A note to Tom from Husqvarna

[Tom]

There has been a lot of talk about the box stores carrying husky equipment and the chainsaw dealers refusing to work on "box store" saws.

I invited husky's customer service to visit our site and referenced a thread where Brian had been intimidated away from Lowe's.  

I'm sure that there are dealers that will make an effort to deny service to customers who purchased their saws elsewhere.  I'm also sure there are Dealers who's primary purpose is to make the customer happy in the hopes that he can sell you something himself.  Maintenance and warranty work provide a lot of floor traffic to a "Good" dealer.  Eventually the sore losers will learn that or suffer.

I was happy with the reply that Jacob of Husqvarna provided and feel that they are making an effort to be a good customer oriented organization.  Hopefully they will make our Forum a standard stop in judging their image in the market-place.

Below is the the answer from Husky, a quote.

Tom,
Thanks for the link, I've been trying to monitor a lot of the profesional / enthusiest boards to see how are products handling the real world.
The issue that was brought up between the dealer and Lowe's is not new, and it's something that we have been addressing ever since we started selling to Lowe's.
We have had a lot dealers refuse to work on units bought from Lowe's, or even another dealer, but they are required to work on all Husqvarna products that are brought into their shop, it's stated in the contract that they signed.
We're trying to resolve this issue, but it will not entirely go away. Thanks again for the link.

[bitternut]

Hey Tom since you are in contact with a representative of Husqvarna how about asking him what happened to the link they used to have on timber cutting. I have looked high and low for it but it seems to have disappeared. It used to be on their website.

[lucky_cutter]

I have been reading previous threads about problems with servicing a husky, and looking at service when buying a stihl vs husky. I however have been spoiled as there is a fabulous sales and repair shop nearby. If you absolutely need your saw running the next day he will work into the night to make it so. He is honest and will try his hardest to make the customer happy. He sells both stihls and huskys and will happily work on either no matter where the saw was origionally bought. I only hope husqvarna and stihl recognize what an asset he is for their company and reward him and others like him for their efforts. Otherwise, the good people may just give up the business and we customers will be left to dealing with nothing more than a steriotypical used auto salesmen. As for husqvarna,they had deal with the problem sooner than later because service is what brings the customer back for the second, and third, ect.. saw

[Tom]

Welcome to the forum, Lucky Cutter.  

It's great to have someone provide a service with a smile, isn't it.  You are right.  A servicemen should pay heed to their customers.  The problem shouldn't be one that the manufacturer should have to fix.  The dealer should realize that it's his bread and butter too

[jokers]

It`s interesting in a way to read of the perception that people in certain areas have, that it is difficult to get good service for Huskies. I say perception because without first hand knowledge of what their particular problems are, I don`t know if they are legitimate or simply sour grapes because a dealer would not warranty a non-warranty repair. This sour grapes scenario happens more times than most people would be willing to admit.

On the other hand, the entry of Lowe`s into the Husky sales arena does nothing for customer satisfaction or brand reputation either. It`s hard enough to find someone in Lowe`s who knows their main line products like plumbing and lumber, but you can completely forget about finding someone who knows anything about saws there. I`ve played the ignorant consumer every time I get the opportunity and I never cease to be amazed at what I`m told.

The prices at Lowe`s are also retail with no room for negotiation, so who would buy there unless no other dealer had any saws due to a natural disaster or something? A natural disaster is the only area where I can see Lowe`s doing anything for Husky because they are in essence an alternate pipeline for distribution of the product during crunch time, unless of course Lowe`s is practicing "just in time" inventory control, in which case they wouldn`t have many saws on hand.

I can understand the reticence of Husky dealers who don`t want to warranty repair a saw sold at Lowe`s. If the dealer sells the saw initially, any profit he makes on the initial sale can help makeup for the reduced shop rate that he will get if he has to do any warranty work. This on top of being forced to carry lawn care products that aren`t for the most part industry leaders, but are expected to sell at industry leader prices.

Another thing regarding warranty. If a dealer sells a saw, he is much less likely to see it come back for unnecesarry warranty type claims if he sets the saw up and gives the new user atleast some rudimentary instruction. Who is going to do that at Lowe`s? Who ends up picking up the slack for Lowe`s lack of ability to properly setup the saw and educate the consumer?

The bottom line is that if a consumer wants the best that Husky has to offer, they have to go to a servicing dealer. Unfortunately for the consumer, not all dealers are equal.

