Out working and enjoying the Missouri farm. Thought I would share some photos.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/002.JPG)
The next two generations to take care of the trees, my nephew and his son.
The tree in the photo is the hybrid oak which I believe to be northern red oak X shingle oak. The next two show the form of the tree and the strange, orbicular leaves.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/003.JPG)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/001.JPG)
Black cherry in fall color.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/005.JPG)
Pruned cedar with smooth closeover of knots. : )
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/008.JPG)
We had a lot of our cedars ruined from a 20" wet snow last winter. An example.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/004.JPG)
Torkies eating soybeans.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/007.JPG)
Couple of fine red oaks needing release thinning.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/015.JPG)
After thinning.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/016.JPG)
Free at last!
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/017.JPG)
Figured out that one of my bur oaks was a red mulberry. This year was the first year I had seen this with the leaves on. Three main trunks, 20", 19", 12". 89.5' tall. Soon to be Missouri State Champion red mulberry. Pretty cool.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/010.JPG)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/011.JPG)
Could you post a more close-up pic of the mulberry leaves?
I will try to do that. Unbelieveably good form for mulberry. I thought maybe basswood, but there aren't any out there and the teeth seem too big for that. The woods are full of the normal, crooked mulberries.
'
Thanks for the tour. :)
;D
Are the leaves scabrous ???.
Pretty scratchy.
Nice! The buds should be a bit heart shaped. Slightly inequilateral, but not to the extent that basswood is.
A state champion is grounds for celebration. Maybe Shrimp and grits.
I would have to shoot one down with a 22 to see one. They are all up top. I have never seen one of such fine form. Ever heard of a veneer grade mulberry?
This one is. ;D
And I would have to say grits, si, and shrimp, no. Makes my tummy hurt. :(
Nice neck of the woods ........ your keeping up with it too,looks great ;D
Quote from: mesquite buckeye on October 22, 2013, 09:43:13 PM
I thought maybe basswood, but there aren't any out there and the teeth seem too big for that.
That threesome looks like typical basswood to me.
If you have a lot of the cedar that is growing bowed over, there are markets for bowed cedar, so don't be too quick to get rid of them. The amish in Mo make a lot of furniture and they may be interested.
Thanks for the tour. Having woodlands to "play" with is a great past time and can be very productive.
Quote from: Gary_C on October 23, 2013, 12:27:39 AM
Quote from: mesquite buckeye on October 22, 2013, 09:43:13 PM
I thought maybe basswood, but there aren't any out there and the teeth seem too big for that.
That threesome looks like typical basswood to me.
We are looking to see if we can find a basswood fruit near it. If that is indeed what it is, that would make it a state ordinary tree. We will look some more. Thanks for the input. I haven't seen many basswoods since I was a kid.
Quote from: Cedarman on October 23, 2013, 08:11:49 AM
If you have a lot of the cedar that is growing bowed over, there are markets for bowed cedar, so don't be too quick to get rid of them. The amish in Mo make a lot of furniture and they may be interested.
Thanks for the tour. Having woodlands to "play" with is a great past time and can be very productive.
We probably have at least 50. We were going to cut them up. Any suggestions would be helpful. There is an Amish colony about 25 miles from me.
Looks like basswood to me, too. If it is, the buds on the twigs will be will be fat and juicy and will set off to the side of the leaf scar quite noticeably versus sitting right on top of the leaf scar. I call them inequilateral buds.
Went back and did some looking up. The "mulberry" bark sure looks like basswood. Here are some leaves.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/002%7E0.JPG)
We spent a bit of time looking for basswood fruits to confirm, but no luck. Maybe with binoculars up top. The biggest leaves are maybe 5 or 6 inches long.
Hmmm Looks like basswood leaves.
Too basswoody :).
Check out the fat inequilateral buds :P.
They are mostly pretty high.
I can see a climb in your future ;D.
WDM, you are a bad guy, trying to make the old man climb such a tree and get kilt. ;D
First photo is from a tree that looks just like the big one, similar bark, leaves 4-8", unlobed.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/003%7E0.JPG)
This one is from a nearby for sure red mulberry, with a mix of lobed and unlobed leaves 4-6". Both plants are coloring up yellow at the same time.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/004%7E0.JPG)
Buds sure look the same to me. What do you think?
do basswood's fruits look anything like mulberries?
Not at all. Basswood has a weird modified leaf with a fruit cluster hanging off the bottom. As I remember, the fruits are pretty round and maybe 3/16". That's why I was looking for them, very distinctive.
Mulberries have a multiple fruit that looks a lot like a long blackberry, sort of.
If you saw either in fruit, there is no way you would confuse them.
I know what mulberry fruits look like, but did not know what basswood fruit looks like. I have trees with leaves that look like yours that are mulberries according to the fruit. Just wondered if I was wrong about them.
Is the sap in the small twigs milky white? That would be mulberry.
Basswood bud scales are only 2 - 3 and are large and overlapping. Mulberry has 4 - 6, and the buds are sharp pointed.
The buds of basswood are mucilaginous. Maybe you need to chew a bud :D.
Man, you are tough. First, I am steeplejacking the trees, now I'm sposed to smoke, I mean, chew some bud. :o :( :snowball:
Bark, buds and leaves look basswoody. ;D
Flowers
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/11009/SD_basswood_flwr-004.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/11009/SD_AB-flowers.jpg)
My yard trees are usually covered with the fruit this time of year. The flowers turn into little round hard balls. Seeds albuminous. ;D
I'd bet money those three stems are basswood, and I normally do. Cause I cut that stuff all the time and I'd better know what I'm cutting or I'll get my joysticks slapped. Here is a basswood clump that I thinned out. Not the way the forester had marked it as that was not feasable nor smart.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/11467/Multi-stem.jpg)
But if you guys want to cut and search and chew, you could also cut a strip of bark and see if it peels off in long strips and is very tough and stringy. Or just cut one down and see what the wood is like.
We'll get this figured out yet. :)
Would be nice to see a good close up pic of a trunk like the cedar picture. But from what I see in the picture it aint a mulberry. At least not like any MO mulberry I have cut or seen.
So, continuing, I have never seen a basswood fruiting leaf or any fruits ever anywhere in my woods or around there. I hear there are some maybe 10 miles away. If I remember correctly, basswood trunks are elliptical in cross section when the trees are young. These are pretty round, or a little lumpy round, but not elliptical. The sap is down, so I am not having a lot of luck getting much sap. There may be a hint of milkiness, but not for sure. Also, it appears the petioles of these leaves are quite short, consistent with mulberry.
Today, we found another one of these trees, this one with lobing on the leaves. Here are photos.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/photo_4.JPG)
The upper leaf has a small lobe if you look closely. Below is one that is more obvious.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/photo_1.JPG)
You can see the leaves can get quite large. I am not a small guy and those are my full size hands.
