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Forestry and Logging / Re: 3pt Logging Winch Build

« Last post by GigaRift on Today at 05:37:24 PM »
Gigarift.

I have checked high and low, winches in north america, and europe.

What i see, about braden and other military winches, modified to run on hydraulics, is, that they are too slow, or lack power.

5.15 gpm is nothing for a winch i think. Here your ratio is 21/1

So if you pull 10 tons on the lower layer, The drum looks approximately 5 inches in diameter. So that's 2.5" from the axis.

You divide your 10 tons (metric, that i know best)

That's 22000 pounds.

A foot divided by 2.5 inches, is 4.8

So 22000/ 4.8 = 4583 lb/ft.

This divided by  21. That's 218 lb/ft on the input shaft.  18.7 lb/in This is nothing for an hydraulic motor.

But you need approximately 2500 rpm, on the input shaft, to have 79cm cm/s on the lower layer.

Guys here, told me 1 to 1.2 m/s is good.

Well, re looking at it, it seems feasible. Tho, guys will certainly correct me. I must have forgotten something.


https://www.parker.com/literature/Hydraulic%20Pump%20&%20Motor/HY13-1590-010-High-Speed.pdf
So, if i ran it off the pto at 1:1 540 rpm. Starting in reverse with your calculations.
540/21 = 25.7 drum rpm
With a circumference of 15.7 on the inner layer 
25.7*15.7 = 403.5 in per min == 33.6 ft/min
Now at 540 rpm at 19hp at the pto, i have 184.8 ft/lb.

184.8*21 = 3880.8 ft/lb to the drum axis

3880.8*4.8 = 18627.8 line pull on the inner layer

So if my calculations are right, which there is a good chance i missed something. I should be able to get 18627.8lb at 33.6ft/min, which i would be satisfied with.
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Forestry and Logging / Re: 3pt Logging Winch Build

« Last post by thecfarm on Today at 05:24:13 PM »
You only have 19hp at the drawbar? You won't be pulling alot with it anyways.
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Forestry and Logging / Re: 3pt Logging Winch Build

« Last post by GigaRift on Today at 05:21:12 PM »
Thanks for the reply and pics whatwas. Looks nice, do you run it using chain, also are you running a 1:1 ratio to the input shaft?
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Forestry and Logging / Re: Vacation pics from mi homeland. Switzerland

« Last post by thecfarm on Today at 05:17:40 PM »
I can't decide what I like best,mountains,equipment,woods??
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What was the excavator for?  Im seeing a super short stick and a concrete grabber bucket in forward shovel config.  ??   Wierd setup.  

Nice pics
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Forestry and Logging / 1270 help

« Last post by WyoLogger on Today at 05:08:25 PM »
I have a 1270 harvester that I'm having some trouble with. It has a 762B head on it.
the first issue is feeding the log through after felling it. I am having to manually open the delimbing knives to get the tree to feed. The book that I have isnt helping much with this problem. Also my auto tilt stopped working after if lost the computer and had to put a new one in it.

Any help or ideas on how to fix these issues would be great.
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Sawmills and Milling / Lt40 diesel auto throttle issue

« Last post by nopoint on Today at 05:00:48 PM »
I am having an issue with my lt40 with the cat diesel. When I throttle down the selinoid that controls the throttle doesn’t release. The belt losening mechanism works but engine stays at operating speed. Obviously solenoid releases when wire is removed. I also switched the relay around with the identical stater relay and made no difference. This started as an intermittent problem but has turned to 100% of the time. Any ideas? Maybe just a sign that 90 is too hot to saw. 
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General Board / Re: My Mama said there would be days like that

« Last post by WV Sawmiller on Today at 04:52:32 PM »
   Glad you did not lose any small children in the lawn. Sounds like a Jeff Foxworthy topic coming on if you ask me. Happy I did not see a report of wasp stings.