What`s ironic to me is that the single line Stihl dealers are the ones least likely to be capable where I live and the single line Husky dealers are atleast average in their abilities. There are several local Stihl dealers who either don`t know what a rim sprocket is or don`t stock them because they are unaware that they are basic wear items. It`s my opinion that the regional distributors reps hold a large amount of responsibility for poor quality dealerships and difficulty obtaining legitimate warranty repairs.

Russ

[jokers]

Maintenance and warranty work provide a lot of floor traffic to a "Good" dealer.  Eventually the sore losers will learn that or suffer.

Tom,

I feel that this statement of your`s needs to be fleshed out.

I believe that if you studied the demographics of the average consumer who purchased a saw at Lowe`s, you would find that they only buy one name brand saw in a lifetime. Consequently I see neglible value at best in the "floor traffic" that they provide. Furthermore, they often buy the small staples like chains,bars, files, and oil that shore up the bottom line, at the big retailer. I don`t see how this benefits the "sore loser" saw dealer.

Regarding maintenance, I`ll bet that most consumers never even read the owners manual never mind pay heed to things like periodic replacement of filters if they did read the manual, and I offer as evidence the number of totally clapped out sprockets seen on saws finally damaged or negelected to the point of needing a real repair. The sprocket is something that offers direct and tangible feedback in diminished performance, as evidence that the average non-pro consumer, the only type that Lowe`s will see, ever maintains anything on the saw.

When the saw comes to a repairing dealer, the dealer has two choices. Charge the shop rate necessary to support the overhead of having the tools, inventory, and qualified technicians and run the risk of being perceived as a crook for "gouging" the consumer, or he can take some of the costs on the chin and send the consumer who`s already bought his "lifetime" chainsaw away happy. It`s alot easier to take some on the chin if you got a slice of the fresh pie.

I don`t know anyone who thinks that warranty work is a deal unless they`ve figured out a way to gouge the parent company, and how do you think Husky would feel about that?

The bottom line is that Husky is prostituting their reputation for short term market share  IMO.

Russ

[Brian_B.]

I didn't honestly mean to make a stink!

I would consider myself a savvy consumer. I mean that I usually research the living SH** out of it before I decide what it is I want.

I don't think that most consumers know of any other option besides the "BOX" Stores.

I have talked to two different Husky dealers within 25 miles and so far I don't feel that they could serve me. I do not want this to influence anyone's decisions to buy or not to buy any brand.

I think that I will eventually buy a Stihl MS290 or MS310.

[jokers]

Hi Brian,

You haven`t created a stink as far as I`m concerned. If Husky is letting you down, it`s your perogative as a customer to say so. After all, there is no higher purpose involved here. Husqvarna`s only contribution to society is to provide a good product with what should be good service. If they can`t do that, evolution will cull them from the herd.

I missed your original thread regarding what you plan to do with this saw so I don`t know why you feel that the Husky dealers can`t serve you, or why you have settled on the 290 or 310 vs any other saw in the Stihl line-up. I`ll have to go looking for it.

Russ

[Brian_B.]

Russ

I have been to my Stihl dealer and talked to him.

I like the guy!

I didn't feel like he was trying to serve me any B.S.!

When I started this quest for a saw I was convinced that I wanted a Husky.

I only want to clear about a half an acre this shouldn't be such a dilemma.

My father had a Stihl. My first saw will be a Stihl.

[Stephen_Wiley]

Welcome to the Forum, Lucky Cutter :!:

Your in Frank Pender's neck of the woods.

Hope your name depicts the many years of experience in recognizing timber falling as a pro and not just a mishap experience.

Looking forward to hearing more from you !

[leweee]

Husky is only hurting them selfs by selling to the" big box" stores.  >:( short term gain in market share ,but unhappy campers when it comes to service : If the "box store" don't service what they sell, they  have no business selling it Just my 2 cents CDN. ;D

[Tom]

Without trying to stand up for anyone..... ;what have I to gain",  I think that a dealer is cutting his own throat to take out his vengeance on a "customer".  If the dealer has a problem with Huskey, take it up with Husky.    It's pretty short-sighted to tell a customer, in so many words, "I don't want you for a customer".

There are other ways of combating competition that have the potential of providing profits.  If a dealer is a good businessman then he should be pursuing these avenues rather than making his potential customers feel unwelcome.