Here is the bark of this tree.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/photo_2.JPG)
Looking up into the tree. We got a pretty hard freeze last night and the leaves of all the mulberries were raining down this morning.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/photo_3.JPG)
I cut a dead branch off this tree. The wood was mulberry yellow.
Back onto the subject of elephant resistant trees, Here are photos of one of my nastier honey locusts. The foreground is a single thorn my nephew picked up next to the tree. It is about a foot and a half or so long.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/002%7E1.JPG)
Next photo from further up the tree. Thorns quit where the elephants can't reach.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/004%7E1.JPG)
Next are photos of the CRP trees planted in 1999. Sweetgums are purty.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/001%7E0.JPG)
And another view from a different area.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/012.JPG)
Got a nice black locust log. Looks and weathers a bit like teak.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/011%7E0.JPG)
Bringing in the tractor to load up firewood from logging trail cutting. That long perfect log in the foreground is a redcedar.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/009.JPG)
And a little bit of black walnut heaven, with a few black cherries and redcedars thrown in just for fun.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/013%7E0.JPG)
Anybody know paper mulberry? Broussonetia
I thought mulberry had 'cut' leaves, not lobes like maple. ;D The one lobed in your hands reminds me of striped maple. The leaves can be huge and the tree is a shrub, but can grow a large trunk and become rough barked. I know some go to the pulp mill. But if it were striped maple the fine limbs would show stripes. Basswood too can have very large leaves and not always non-symetrical. The ones in the yard here in full sun have big leaves like a dinner plate. ;D
Nice looking see-dare cedar log growing there.
Hard for me to compare something unseen up here, like all the mulberries and different oaks. We grow yard mulberries, but anything non native up here has a hard struggle to stay alive. Oaks are tough though, I even have a white old from NH in the yard. Very slow growing, but strong and straight, with scarlet fall color. ;D
The leaves in the pic in Reply #30 are definitely mulberry. Look at the first pic of leaves that you posted. You will see that they are different. Those first leaves are basswood. Notice that they are more cordate (heart-shaped) at the base.
Quote from: mesquite buckeye on October 26, 2013, 12:35:59 AM
Anybody know paper mulberry? Broussonetia
Yes, very scabrous leaves. Bark does not have scales like the native red mulberry.
So.....one more time out to the infamous tree to look for basswood leaf/fruit. Here is what we found.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/photo.JPG)
:o :o :o :o :-[ :-[ :-[ :-
It appears we have the Our Farm Champion Basswood! ;D 8) 8) 8) 8) 8)
Well, that was fun.
Here are some more of our poor quality field cedars that are not worth pruning and there is no market for.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/photo_28129.JPG)
This one was growing pretty fast.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/photo_28229.JPG)
Tomorrow I have to pull out some cherry logs from a tree that fell down. Nothing super exciting, but I sure like them. ;D
Cross cut sections of cull cedars often make some awesome knife scales . The rougher the tree the better often times.
Ain't playing er working in the forest just wonderful !
QuoteCross cut sections of cull cedars often make some awesome knife scales .
Pray tell, what is a "knife scale" ?
These aren't all that rough. Lots of them will be branch free to 16 ft when we are done. That was a little dig at the guys who say cedar isn't worth growing. I am extremely funny. ;D
We are going for clear cedar.
Here is one of our poor quality cedars. Heavy wet snow last winter broke the top off, so time to harvest.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2431.JPG)
Cedar is purty. ;D 8) 8) 8) 8) 8)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2439.JPG)
Scales are handles, nice description here...
http://www.sharpeningsupplies.com/Identify-the-Parts-of-Your-Knife-W64C120.aspx
Thanks, Always can learn something new on the FF. 8)
I also did not know that. ;D
Also got a small slippery elm that tipped last winter. The bark is muy gooey and gunks up blades but the wood is pretty nice.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2444.JPG)
Also got some got 4 nice little cherry logs from another tree that fall down go boom. I am hilarious.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2435.JPG)
Now they are milled into cants. Why can't cants can ants? I just don't know.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2445%7E0.JPG)
I am the king of the trailer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ;D It must be late.
We also got a really nice double trunked bitternut hickory that made 5 good logs (the devil smiley_devil you say). Clear almost all the way to the center.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2456.JPG)
As the sun slowly sinks below the Missouri woods. ;D 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) :snowball:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2458.JPG)
Nice pignut.
Mesquite, you sure are busy with lots of projects! Have you thinned a d released your entire woods? My forester wanted me to do mine a year ago but i have not started yet. Come back to northern Ohio where you grew up and help me. We got grits too!
Quote from: ET on October 30, 2013, 08:05:13 AM
Mesquite, you sure are busy with lots of projects! Have you thinned a d released your entire woods? My forester wanted me to do mine a year ago but i have not started yet. Come back to northern Ohio where you grew up and help me. We got grits too!
Now I see how you are.
We have gone through the whole woods, well mostly, a couple of times. I try to spend the most time where I will get the biggest benefit, like mixed pole stands with walnut and cherry in them. That makes a big difference long term. Some places are filled with low value trees where little is to be gained. Those I pass up unless I have lots of time, then I remove the crooked ones and try to let the better crummy trees do better. We actually have some pretty good shingle oaks now.
If I had unlimited time, I would like to adjust the stand at least every 10 years.
We spend a lot of time working on high quality redcedar by thinning and pruning and selecting the best forest form trees.
Grits are good. ;D
We did a species selection for walnut and pruning on my uncle's farm near Oak Harbor in 1973 in some doghair poles. Those walnuts are looking pretty sweet now, but need to be thinned again.
Quote from: ET on October 30, 2013, 08:05:13 AM
Have you thinned a d released your entire woods?
I thinned 55 of 70 acres I own, all with a brush saw. Young woods is easier to thin that way. ;D Now going through and pruning up the potential softwood logs, up to 10 feet of pruninge up the stem. I have my own criteria for that.
I prune as high as I can get with my power pruner. That's about 16-17ft if you don't mind getting hit in the head with branches.
I just work up little by little as the trees grow.
These cants just can't dance.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/photo%7E0.JPG)
But they are purty. ;D
What is that that you are using to get the logs out with? Looks like you have a few dollars in chains too.
That were my newfangled invention, the 4 log simulpuller. ;D ;D ;D Hook 2 chain ends (of one chain) to the ends of logs 1 and 2. Do the same with another chain to logs 3 and 4. Hook another chain to the midpoint of the two chains in a V. Hook the point of the V to another chain, hook to old International Farmall loader. Lift gently and watch them all pull together, missing little trees along the way. Load onto forklift once they are in the open. Bye Bye. ;D
We use a bit of chain. Lots of our pulls out of gullies or heavily treed areas are over 100 ft.
A fortune in chains :).
