine to your oil pressure gauge, you may not see a pressure reading right away. You could put in a tee and mount a gauge right close to the engine to confirm this.
  Having said this, a lot of people are using 15W/40 oil with good results; I prefer to use straight weight oil if I can get it. I would not think this is a good application for synthetic oil, if only because of the tendency for synthetic oils to leak  more than mineral oils (making a regular annoyance of leaking even more expensive).
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Offline Spartan

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Re: 353 Detroit oil recommend
« Reply #2 on: August 07, 2016, 10:51:43 PM »
I just went through the oil thing with my detroit, getting too sooty.
Here's my philosophy.  If the multi-grade is 15-40, you are not helping things by dropping to the lower end of the spectrum with 20 weight or 10.  I cringe at the idea of running lower than 30 because I feel the tolerances would be too loose in the engine, hence an oil pressure drop and the pump cant keep up.  But  that's how I think.
From what I learned through some detroit publications is that the major problem with the multi-grades is sulfated ash content.  Maybe someone else will chime in on something else.  But anyways, an oil with a sulfated ash rating of 1% or less is what is recommended.  the big three that this publication stated (That's common in all the stores around here) as acceptable multi vis brands were the mobil delvac 1300 super, rotella t, and chevron delo 400.

I personally would not want any times of no oil pressure in my engine, thats a hard life to run with all the oil in your pan and not up in the block.
I am willing to risk maybe a little more frequent oil change than have potential metal on metal.  I am in a cold climate as well.  single weights scare me with that, especially on an older motor with wear and having to drop the oil weight to 30.  The engine still operates and the temperature it operates at regardless of the start up temp. At least mine does within 15 degrees.  So I'm not keen on running less than 40 weight in mine.  Personal opinion.

here's the publication I got my info from.
https://www.demanddetroit.com/pdf/vocations/lube-oil-fuel-requirements.pdf

You can also check oils out on the web in their PDS or product data sheet and it should list the sulfated ash content in percentages.
the one most people I have heard recommend is delo 100 straight 40 and that content is .80%  The multis I listed above are 1%  So you are talking a 2 tenths of a percent difference.  I will just keep up on the maintenance a little better for .2% rather than risk excessive wear.

btw I have run multi vis in mine for a year or so, thats all that I have had it for, so far so good. although the last stuff I put in got a little ashy and I waited a long time for a oil change  :o

Offline ScottAR

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Re: 353 Detroit oil recommend
« Reply #3 on: August 08, 2016, 02:32:28 AM »
Delo 100 sae 40 meets the spec the best... Lighter weights for colder weather.
Scott
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Offline danbuendgen

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Re: 353 Detroit oil recommend
« Reply #4 on: August 08, 2016, 05:59:34 AM »
Over all Detroit's like thicker oil compared modern motors. I have ran 15w40 and so did the last owner, but I think the oil pressure was low when warmed up. Plus Detroit says not too.
When you say that with 30wt in winter, your motor has no oil pressure, is that just at start up or all day long?
If its just at start up, I bet its building pressure fine, but that the thick oil is not making it to the gauge right away.
I run my 4-53 on Shell Rotella T 40wt all year now. I would rather use Delo 40wt, but can't find it locally. Starts up ok in the cold, but does require a sniff of starting fluid. But with mine, it has crazy high oil pressure starting in the cold. Its all that thick oil, and the clearances in the motor. If it wont start, then its too cold to be out logging in a unheated cab. I would think with your engine heater, you should have no issues with 30wt or even 40wt all year long. I would be hesitant running 10 or 20 wt. I know people that do it, it helps getting started up first thing, but I think it would get too thin once the motor is warmed up. GOOD LUCK.
Husqvarna ~ TimberJack ~ Dodge Cummins

Offline David-L

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Re: 353 Detroit oil recommend
« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2016, 06:34:37 AM »
CF-2 is a Detroit rating, I have used Delvac 1300 15-40 in the cold winter months with no issues in a 353 screamer. It's 1.0 ash and CF-2. This was an old jug of it where I get my Dolmars serviced. CF-2 on the jug, check there website. Still running this oil in the Cummins 4bt in the 240. This is good oil.




 
In two days from now, tomorrow will be yesterday.

Offline Ox

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Re: 353 Detroit oil recommend
« Reply #6 on: August 10, 2016, 12:10:03 PM »
When those engines were made they didn't have multiple viscosity oils.  If they had they would have recommended 15W-40.  When cold it cranks like a 15 weight oil and when hot performs like a 40 weight oil.  It's a beautiful thing.  :)
K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple Stupid
Use it up, wear it out, make it do or do without
1989 GMC 3500 4x4 diesel dump and plow truck, 1964 Oliver 1600 Industrial with Parsons loader and backhoe, 1986 Zetor 5211, Cat's Claw sharpener, single tooth setter, homemade Linn Lumber 1900 style mill, old tools

Offline Puffergas

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Re: 353 Detroit oil recommend
« Reply #7 on: August 10, 2016, 12:23:58 PM »
From the manual.




Jeff
Somewhere 20 miles south of Lake Erie.