Opinions may show that Husky is in the wrong when it comes to the big picture of support.  Other opinions may show that the dealer can benefit.  I don't care to get into making those decisions,but, it sounds to me as if Husky is approaching the Dealer problem positively from a customer's perspective.  The described experience that Baily has had is pretty negative and not conducive to a return visit.

[jokers]

Hi Tom,

I can`t say that I disagree with you in the whole context of the dealer who doesn`t help a customer being hurt in the long run, but then if that customer is a one saw/lifetime sort of customer, how does the dealer make up for working for the customer at a cut rate?

Somewhere in some performance training I was first exposed to the concepts of don`t bring a problem to people up the chain without first thinking it through enough to have atleast one possible solution, and don`t shoot from the hip by stating opinions that you can`t support. I feel like this statement "There are other ways of combating competition that have the potential of providing profits." almost fits into both categories. I`m sorry Tom because I mean no offense, but if you see other means of generating business sustaining revenue by working at a rate less than it takes to keep the shop healthy, please share.

I don`t patently suggest telling a "big box" customer to go away, but on the same token that customer should not expect any special treatment either, and if they want hands on instruction they should have bought from a servicing dealer in the first place. They can get in line with everyone else and it is not very often first come first served, but rather the best customers get the first service. Any other way would be cutting off your nose to spite your face.

Brian`s statement "I don't think that most consumers know of any other option besides the "BOX" Stores." doesn`t hold any water does it, or they wouldn`t be at the dealer`s shop looking for service because they wouldn`t know of it`s existence.

All I see in his statement is a display of the current American attitude of no personal responsibilty or obligation, it`s all about ME. I realize that Brian is probably just offering commentary and it may not be his personal perspective, but you`ve got to admit that the "get away with whatever you can" attitude is pervasive and I don`t see any possible long term benefit to anyone.

My world economy devalued two cents.

Russ

[Jeff]

I have a question here, How does Toms statement "Maintenance and warranty work provide a lot of floor traffic to a "Good" dealer." get to "how does the dealer make up for working for the customer at a cut rate?"


I dont understand how asking a brand dealer to do saw work on a brand saw purchased from another source means he is working for a cut rate?  Does he have something figured in on what he gets on the initial purchase of the saw if purchased from him by increasing his price to compensate for future saw work on those same saws?

"If you dont let me design your website, I refuse to let you give me money to host a website someone else designs"  Thats an analogy that might aply to me. Why would I do that? So I don't have to deal with more customers, just make more money on fewer customers?  I suppose, but then again how many customers did I alienate by having that attitude that will spread the word, and eventually cost me both lines of income?

Russ, maybe I am misuderstanding this whole thing.

[leweee]

Husky(Elux) has no respect for their own dealers when they put corporate profit ahead of good business relations with their own dealers. Bottom line

[jokers]

Hi Jeff,

Perhaps I`m not being clear so I can understand if you aren`t understanding.

When a dealer does warranty repair, the shop reimbursement is lower than what the normal shop rate is. I know, normal shop rate seems exorbitant to most people that never had to cover the overhead that I mentioned previously, but how does a shop rate of say, $60/hr compare to what you get per hour for web development? Do you have the same overhead that a shop with employees has?

Profit margins on saws aren`t that high to begin with and most dealers will bargain to some extent, but even if a dealer sold a saw for only one dollar over cost, it`s one more dollar in his pocket that helps offset working at the warranty rate. Why should a retailer like Lowe`s, who happen to be able to buy much cheaper than other smaller outfits, be able to pocket all the profit and not ever have to worry about covering any warranty work? That`s a bunch of bunk.

As I stated earlier although not too clearly, apparently, there is a much higher likelyhood and incidence of warranty work on equipment sold through retailers like Lowe`s and Sear`s because the equipment is not set up properly when it leaves the store and the customer isn`t given even a small amount of basic use and maintenance instruction.


The way I see it, buying a saw at Lowe`s and then expecting a saw dealer to warranty any problems is like buying a tv at Walmart and then bringing it to Target when it breaks. They more than likely both sell the same brands, so where`s the harm, right?

To return to the question posed in the first statement of your post Jeff, how many repair shops can survive on factory reimbursed warranty rate? What about the work coming in that could actually turn a profit for the dealership that get`s displaced for warranty repairs? Turning a profit is the only way to keep a business healthy. Breaking even only lasts so long.