Un millon de pesos!!!!!!!!!!! ;D
My Father and me use to use chains. I was the chain man.My Father would drive the tractor. We would bring 3-4 chains with us. I have no idea the lenghts now,probably from 12-16 feet long each. Sometimes I would have all 4 chains hooked together and he would drive forward only 6 feet and re hook. We missed alot of little trees too. Than we got a bigger tractor and a 3 pt winch. I was no longer needed. :D The best part was we could get 3-4-5-6 logs at one time.
The woods grows so thick around here, that it's impossible to move logs any length without hitting or running on little trees. I suppose you could heli log and hook onto the sky hook. ;D Now I know that is different than some fellas that will push over a 4" white birch to the ground to make a trail, when they already have 5 trails. ;)
Those little trees need to be thinned out a little anyways. :D
Years ago when we was cutting just fire wood, we did not open it up enough for the little trees to come in and grow,for the most part.There was a few places that we cut hard.But when we started to cut white pine 3 feet across,that opened up the forest floor and talk about regen. WOW and another WOW.
For years, my uncle and grandfather used the pick and peck method of cutting firewood. The stands were sugar maple and beech. They never opened the canopy enough to allow the maple to grow. And I remember maple seedlings, a carpet as thick as grass, in those woods. But they had no light to take off. What happened was the beech, which will grow in a closet, took over and killed out the maple regen. And that beech is some thick, and with beech disease up here the beech will most often never even make firewood anymore. So you have an overstory of mature maple, by just pecking away, and an understory of beech that is about worthless by the time it's 8". This happened exactly the same on two woodlots. ::) These are not the only woodlots I've seen this, it's common all over. Here on the farm our hardwoods was mostly maple, yellow birch and white ash. Dad cut white ash 30 years ago as big as your pine. ;D In my woods the maple and ash seeded in very well. All kinds of both, almost no beech.
Back home in Tucson. Got to meet qbilder in Alamagordo. A real nice guy and very skilled woodworker. He managed to talk me out of a little piece of beeswing bitternut hickory. ;D
Got a few more pictures. Some I'm still trying to figure out how to get them to work, they are jpeg, not jpg and the system doesn't like them.
Black locust
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_8624.jpg)
Peak color on the west lane.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_8625.jpg)
Color in the woods.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_8626.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_8627.jpg)
A short video side dropping that double trunked bitternut hickory. The first, easy one has already been dropped. The one in the video has a heavy head lean and slight back lean. We were able to get it close to where we wanted with wedges.
http://youtu.be/C__b51TAh_I
Figured out the problem by converting the jpeg files to gif files.
More peak color in the Missouri woods about a week ago.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_1463.GIF)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9358.GIF)
It was raining hickory nuts. ;D ;D ;D
Got'em by the handfulls. ;D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2028.GIF)
Littlest hickory nuts I have ever seen. :( Seems like they shrunk since I was 5. :o
Good eatin' ;D 8) 8) 8)
All that needed to be done with those jpeg files was edit the extension to jpg. Now, instead of having a ~50 kb file it has now grown 5 times in memory usage. Slows down a thread big time on a dial-up connection. And they don't show any more detail or clarity.
Might want to edit them files. ;)
You making a hickory pie or something, with those nuts? ;D
Well, at least it worked. I had been trying for a week to get them into my gallery. Thanks for the tip.
Sort of like a pecan pie, but with hickory nuts. They definitely taste kind of like pecans, but sweeter. ;D
Back in AZ, milling cant's from MO yesterday. This slippery elm seemed to have just a little internal stress.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_8628.jpg)
;D
I don't suppose you need some bow wood? ;D
Mesquite, a few years ago there was a conference in (I think is was in Springfield) where pruning cedar was discussed. The general consensus was that there was none. Some said you can get good results , others said you wouldn't. We have seen trees delimbed that turned out well with no rot around the cut limbs and others that were a disaster with rot at every knot.
How big are the cedars that you are delimbing and how close to the stem are you trimming and what are the biggest limbs that you are cutting off?
Curious to see how your experiment is going.
Being that clear cedar can sell for 3 times regular cedar, it could well be worth the effort.
WOW! That had more than a little of something all right :D
Quote from: SwampDonkey on November 11, 2013, 05:00:56 AM
I don't suppose you need some bow wood? ;D
The next one had a 3/4" hump in the middle and curled the other way. Maybe you are right and I should save them. ;D
Hey Cedarman- Thanks for your input. I was the hardhead at that conference who insisted it was a good idea. We shall see.
I have several what you could call experiments going at once:
1. Pruning up open grown trees. There are many of these in a CRP planting from 1999. I also have
others of this type in areas of old field succession.
2. Pruning cedars in mixed stands with hardwoods, combined with thinning.
3. Pruning and thinning cedars in dense stands of primarily cedar.
Most of my pruning and all of the thinning happens in the fall from around the time of peak fall color to leaf drop. My method of pruning is to cut as close to the branch collar as possible without injuring the collar. All the pruning is done with chainsaws, regardless of height. We use chainsaw on a stick when the branches get over head height. We never remove more than 1/4 to 1/3 of the live crown, pruning bottom up.
When pruning open grown, or what are commonly called field cedars, it is often necessary to remove overly dominant side branches (you could call them bull branches) above the general pruning line to prevent them from becoming coleaders with the primary leader of the tree. These branches will get big fast and often can be up to 2 or even 3" thick even on a small tree. The bigger branches need to be cut in three cuts to prevent bark tearing, but especially to keep a mid branch crack from forming, which could serve as an entry point for heart rotting fungi. We also do this on open grown hardwoods to maintain a forest tree form.
In the mixed stands, usually the pruning is combined with thinning. I try to save the good cedars, but also like to favor trees of good form that don't produce deep shade, such as black and honey locusts, cherry and walnut, as these are more compatable with keeping the cedars alive and growing. These trees also seem to grow well in association with red cedars. If I get a really good, straight red oak, I will leave that, knowing that by the time it starts to kill the cedars, I will still get something worth cutting.
In the heavy cedar stands, many times the trees are so thick they are killing each other, even though the literature says they won't. Here I combine thinning with pruning. We usually get a lot of poles and posts from the thinnings. I select for cedars with a single leader if I have a choice, as the forked ones often get split in half from ice storms or heavy snow. I also select for round trunks without flutes, which may be useful for surviving a buck rub attack, but don't give the best lumber necessarily. Often in such stands, the dead branches will extend to 8-10' and often to as high as 16'. I remove all the dead branches, but try to remove as little of the live crown as possible until the plants recover some crown mass following the thinning. Usually in such stands, the thinning/pruning needs to be repeated by 8-15 years to prevent crowding again. Also in such stands especially, we have ideal conditions for infection by heart rotting fungi with the combination of still air and high humidity. Any trees that show any sign of rot get cut down. This serves the double function of removing a source of fungus inocculum and leaving only healthy trees, which may prove to be more resistant to the diseases and insects. I do the same thing in my black locust stands. Heart rotted trees occupy the same space and use just as much forest resources as good healthy ones.