  I got out weedeating around the yard a bit yesterday when the sun went behind the mountains and we had some shade and a little cooler. Made a good start then got to trimming the grass in a spring runoff on the other side of my backyard fence between the yard and the pasture fences. First time I have cut that small corner this year. It stays wet all the time there and I even threw some old locust tops in ther to stand on otherwise you just bog up in it. Got the worst of it done then suddenly the weedeater head exploded. The collar holding everything together came loose and Lord only knows where it went. I could not find it then or today. Got all the parts back except the collar. Lost one a couple years ago the same way and still haven't found it. I may stop by the Stihl dealer Wednesday and see if they sell that part but I suspect I will just have to buy a new head. Oh well, ain't nothing but a thing.
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Forestry and Logging / Re: 3pt Logging Winch Build

« Last post by whatwas on Today at 04:52:15 PM »
I have used a Braden winch for 30+ years powered by PTO. If you get it snuffed up than just back it off by spinning the PTO shaft backwards, if you really snuff er' than a small bar threaded through the "u" joint is required.
Just don't put the base blade against something solid like a stump or a big rock and 9 times outta 10 you can back up enough to release the dog.
I would suggest making the cable the "weak link" because you can get in bad trouble real quick if the log gets jammed, that winch will put you in a position where you may have to throw your nickers away.


 You can see by the welds ,I've had to decapitate it twice, once to replace the bronze gear and once to remove the internal brake band, I use a cable operated disc brake caliper (snowmobile) to slow the drum and not make a birds nest when you release the dog.
Good luck (

 
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Forestry and Logging / Re: looking

« Last post by mike_belben on Today at 04:49:07 PM »
I told my second wife the same exact thing.
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Forestry and Logging / Re: Vacation pics from mi homeland. Switzerland

« Last post by barbender on Today at 04:48:10 PM »
That scenery is stunning!
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Forestry and Logging / Re: 3pt Logging Winch Build

« Last post by Satamax on Today at 04:23:04 PM »
DMcCoy, you're forgetting a part in the equation, the calculation i did, is for the first layer, where the pull is at it's maximum. 

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Forestry and Logging / Re: 3pt Logging Winch Build

« Last post by GigaRift on Today at 04:04:41 PM »
You are correct on the drum size. It is 5" inside diameter and 14" outside. The worm gear ratio is 21:1. DMcCoy, i understand what you are saying with my actual need for 20 000lb capacity. But i am unsure of how much i would actually need as i have never pulled logs or wood with winch before. So i will try to play with some numbers and see if i can get a capacity and speed that my suit my needs if not i guess ill run it pto.

If i did go with the pto with 19 hp at the pto would that be capable of pulling the 20 000lb and possibly use some gearing up to get high that 540 to the input?
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General Board / Re: My Mama said there would be days like that

« Last post by TKehl on Today at 04:00:02 PM »
I hear you.  Been trying to mow the lawn here...

Aired up the tires, but the mower wouldn't start.  Suspected a bad battery, but couldn't test it as the battery in my battery tester was bad.  Tester takes a G23 oddball, so didn't have one at home...  >:(  Tried charging it, but without the tester, I didn't know if the charger or the battery was bad....  Wouldn't have mattered though as I was out of gas in my cans.  ::)

Put a new battery in, aired up the tires, and filled the tank with gas.  Fired right up!  ;D  Unfortunately so did the paper wasps that had built a nest under the dash.  :o

All I had was WD40, but the wasps left the nest.  ;)  Now the only maintenance is airing up one of the tires 3 times per tank of gas and I think one of the spindles is going out.   :-\  Oh well, at least it cuts now.  We about lost the toddler in the lawn the other day.   :D
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Drying and Processing / Re: Kiln insulation

« Last post by Bnewman712 on Today at 03:28:26 PM »
Cool what does setting pitch mean??  
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Sawmills and Milling / Re: Edger with laser capabilities

« Last post by moodnacreek on Today at 03:22:43 PM »
If the same person runs the edger they won't need the shift saw laser after they get used to it. A fixed saw guide line is all they need and simple to install.
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Sawmills and Milling / Re: Whatcha Sawin' ???