I understand customer relations but when a customer goes to your competition and buys a product and then wants you to fix it at some cost to yourself, you have to ask yourself, "should I, will I, and, what priority?"

BTW, noone has presented any suggestions as to how warranty work on Lowe`s saws is good for the typical stocking/repairing dealer with normal overhead. Any suggestions?

lewee is right. Husky does not respect their dealers, do they think that most consumers can`t see this when presented with a little info and then wonder how Husky views them?

Russ

[Tom]

I'd be less than honest to say that I'm not a little miffed by the accusation "......don`t bring a problem to people up the chain without first thinking it through enough to have at least one possible solution, and don`t shoot from the hip by stating opinions that you can`t support. "

My intentions weren't and aren't to give a step by step recipe for success.  I will say that it is a foolhardy plan to try to make a success of your business without customers.  

If your new saws provide so little profit and warranty work so little compensation, I can understand why you might not want the "one-in-a-lifetime" customer in your shop.  I would certainly welcome them into my shop, if I had one.  

Since my business is different, so are my challenges.  But, I still need to make a profit to exist. I also need to be the "best" sawyer and "most congenial" sawyer, and "most helpful" sawyer around to make sure that my customers and future customers come to me first.  It's good advertising and it cost money.  This past 3 weeks have been fraught with jobs that cost me money.  I've had days where I grossed 30 dollars and spent 20 dollars in fuel going to and from work.  After a 5 dollar lunch, my profits were 5 dollars.  Get mad at the customer for wanting me to waste my time on 2 logs?  I was already set up.  Get mad at the customer because he had something else pressing to do and couldn't stay the day?  ..........why  "cut off my nose to spite my face".

What did I do?  I took the customers picture and gave him a copy of it.  More money lost?  Nope.  None of it was lost.  I have created a customer that will be loyal.  I have created another string of a "word of mouth" network that will make me money down the road.  This customer will be back.  He will also tell his friends about me.  It's the best advertising in the world.  It's a cost of doing business.   How do you do that without a customer.  I may think that this was a one-log-in-a-lifetime customer, but to run him off because of my impression is a costly assumption.  

What do I do to help make sure he comes back?  I try to make him happy and important. I don't lie to him about his wood.  I don't say bad things about his logs.  I find good things to say to him about the "good" logs or boards and the many things he could do with them besides what he has planned.  I tell him where he can find more logs like that if he wants.  I brag on him for salvaging the logs from the landfill, if that is what he did.   I suggest ways he can make things with that particular wood that will sell.  I tell him of craft shows that are coming up.  I discuss finishes with him.  I try to make him want to find another log and get it sawed up.  I want him back!

You have a prime opportunity to develop a good dealer/customer relationship when that person walks into your shop, regardless of the reason.  You can run him off or you can turn him on.  You can make him wonder why he bothered or you can "nice" him to death.  He's a customer....  the guy with money in his pocket......It's your job to develop him not his to please you.  

Like I mentioned before, problems between the dealer and manufacturer should remain in that arena.  You are only hurting your business when you discourage customers from doing business with you.  If you end up never making any profits then you are in the wrong business or are carrying the wrong products.  It's not the customer's fault.

[beenthere]

Tom, very well put.
That 'box' store customer who gets work done at the local shop and is treated with respect and courtesy, will very likely walk away and think "he treated me well, and I didn't even buy that saw from him".  When this fellow talks to others about his saw purchase in the future, he just may pass a good word along to others that he received good service from this one dealer, such that these others go to this dealer for service, and maybe buy a saw, and accesories (pants, gloves hard hat, boots, oil, file, wedge).
Although not with my chain saw (the 'ol Stihl just wouldn't quit), but with other Stihl 'tools', I bought small and later up-graded at the same dealer. The same might happen with the 'box' store customer who might buy small and then later want to upgrade, and will remember the dealer who treated him decently. Maybe even to the point they would consider each other 'friends' (I do with my Stihl dealer, car dealer, tractor dealer, hardware dealer - all 'friends').

Happy New Year to all.

[Jeff]

Again, I don't see at all where Tom is off base. I am sure he has no idea how a dealer is compensated for warranty work and neither do I, and as a consumer that may want a saw fixed, honestly, I don't care how they are compensated That is between them and the agreement with the manufacturer. If I buy a husky and there is a dealer that is the official location according to the manufacture to have my saw fixed, I would expect him to fix it, just as he would any other husky. I would expect that if he did a good job, that I would return to him as a paying customer when I needed work done after the warranty was expired.