Results:
1. The open grown cedars respond by rapidly closing over the short branch stubs (often within 2-3 years) and producing additional crown. We prune these trees when they are at least 5 ft tall up to 10 ft or so at first pruning. At the current growth rates, it looks like it would be best to raise the crown a foot or two every few years, as well as to remove bull branches that appear. These trees that started out with pretty extreme taper in the trunk rapidly fill in below the crown to the point that the taper is minimal. I expect little rot to develop in these trees, as the conditions for infection are poor, with fast growing, healthy trees, rapid drying and maximum air flow. I am thinking we will be able to create at least 10 foot logs with at most a knotty core no greater than 4-6" in diameter, then clear outside that to whatever size to which we can grow the trees.
2. In the mixed stands, the cedars generally are of somewhat lower vigor, but much less tapered and
taller when we get to them, often 20ft or better. Often the branches are mostly dead to perhaps
shoulder or head height. Following thinning and pruning, the trees resume rapid growth and soon
cover the pruned stubs. These trees usually get pruned to around 8 ft on the first pass. Again,
pretty good air flow and slower drying, but improved over unpruned, unthinned. Repruning
at 5 year intervals should be adequate.
3. In the heavy stands, conditions are best for the development of disease. However, even here, the
thinning and pruning improves airflow, and should reduce disease incidence. Crown improvement
seems light dependent, so if the thinning is too light, little improvement is seen. If the thinning is
too heavy, the risk of the trees being broken in winter is greatly increased, at least for the first
couple of years. These stands are capable of producing clear logs to perhaps 16 ft or so. I do
expect more disease incidence in these stands, but even here the trees with healthy crowns close
their wounds fairly rapidly, like in 5 years or so.
I am planning to mill some of the trees we thinned and pruned over the years and will post photos of what we find on this post at that time. It should be interesting. If the wounds are closed and there is no rot, I think we can demonstrate that it works. If rot is showing up, time for plan B. I am guessing it will be a mix, but I am hoping it will be mostly good.
Mesquite, thanks for elaborating on what you are doing. I wish I could take time to work in the woods like that, but I am relegated to overseeing the mill.
When you saw some of those logs that have been delimbed at an early stage, I am very curious how they turn out. I have sawn logs that were delimbed with an axe that had no rot. Something is going on that keeps some trees from having the rot develop around the knot.
I need to go back to a woods I logged in 1988 and see how much growth has taken place. I did some logging in a place in 1984 where we left a bunch of pole cedar that was well exposed. I wonder if they are still standing or the wind took them out.
You have made me curious.
Curiosity is the first step to learning new things. ;D 8) 8) 8)
I know with spruce, you get less occurrence of rot if you stay out of the limb swell at the trunk when pruning. I've seen lots of pruning behind people's yards and pastures with a chainsaw, and after awhile the saw operator gets sloppy or tired and the chain is rubbing up and down the tree bark and cutting off that big swell. A recipe for rot. The best results is tree spacing to self prune. Species like spruce and fir out in the open just limb back up with the sun hitting the trunk. Same with white cedar. Cow shade/pasture spruce are not marketable up here. Usually get sawn by the land owner to put up a hay shed or cow shelter.
Well, back from Missouri for a couple of weeks now. Sorry to be so slow to post.
George White tree nursery near Licking Missouri in the Ozark highlands.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9000.jpg)
1500 little trees.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9001.jpg)
Missouri Ozarks
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9002.jpg)
Trees sitting in the woods shade waiting to be planted.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9005.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9006.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9003.jpg)
First trees into the ground. This spot is one of the worst sites on the farm. Severely eroded clay soil, highly acidic. What you are seeing here is 15 years of succession. First several to many years with hardly a weed, then a fine mesh of poverty threeawn (grass) forms. A few very poor looking, slow growing red cedars. Only in the last two or three years have the tallgrass prairie plants, here bluestem, started to return. Most of the area of my farm was an intermix of areas of tallgrass prairie on the uplands and eastern deciduous forest in the draws and along streams before the introduction of agriculture in the early 1800's. The first thing to come back are the prairie plants. Trees come later except for bur oaks and red cedars, which can grow with the big grasses. The trees were restricted by frequent, intentionally lit fires.
More to come. ;D
The deer and rabbits will have something tender to nibble on for a few days. ;D With there being sparse grass the mice probably won't girdle them. Up here if we plant hardwood in grass the mice will chew all the bark off in the winter.
Good luck with your project. ;D
Thanks for the thought. :)
They have to find them first. I am using the camoflage method of planting. ;D Hopefully the hawks, owls, foxes and coyotes will do their jobs. The deer have much bigger fish to destroy fry with the hedged trees already out there. Also, there has been a big deer dieoff out there, but you would never notice from the heavy trailing.
More pictures. Here is a panorama of the east field rotating from NW to SW from the middle of the field.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9009.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9010.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9011.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9012.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9013.jpg)
Here are my niece and nephew hard at it in the east field.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9014.jpg)
The following are a series of photos of hedged 15 year old trees from the first planting.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9015.jpg)
Hedged walnuts to right. To the left is one that the deer missed and is now above the danger height.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9017.jpg)
Closeup of a hedged walnut.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9025.jpg)
Thornless form of honey locust 15 years from planting.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9029.jpg)
Red oak pounded down by the deer last year (winter/spring) with new recovery growth from last summer. The deer are not content to browse the trees. They will intentionally beat them down with antlers or front feet to keep the trees at the height they can eat. Once they get over about 6-7 feet tall they ignore them except for rubs.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9030.jpg)
Young tree pounded last fall/winter. I think it is a walnut.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9035.jpg)
Black locust invasion of northern part of the west field. This was a preferred deer habitat when the stand was brushy. These will be thinned this fall to the best stems and a wider spacing. The removed stems are useful as rot resistant poles and posts. The remaining thinned trees will become lumber. ;D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9039.jpg)
Another pounded walnut.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9040.jpg)
Another tree that has been beaten, hedged and has now popcorned (my expression) above deer height. Note the hedged branches down low. This one is probably 12 ft tall or so. I will prune off the left, curved trunk this year, then the smaller upper right one in a couple more years. When I am done it should turn into a decent tree, in spite of how it looks now. ;D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9041.jpg)
Hedged walnut. :(
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9043.jpg)
Closeup of hedged walnut showing branches bitten off.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9044.jpg)
Another one that has been hedged and beaten, then popcorned, after that antler rubbed. If it can get through this year without getting smashed down, there is a strip of bark that will keep the top alive and after that it will be relatively safe from the deer. ;D 8) 8) 8)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9045.jpg)
Another one. Same deal.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9046.jpg)
Another hedged walnut that was pounded also. This is the typical sized tree that will popcorn if the deer miss it just one year.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9047.jpg)
Sweetgum, possibly our most misunderstood tree. ;D 8) 8) 8) :snowball: The rubbery branches resist deer damage. Maybe they don't taste good to them either. They do try to antler pound them, but not so successfully. Most of these have good form and will be easily pruned up once the bark thickens a bit more. ;D Probably 12-15 ft tall.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9052.jpg)
Heavy deer trailing.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9051.jpg)
Dead Mississippi painted turtle dead along a deer trail.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9036.jpg)
My nephew, Adam, stomping in the planting bar. Hard work if you have never done it.