GEHL 5624 skid steer, Trojan 114, Timberjack 225D, D&L SB1020 mill, Steiger Bearcat II

Offline Ox

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Re: 353 Detroit oil recommend
« Reply #8 on: August 10, 2016, 12:30:26 PM »
It seems multi grade oils were made sooner than I thought.  The old timers I used to know knew alot of things but apparently were a little off in this statement!  I retract my earlier post.  :-[ :D
K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple Stupid
Use it up, wear it out, make it do or do without
1989 GMC 3500 4x4 diesel dump and plow truck, 1964 Oliver 1600 Industrial with Parsons loader and backhoe, 1986 Zetor 5211, Cat's Claw sharpener, single tooth setter, homemade Linn Lumber 1900 style mill, old tools

Offline jwilly3879

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Re: 353 Detroit oil recommend
« Reply #9 on: August 10, 2016, 05:07:22 PM »
We run 15-40 rotella in the winter and straight 40w in the summer and have not had a oil pressure or consumption problem.

The old 3-53 runs 50psi wide open and 20psi at idle with the 40w in summer.

It runs about the same in the winter with the 15-40 but cranks over much better when it is cold.

Offline snowstorm

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Re: 353 Detroit oil recommend
« Reply #10 on: August 10, 2016, 07:39:22 PM »
i ran a 6v92 for 25 yrs with 15 40 irving ido in it. its fine use it if you want. the tech manuals were written in the 70's then 40wt was better. not now

Offline Maine logger88

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Re: 353 Detroit oil recommend
« Reply #11 on: August 10, 2016, 08:51:00 PM »
I've always ran 15/40 in any of the detroits I've been around. I use that delvac most of the time especially if it's on sale lol
79 TJ 225 81 JD 540B Husky and Jonsered saws

Offline Spartan

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Re: 353 Detroit oil recommend
« Reply #12 on: August 10, 2016, 09:02:37 PM »
the manual says, you should not use the multi vis in MARINE 2 strokes. 

Offline Ox

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Re: 353 Detroit oil recommend
« Reply #13 on: August 10, 2016, 09:44:35 PM »
I'd like to know why not multi viscosity in a Detroit 2 stroke marine diesel.  Marine engines tend to run cooler from my understanding is all I can think of to be different really.

On every diesel and air cooled engine we've always ran 15W-40 on the farm.  Never any problems.  And I'm sure they were recommended something from the 60s.  Oils today are superior to anything that was around then.  Just sayin' if this is worth anything to anyone.  :)
K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple Stupid
Use it up, wear it out, make it do or do without
1989 GMC 3500 4x4 diesel dump and plow truck, 1964 Oliver 1600 Industrial with Parsons loader and backhoe, 1986 Zetor 5211, Cat's Claw sharpener, single tooth setter, homemade Linn Lumber 1900 style mill, old tools

Offline danbuendgen

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Re: 353 Detroit oil recommend
« Reply #14 on: August 10, 2016, 09:56:40 PM »
http://www.4btswaps.com/forum/showthread.php?25604-1969-Ford-F-250-with-a-Detroit-Diesel-4-53-Oil-questions-Engine-damage

http://www.heavyequipmentforums.com/showthread.php?16270-4-53-Detroit-Question

Both these link are other forums of folks talking about what oil to run in a Detroit. The first link, last post has pictures of 40wt and 15w40 run in a Detroit. Just thought I would share it.
Husqvarna ~ TimberJack ~ Dodge Cummins

Offline Garys Mill

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Re: 353 Detroit oil recommend
« Reply #15 on: January 07, 2017, 02:11:02 PM »
i live in saskatchewan canada,when i bought my first my firsy 664b clark it needed the blower rebuilt i took it to an old fellow who worked for 35 yrs rebuilding detroits.the first thing he asked me when i got there there was what engine oil are you using,i said i think it has 15w40 in it and he said to me get that [I have typed a profane word that is automatically changed by the forum censored words program I should know better] out of there you put staight sae 30 or 40 in in it the summer and straight sae 10 in the winter and you wont have trouble so i took his advise and no problems.words of wisdom i think so.

Offline Ox

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Re: 353 Detroit oil recommend
« Reply #16 on: January 07, 2017, 10:31:32 PM »
I'd really love to know exactly why.  You know, the science behind it.  It's common knowledge that multi viscosity oils protect better than straight weight oils.  I want to know why this isn't so for Detroit 2 stroke diesels.
K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple Stupid
Use it up, wear it out, make it do or do without
1989 GMC 3500 4x4 diesel dump and plow truck, 1964 Oliver 1600 Industrial with Parsons loader and backhoe, 1986 Zetor 5211, Cat's Claw sharpener, single tooth setter, homemade Linn Lumber 1900 style mill, old tools

Offline barbender

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Re: 353 Detroit oil recommend
« Reply #17 on: January 08, 2017, 12:01:52 AM »
The only "science" I have found about this is that DD's need a low ash oil, I don't know the reason but that's the specs. Multi-vis oils used to have a high ash content, oil that had the CFll rating I think it was, were low ash straight weight oils. Oils for modern diesels are all low ash because of emissions equipment, I'm about ready to dump some 5w-40 synthetic in my ol skidder with the DD 3-53 and see what it thinks ;)
Too many irons in the fire

Offline bushmechanic

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Re: 353 Detroit oil recommend
« Reply #18 on: January 08, 2017, 07:37:01 AM »
Use a magnetic basepan heater and viola problem solved  :D .

Offline coxy

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Re: 353 Detroit oil recommend
« Reply #19 on: January 08, 2017, 08:00:32 AM »
they also say not to over load trucks and equipment but do we listen  8)  barbender my buddy started running the shell 5 40 in his new rebuilt  4 53 for the last 3 months and no trouble yet and he runs his dd hard and  at 3200 rpm   he also rebuilds them ;D


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