I bought my Husky used. No warranty. Is it right for a husky dealer to turn me down if I need service because I didn't buy it from him?  If he turns me down for that reason I say kiss my you know what on my way out and tell everybody I know how I was treated.

[hydro2]

I bought my saw from Alamia and I can understand very much how a dealer would not want to service my saw!!!  Why should he?  I would be embarrassed to drag my saw to a local dealer and expect him to fix it.  If everyone was like me and bought their saw online or at Lowes, the local dealer would be out of business and then where would I even get parts in a timely manner to repair my saw.  It is not like the dealer won't sell me part, just because I did not buy my saw from him.   I knew when I purchased online that I would be responsible for any repairs whether the saw was under or warranty or not.  If you are not mechanically inclined, then go to the local dealer and pay more, so that someone will fix it when it breaks!!  Simple!!!!   The local dealer was not good enough to buy a saw from, then why is he good enough to repair it!!!!  You are SOL, end of story!!!!!!!

[etat]

Been keeping my mouth shut but I gotta tell ya.  A factory warranty is a factory warranty. A factory authorized dealer, is just that, a factory authorized dealer.  Don't matter where it comes from that's the way it is if factory, or  company, or dealer  wants to stay in business.  Perhaps Husky does have a problem with it's dealers, or perhaps the dealers have a problem with Husky.  If so, it should be kept in house and not translate to the customer. AND, that SHOULD be, the rest of the story.  Period.  Anything else is sour grapes.

[lucky_cutter]

Hi Stephen
 No not a professional. You guys are out of my league. I used to cut a lot of firewood,but am now down to 6-7 cords per year. back in 1980 I used a skil saw to cut my very first two cords. Like many others i made my share of mistakes along the way, but those should go to a different thread. Lucky because there were no mishaps and I have everything still intact. Except my hair.

[Jeff]

You guys are talking like a dealer goes uncompensated for fixing a saw. I dont know a one where I could take my saw (other then good buddy Chet  ;D) that is going to fix it for free. I don't know a saw dealer around that offers FREE repairs. If they do, well then its just a matter of time that that ole boy goes out of business anyways. The only argument here I can understand would be if a shop is undercompensated by a manufacturer for warranty work. Where he loses money or is doing the work essentially for free.  However, no one has qualified thier remarks to seperate the two. Refusing to work on my saw that I bought used from someone else is the same thing as refusing to work on any saw purchased somewhere else.

[Minnesota_boy]

Having worked in a shop for a number of years, I think there is a problem with doing warranty repairs for a unit bought from a big-box retailer.  If I repair a saw for someone, they pay when they pick it up.  If I sell them a saw and they bring it in for warranty, I have profited on the original sale and have no problem doing the warranty work, even though I may have to wait 30 to 60 days to be compensated by the company.  Sometimes the warranty claim is refused and I can irritate the customer by billing them for the cost of the warranty claim that was denied or just swallow the cost, knowing that the customer will most likely be back to enrichen me somewhere to offset my cost.  When the person walking through the door bought the unit somewhere else, I might hesitate to acccept the chances of the warranty claim being denied and want to send them back to where they bought the saw.  When the place they bought the saw is another dedicated saw shop, I am more willing to risk the loss of a claim denied because I have the chance to capture that customer as my own in the future.  When they bought the saw at Walmart, Lowes, etc. I will likely never see them again and anny loss cannot be made up in future sales.

[Gordon]

One has to remember that there is only so many billable hours in a day. So a small shop may have to refuse some work from time to time because of backlog. When I worked in the R/V industry we used to do warranty work on our customers first then with the remaining time do other dealers customers. Reason being it was a selling point to be able to get quick quality service at our shop.

One of the  main reasons to do work on other dealers stuff---always the chance to sell either service or another unit. You never know.

But our shop was the exception it actually showed a profit on warranty work. Because of proper follow up paper work and also getting PRIOR approvals for work from the factory. That way we were never doing work for free. The average shop does alot of small stuff for free because the factories make it hard to bill the simple stuff. To be successful doing warranty work you have to follow through. Flat rate is flat rate.

my two cents on service work

Gordon