Panorama of the west field from SE to SW from my dad's old deer stand. Almost nothing left of the cherry it was built in or the stand. Took these balancing on the top step of the ladder. :-\
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9032.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9033.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9034.jpg)
Planting the last tree. That makes 1950 of them. ARGH
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9048.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9049.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9050.jpg)
Can you see it? Sorry Bambi. :'(
Took a little walk in the woods after we got done. Sorry, no morels yet.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9061.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9060.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9059.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9058.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9057.jpg)
Sapsuckers.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9056.jpg)
Native yucca.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9054.jpg)
Mayapples.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9053.jpg)
Dutchmen's breeches.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9063.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9066.jpg)
Wet part of a terrace with new trees next to the flags.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9067.jpg)
Elephant resistant honey locust.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9069.jpg)
Dog, the wonder dog. My woods is in the background behind my sister's pond.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9071.jpg)
Why I don't like to save forked cedars if I can help it. :(
Usually the oaks will shade out and kill cedars. Not always the result. The extreme drought of 2012 and the severe drought of 2013 tested the trees for drought tolerance. The cedars did fine and the adjacent oaks died.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9073.jpg)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9074.jpg)
More dead oaks and happy cedars.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/photo_100.JPG)
Walnuts.
Heading home.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/photo_101.JPG)
Kansas sunset.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/photo_102.JPG)
Kansas burning.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9077.jpg)
White Sands, SW of Alamogordo, NM.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9080.jpg)
Organ Mountains, between Alamogordo and Las Cruces. Alamogordo means fat cottonwood, in case you wondered, Las Cruces, the crossings, a place to ford the Rio Grande.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9085.jpg)
The bone dry Rio Grande in Las Cruces, due to the current dust bowl conditions of the American Southwest. This drought has lasted 17 years now.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9094.jpg)
One of many dust storms billowing west of Las Cruces.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9097.jpg)
Thanks for letting us know. The sign shall set you free. It says use extreme caution if you can't read it.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9101.jpg)
Mountains near the NM/AZ border at the ghost town of Steins, NM.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9106.jpg)
Texas Canyon rest stop in SE AZ.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9107.jpg)
The mountains of home. The Rincons. the ranch is to the right and Tucson to the left.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9110.jpg)
The world unfamous Triple T Truckstop. Santa Catalina Mountains and Tucson in the background. If you come to Tucson, stop here for yummy hot apple pie w ice cream. ;D
Home again. ;D 8) 8) 8) :snowball:
Almost forgot. One of my many gullies. Missouri is erosion central with its combination of sloping land, erodible soils, and severe storms with near tropical rainfall.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9020%7E0.jpg)
Head of the gully.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9023.jpg)
Here is the traditional treatment of gullies. Put your junk in there and it catches the dirt and stabilizes the gully. I have found several former gullies in the woods that have so filled with inwashed dirt that you have difficulty knowing it ever was a wash.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9019%7E0.jpg)
Glippitty glop conditions. Makes really heavy shoes.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9022%7E0.jpg)
The delta of the gully. Surprisingly, most gullies mostly move earth locally. Most of the dirt from the cut area above has deposited here. The network of poverty threeawn really helps (see next photo). The tallgrass prairie is now colonizing the delta.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9024%7E0.jpg)
Another less severe gully planted with trees in the bottom to try to get it stablilized. The fallen needles, leaves and sticks really help.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_9018%7E0.jpg)
Are a lot of your Red Oaks dieing? They are dieing like crazy here. I was logging the other day and one about 40 dia and clear for 10' dead and rotting away. I was across the creek and I couldn't get to it. What a waste. Plus I didn't have anything to lift it with. The owner said I could cut anything I wanted. I cut one dead RO and it was good inside. I have quite a few more to cut plus about 500 more Cedar. I love retirement. Where in Mo is your farm?
Yates (N central MO). Lots of oaks died in the drought the last couple of years. It isn't the first time and I'm sure it won't be the last. Nature's scythe. The strongest best ones will survive.
One more little insight. I kind of grumbled when the forester pushed off some soft mast trees on me (mulberries, wild plums). In another thread I lamented the loss of vigor in the forest generally after tordoning the vines, failing to note another thing that could be affecting vigor.
We have a canary island date palm at one of my rental houses. Stick with me here, not really a random thought. The local birds use it as a roost and do produce a lot of do do. My daughter used to live there and never had to pay for fertilizer, as there was always plenty under the tree.
Now back to the apparently unrelated forest vigor loss. With the loss of the grapes, there would be less birds visiting the area and making deposits that are high in nitrogen and phosphorus, as well as flying in micronutrients from adjacent areas with better availability of those nutrients. I know, it doesn't seem like a lot, but think of all the birds that are around and it starts to add up. Those soft mast trees and shrubs could really help the soil fertility over time.
What I am saying is tordon definitely seems to have an effect on vigor. When you add in the loss of manure from the fruit eating birds, the effect is greater. I also think there are other benefits to the forest from having those birds there, including insect control, which becomes more important as we get things like EAB and thousand cankers coming in. Both are insect or insect/disease complexes. Knock down those bugs and less disease. ;D
Just sayin' ;D
forgot to ask. what is a hedged walnut? Been here all my life and never heard the term.
Mesquite, you mentioned birds fertilizing the woods. There has been some good debate as to the consequences of the demise of the passenger pigeon. The old pioneers said they would blacken the sky when passing over and break limbs when they roosted, they were so plentiful. Imagine the rain of manure when those birds passed through. Wonder how the ecology of the midwest is now compared to 200 years ago?
I think the term for the bottom of a gully is a fan. Seen some of the biggest spruce trees and amabilis fir growing on gully fans. ;D I think a delta is out in a river. Just saying (old forum saying ;D ).
I think your doing a good thing looking after that land. A lot would just walk away.
Quote from: ozarkgem on April 25, 2014, 04:33:01 AM
forgot to ask. what is a hedged walnut? Been here all my life and never heard the term.
Hedging is an ecological/land management term for woody plants that have been repeatedly browsed (chewed on) until they start to look like a hedge. From the plant's point of view, it is armoring itself against further overbrowsing, as the exterior of the plant is full of the ends of sticks which makes it difficult for the animal to eat more leaves. Hedging is generally considered an indicator of overbrowsing.