« Last post by YellowHammer on Today at 02:56:38 PM »
BB, at least you know there is some serious suction if the hose is collapsing. 

I like your concrete pads.  

The blower has a 6 inch inlet, I went with smooth duct along a wall to about the middle of the mill frame, then to the swivel, then maybe 10 feet, maybe a dozen or so flex hose to the exhaust on the mill.  That way I could get full travel, and have a minimum of flex hose which has corrugations and reduces flow.  The swivel will really take the twisting strain off the flex hose and keep it from kinking.  

You have a very nice setup.  
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Forestry and Logging / Re: 3pt Logging Winch Build

« Last post by DMcCoy on Today at 02:51:01 PM »
I left my brake plates in and set them loose, it works ok. 

What I see you wondering about is tons of pulling power.  Without re reading the whole thread I think is was Santamax that mentioned hydraulic winches are 'usually' either underpowered or too slow.

There is a trade off.  Your tractor hydraulic HP is the limiting factor.  Then it becomes a decision with which is most important.  Having a winch capable of 20,000 lbs is great.  Having to hang onto a winch line for 1/2 hr to respool the line sucks.   Try and figure your average real need for winching, not your max.  Is it really 20,000 lbs or more like 8,000lbs.  If you set it up for your average then your line speed will be about as good (fast) as you can get it.  For the super heavy stuff a good snatch block will double your power and halve your speed. 
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Sawmills and Milling / Re: Edger with laser capabilities

« Last post by Southside logger on Today at 02:37:09 PM »
I was going to go the laser route but ended up putting a ruler on each cross bracket on my Riehl instead.  Works like a charm, took maybe 10 boards to train my eye to line up on number all the way down.  If I have any doubt I just pick the board up a tad to look at the ruler and adjust accordingly. Cost a lot less money and I did not have to get into a bunch of complicated linkage for the laser.  
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Forestry and Logging / Re: 3pt Logging Winch Build

« Last post by Satamax on Today at 02:34:12 PM »
5.15 gpm is nothing for a winch i think. Here your ratio is 21/1

So if you pull 10 tons on the lower layer, The drum looks approximately 5 inches in diameter. So that's 2.5" from the axis.

You divide your 10 tons (metric, that i know best)

That's 22000 pounds.

A foot divided by 2.5 inches, is 4.8

So 22000/ 4.8 = 4583 lb/ft.

This divided by  21. That's 218 lb/ft on the input shaft.  18.7 lb/in This is nothing for an hydraulic motor.

But you need approximately 2500 rpm, on the input shaft, to have 79cm cm/s on the lower layer.

Guys here, told me 1 to 1.2 m/s is good.
Not really understanding how you got from 218 ft/lb to 18.7 in/lb. Which one of these would my hydraulic motor need to have?
If its 18.7 in/lb 
Thanks, Nathan
Nathan, careful, i'm french so those units are alien to me. Pretty much. 
I might have reversed the two of FT and LB. 

Basically, to turn this winch,(remember i made approximation on the drum size)  at ten metric tons on the first layer. you need a torque of 4583 pounds per foot. Or if you prefer, at one foot from the axis. 
Then you divide this number by the worm and gear ratio. Which from your photos, seems to be 21 to 1. 
So, that's 218 pounds, at one foot. 
And, now i see it, this is where i made the mistake. This number i should have multiplied by 12, as there is 12 inches per foot. And not divided by 12!  But i might be off again!
So that's 2616 pounds at one inch. My mistake. Seems far less feasible now! 
The highest torque from the parker motors above, is 1750 lb/in
May be some of the OMT danfoss can do this torque. But not the speed! 
A DMcCoy said, find yourself a gearbox. It will be way simpler. Tho, you still have to check for the torque! 

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