Consider the related term: highlining. This is where browsers, like deer eat everything they can reach, forming a level bottom on the canopy. You can get this with rabbits, too, but the high line is lower. It is actually pretty entertaining to watch them work. They will stand up on their tippy toes to reach those last leaves, and even jump up a little to grab the last bite. ;D
Quote from: Cedarman on April 25, 2014, 06:14:54 AM
Mesquite, you mentioned birds fertilizing the woods. There has been some good debate as to the consequences of the demise of the passenger pigeon. The old pioneers said they would blacken the sky when passing over and break limbs when they roosted, they were so plentiful. Imagine the rain of manure when those birds passed through. Wonder how the ecology of the midwest is now compared to 200 years ago?
I'd think really different. Hardly any fire where the Indians burned most every year. Different wildlife and densities. No bulldozers other than buffalos. ;D
Better yet, let's look at 10,000 years ago when we had elephants, giant ground sloths etc. It would have looked a lot like Africa with extended savannas of tall grass prairie dotted with honey locust and osage orange. We wouldn't even think it was the same place.
Quote from: SwampDonkey on April 25, 2014, 06:28:18 AM
I think the term for the bottom of a gully is a fan. Seen some of the biggest spruce trees and amabilis fir growing on gully fans. ;D I think a delta is out in a river. Just saying (old forum saying ;D ).
I think your doing a good thing looking after that land. A lot would just walk away.
You are right. It is only a delta when the water is running. I'll try to get a picture during a flood. ;D
It is actually good land. The soil is over 30 feet deep. It has just been abused. I'm just trying to make it right. There are probably only 5 acres out of the 80 that still need a lot of healing. Trees grow pretty fast once things get better, like 4 rings to the inch fast. ;D
Gullies usually have run off water, it's just not permanent. On mountain sides on the west coast you would see this often and some dispersing or shifting in the fan area from time to time. Yes fans are usually rich sites.
Sometimes there's 3 steps back before one step ahead when your dealing with wildlife, weather events, and man caused stuff. ;D
Alluvial fan is more correct. I was just messing with you. ;D The mechanism is basicly the same. Sediment laden water slows down and drops its sediment. We have alluvial fans everywhere in the desert. It's easy when there is almost no permanent water. We also have what would normally be deltas in watersheds, but the water goes poof. :(
Come down sometime after a big flood. The flows are more like runny concrete or cooling wax than water. You can watch fans form in just a few minutes. After a really big rain, washes might cut 10 feet deep or deposit dirt, sand, rocks and other debris over a large area 2-4 ft deep. Most of our alluvial fans are layer upon layer of flood/landslide deposited material. During slower events, nothing permanent gets deposited.
Actually colluvial is what I had in mind because it's more to do with slope failure from water saturation and overland water flow or creep and slippage that isn't a river. But on the NW coast they get close to 2.5 meters or rain and often them gullies get water in them. Is your place there getting river deposit or is it just slope failure and sheet wash from higher up during storms and such?
That big slide in Washington this spring was colluvial.
Alluvial is river deposit.
Then around here we have ancient glacial-fluvial deposits (due to melt water from glaciers) as well as alluvial from flooding or high water on the rivers. Best kind of soil. And before that this place was all ocean around here. Found fossilized ocean life dead centre of the province on the River Don. The tide comes up the river 60 miles.
Well, at least in the stuff I have seen, one blends into another. Definitions are fine as far as they go, but often the real situation is more complicated than that. Few of us have seen the kinds of floods that leave their mark in the geological record, which is mostly composed of catastrophes.
Here is one example. Over 10 years ago there were two great fires in the Santa Catalina Mountains. These both burned around 100,000 acres each. A couple of years after that a slow moving, rotating thunderstorm dumped between 8-11 inches of rain in less than 2 hours. This is basicly double or more the amount that we consider for the 100 year flood calculations and an entire year's precipitation for us. The mountainsides let go all over the place. This is where the nice idea of colluvial, alluvial and other definitions stops working. Normally a colluvial deposit is relatively local and mostly stays near the place where it broke (slumped) loose . When you add enough water, it can be anything between what you would consider a normal landslide to something like stiff to runny concrete, which is what we saw recently in Washington, then thick muddy water and finally just sand, rocks and relatively clean water. Where do you draw the line? Also consider that all the canyons were already roaring with water before the landslides hit.
After it was all done there were clearly demarcated landslide deposits, some with boulders the size of houses. However, lots of that material ended far downstream, indistinguishable from whatever you would find along these washes. There were flood deposits along the canyon washes as they spread into the alluvial fans, although all the washes here are entrenched.
I know this story well as it tried to kill me on the way to work later that morning.
Just sayin. I think sometimes we get overly dependent upon our words that we attempt to use to describe things, which, at best, is an imperfect system. :)
We can get the flowing concrete analogy without any landslides, per se. All it takes is a really big flow. The washes can cut 10 feet deep in one place, then go downstream a way and make a really fat, wide deposit many feet deep. When you see the phenomenon in action, it is hard to wrap the mind around.
Even in a relatively normal flood, you can hear the rocks clacking and rolling in the washes. The flow gets faster and they act almost like bits of sand doing the saltation thing into the air in the dust bowl. This creates a powerful grinding and abrading machine. Cars that get washed off a road in a flood are frequently buried to above the windows when they get found, full of rocks, mud, sand and debris.
Gullies with permanent water I know well. We have a really big one up north of us. ;D
It's easy for me, one deposit is river, stream, brook, one ain't. ;D Both have unconsolidated material. Just means it's unstratified, nothing else. Those landslides like in Washington are common all over the NW. What it looks like depends on the mix of material and water. And it will surprise ya how quick a pile of dirt and rock gets hard. You can dump a load of top soil and leave it alone for a couple weeks in a few rains with the baking sun between the rain and that is solid as the floor. Not concrete, but your shoes won't fill with dirt when you walk on it. If it didn't stiffen up forest roads would be nothing but soup all the time. ;D
One can misinterpret geology, just as one can misidentify a fern. I worked with a fellow once that was good with indicator plants when identifying sites. One fern his book didn't tell'm about was the ostrich fern, a completely edible fern. He didn't know what it was, but grew on sites not far from many sites he interpreted for silviculture prescriptions. There was no way he was eating it, because he figured since he didn't know about it no one else did either. Didn't matter a fellow picked and ate them all his life as well as the local natives. :D
My brother in law went out to the farm last week and sent some pictures of the little trees we planted. He said where he looked there was about 90% survival. Sure hope so and praying the rains keep coming so they can get well established.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/Resampled952014-06-219516-11-2295881.jpg)
I'm thinking elderberry.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/Resampled952014-06-219516-12-0895142.jpg)
Happy red cedar.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/Resampled952014-06-219516-12-5295959.jpg)
Not so happy red cedar.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/Resampled952014-06-219516-13-149579.jpg)
Maybe a pecan. :-\
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/Resampled952014-06-219516-13-4295646.jpg)
Swamp white oak, I think.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/Resampled_2014-06-21_16-17-35_476.jpg)
Redbud.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/Resampled_2014-06-21_16-20-00_433.jpg)
Walnut.
BIL says tickus are thickus. Yuck. Better in October. ;D 8) 8) 8) :snowball:
Notice in your "pecan" pic, that the branching pattern is opposite. I believe that one to be elderberry.
Good luck to the little trees.
You are right. ;D 8) 8) 8) :snowball:
Looking back, 2 different elderberries. Tough when you don't take the pictures yourself. :-\
No MO trees this year. My truck is dead. :(
They must sell trucks in Tucson. 8)
Only to people who can afford them. :(
I thought you drove a Cummins, What happened ?
UN
Lost a rod bearing near the New Mexico border by San Simon. Two weeks and $4000 to change out engines for one with only 180,000 on it. Mine had 340,000 and a lot of hard working, rough, dusty miles. I have reattached the bed to the bed frame 3 times now and the bed has been patched with construction anchor and nail plates with snowmobile pop rivets twice. The tail lights and camper shell are held together with aluminum duct tape. All holding together but the poor old truck looks sad. I'm hoping this fix will limp along for at least another 100,000. :( :'( :-[
Update on the truck and news you can use. Turns out the engine swallowed a valve, which had fun playing ping pong in the cylinder with the piston. :(
I will be putting in that used engine after all. Cheaper than an overhaul.
Talked with a guy out by the ranch who used to diagnose diesels for the copper mines out here, keeping million dollar machines running or figuring out what they need to get them fixed ASAP. He said just because the engine rattles and bangs, doesn't necessarily mean that you have lost a rod bearing. First, check the oil pressure. If a rod bearing, there should be a pressure drop. Next crack each injector loose to see if an injector has failed. That can mimic a rod bearing and is a lot cheaper and easier to fix.
The mechanics at the diesel place were about 4-1 for a rod bearing. Only one of them was not sure. It wasn't that. Too bad it wasn't just an injector for me. Maybe one of you guys will be luckier. ;D
Back in Tucson after a whirlwind tour to Missouri, Ohio and Michigan. Thought you might enjoy some photos from the time at the Missouri farm.
Last year's tree planting is looking pretty good. Looks like the survival of the little trees is at least 90%. Here are a couple pictures:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_1797.JPG)
I think this one is a walnut.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_1796.JPG)
One of the white oaks...
While we were checking the trees, we just happened to run into some of these.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_1798.JPG)
While we were picking we also sampled the local wildlife.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_1799.JPG)
Darlene picked about 50 ticks off me while we walked about. I was saturated with repellent from head to toe, which seemed to stop most of the chiggers, but one tick hooked onto me. >:( He met an unfortunate demise. ;D
More wildlife:
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_1805.JPG)
Butterfly weed.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_1801.JPG)
We found another clone of blackberries about 6-8 feet tall and about 50 feet across. The berries were quite large and especially tasty.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_1807.JPG)
For scale, my nephew is 6' 8" and his hand is not small. Very big. A couple of the family members will be returning for rooted cuttings. Downside is the vines/bushes are very heavily thorned and they will tangle trap you if you get too far in. We got about a half gallon of berries from that one bush where we could get to them. I think they would be fine on a trellis. The blackberry cobbler was yummy. digin1 digin_2 sketti_1 food6
Meanwhile, back in the woods the pruned and thinned redcedars are starting to get crowded and need thinning again. lots of these are from 6-8" thick now. Some are over a foot (not shown).
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_1808.JPG)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_1809.JPG)
Nice trees along the big draw.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_1810.JPG)
These are in the 20" plus range and still growing nicely.
A couple of my nephews and I reopened some of the old logging trails that had been blocked by fallen trees and brush.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_1811.JPG)
Adam ran the mower through after. We thought it would be fun to go through the woods in the dark and maybe find some glowing mushrooms. Too bad we left the lights on the whole time as we struggled to get through the rather muddy trail. If we had checked with the lights off, we would have seen plenty, as the forest floor was covered with jack o lantern mushrooms. Turns out they glow green in the dark. I identified them after we left Missouri. :(
More in October. ;D
mesquite not to hijack the thread just jumpin in way late but I didn't know you were from oak harbor. done work in oak harbor nice area only problem is they have skeeters the size of small cats
I grew up near Helena. I have lots of relatives near and in Oak Harbor. Many people don't know that Oak Harbor produced the world's finest oak from the nearby Black Swamp and environs in the day of wooden ships.
And no they are not as big as cats. There are just so many that the ones biting you weigh as much as a cat. ;D
Something I've been thinking about for some time but haven't mentioned. There is a plant that grows over a lot of my open areas that are being converted to timber called sericea lespedeza or Chinese lespedeza, Lespedeza cuneata. In Missouri it was originally called Korean lespedeza. The plant was introduced in 1938 to the US to control erosion and provide wildlife food in the SE states. It had been grown at experiment stations since the late 1800's. This plant was government introduced and recommended for CRp (sorry, my wife got the keyboard wet last night and some of the caps don't work now) up until the 1990's. The plants are very well adapted to about the southeastern third of the US and have invasive tendencies, which now have placed them on the government bad list even though it was originally released by them. The plant is now listed as a noxious weed in several states.
Here is a USFS info thingy www.fs.fed.us/database/feis/plants/.../all.html
Pretty good writeup but there are mistakes. (Ain't no plants germinating at 194°F.)
Of course, things are never that simple. Once a plant makes the bad list the piling on commences, with the research directed at showing how bad an organism is and all of it's faults. Turns out that this plant has good features as well. The plant is one of few that will grow in poor, eroded acidic soils like old coal mines. As a legume the plant produces its own nitrogen and enriches the soil where it is growing over time. The plants are very drought tolerant and provide food for herbivores and birds in bad times.
It turns out that this Lespedeza is very good food for GOATS (probably even old ones) and sheep. In addition, The condensed tannins which are generally considered bad for forage, actually contribute to more efficient digestion in ungulates and more rapid weight gain. These same tannins also have been found to be as efficient in the reduction or elimination of worms and other intestinal parasites in sheep and goats as chemical treatments, eliminating the need for chemical wormers.
Check this out: simsbrothers.com/ourProducts.htm
Now I would like to add my two cents to the discussion. As posted earlier, I replanted the treeless parts of my CRP last year. I had a lot of introduced Lespedeza present in my planting in patches. The person in charge of CRP aforestation for the county said I would have to treat the Lespedeza as part of the planting. I, being the nice guy that I am told him only if you guys pay for it. You were the ones who introduced it in the first place. He backed off at that point. Besides, I liked the fact that it grew in some of the poorer soils and helped return fertility to those soils. I had also noticed that inside the heavier Lespedeza stands the deer didn't bother the trees as much, allowing them to start to put on height growth instead of just growing as deer browse. The stuff acts as a natural fence inside the patches. When we just visited a couple weeks ago I noticed that one of the places where the ground was a little better and had walnut and cherry planted 16 years ago were showing walnut and cherry shoots sticking up about 6 tall in the most recently formed lespedeza patch. Before this year they were stuck in the grass/weed layer, never getting over a couple of feet tall because the deer munched them every time they tried to grow.
When the canopy closes the lespedeza gets sad and gets replaced by native shade plants. ;D
Maybe invasive, but the best thing that ever happened to my young trees. ;D 8) 8) 8) :snowball:
This could be a good tool for aforestation, especially if it is already present in the area, you aren't going to be introducing a new problem plant. I wish I had planted it in my initial planting. I think I would now have an even stand 30 feet tall by now instead of popcorn mounds where the deer happened to leave the trees alone so they could grow.
Any thoughts?
I have a 4 acre feild that I disk and planted white clover. The white clover lasted one year and the lesadiza was there before and after. It was what made the hay for the last 20 years. I agree with the poor dirt comment and the drought comment.
gww
Better to have something than to have nothing, isn't it?
What animals do you feed with it and how do they like it?
;D
My neibor was cutting it for goats and sheep and sometimes minature horses and he liked it. The very few years he fertulize, it did double the hay out put but mostly he just cut it.
gww
Ps I was kind of hoping bees like it cause I know they like clover and I am trying to get a few hive going. My neibor is finally getting old enough that I will probly just be bush hogging it from here on out.
gww
One of the things I read said it was also a good honeybee plant. You could check that out by visiting the plants to see if the bees are using them. I would check several different times during the day as lots of honey plants only have nectar at certain times of the day. ;D
If you are looking to have a hive, you can help them out by having what they need within a mile of the hive. If it is further away than that it takes more nectar to fly and get it than they take back to the hive. Some good plants for bees are corn and other grasses (for pollen, they use that as a protein/nutrient source), sometimes soybeans have nectar, black locust, honey locust, maple, fruit trees, alfalfa, various wildflowers, clovers, buckwheat, cucurbits like squash, pumpkins, watermelons, cucumbers, melons and a wide variety of other flowering plants.
The best conditions for honeybees to thrive and get you plenty of honey are:
a decent mix of flowering plants in the early spring which allows the colony to recover from winter and get the number of bees up for the main honey flow.
one or two honey plants in sufficient quantity to provide a big honey flow maybe 5 weeks or more after a spring buildup honey flow. This will provide most of your honey.
Hope this helps. ;D
Bees especially like basswood flowers. ;D
I planted 15 fruit trees last year and have a garden every year though this year it really really sucks except things in boxes.
I about killed off my first hive due to a couple of mistakes and robbing and sent it back to the guy I got it from cause to live it is going to need resources from other hives. Next Year!
I had watched them and they left plant alone this year that they just mobbed last year. I have all kinds of flowers but they seem to be the ones bumble bees like more then honey bees.
I had to look up the basswood tree but still would not reconize one if I saw it. Tree species is not one of my strong points though I am doing my best to pay more attention since building the mill.
Mesquite
I read this whole post yesterday cause I am from MO and found it interresting. I didn't know it was here untill it came up when I hit "new post".
I didn't mean to take the thread off track but thanks for the advice on the bees.
Bees where the reason I built my mill. I had scavanged a bunch of boards and built a few hives and was frustrated that I was having a hard time finding more that would work for hives. Somebody got a mill on one of the bee forums and the rest is history, here I am.
I still don't have bees however now that I about killed my first hive. I do have a mill though 8).
gww
There are a lot of things to learn about bees including nectar plants, diseases, pests and general management. I have some experience with these things, so if you have any questions, feel free to ask.
Basswood honey is supposed to be fabulous BTW. ;D 8) 8) 8) :snowball:
A couple of great references: American Honey Plants, Frank C. Pellet. Last publication date I have is 1976.
The Hive and the Honey Bee, Dadant & Sons. Last date I have for that one 1975.
Both of these are must haves if you want to be successful at beekeeping. The Hive and the Honey Bee may have been updated since my copy. There is no mention of Africanized bees or the diseases/pests that came in with them.
mesq...
I have did a lot of reading. I have only been in a hive 4 times. I do think at some point reading is not enough and you just have to jump in and see what is happinning in person. My first hive had eggs and larva but never capped any. I misjuged the flow and did not feed soon enough and when I did I caused robbing. I sent the hive back with the guy I got it from cause I had no resources to help it out with.(no other hive to steal stuff from)
I guess if it takes off I will get it back this year or he will give me a nuc next year.
I tried trapping before getting this hive but had no success. I built everything and only have about $220 counting bees in it and want to keep it that way. I am not a seller and so I will probly use or give away anything I make just like I do eggs and I am sure boards also. I like my hobbies but need them to be self sustaining and not money pits so I can keep doing them. I may someday ask your advice on bees and thanks for the offer.
I could sell if I could just put it by the road with a can for the money but don't want to market anything and mostly want things I will use. I am running out of places to stack wood so maybe I need to build a couple of more hives not that I have anything to put in them. Winter is comming and I intend to be busy.
I have three acres of trees coming, so should have plenty to play with. I am burning and trying to give away and have some for sell along the road, the bark and slab wood from what I have already cut and still have tops and some cut fire wood laying in my woods.
I am retired now and enjoying not having a schedule that I have to meet and so learning some of this stuff is really great. I really thank you guys that are willing to help in my education.
Thanks
gww
Depending upon how much work you want to do, I would start with at least 3 colonies. It will give you a better idea than just with one what is going on, as you can compare them to each other. Also gives you flexibility for management if one colony is getting too big and ready to swarm, you can steal brood or comb and give it to a weaker colony. I leave the political considerations for you to cogitate. ;D ;D ;D 8) :snowball: :snowball: :snowball:
Mesq......
I am on a fixed income and my wife does not like my hobbies near as much as I do. Add that to the fact that I am a cheep bad word. That is why I only bought one hive. The guy only had one he wanted to get rid of also. I didn't by packages from out of state because I thought I might need a little help. I paid a bit more for these bees ($200) and only got one hive but I also got a little help and though the guy might be a tiny bit put out with me I believe he may yet save my bacon. If things go well for the spring flow I may be able to split and from that point have the resources you talk of. The alternative may be that I was penny wise and pound foolish and may lose it all. I have about 10 medium hive bodies and two long langs built and about 200 frames and a whole bunch of board drying. If it works out I am hoping for 3 or 4 hives with in a couple years. I then may be in a position to not have to relie so heavily on others. I will still be trying to trap to help with this. It is hard for me to spend $500 knowing I am not going to sell honey even though not doing so may cost me $200 and I end up with nothing. I have read of people losing 14 hives over winter.
I don't know what is smart. I am cheep though and it has bit me before.
Thanks
gww
if you make your own hives boxes and frames you can save a lot. I used to have 3 hives and the honey I sold paid for all my equipment and then some. It wasn't hard to sell it and honey is worth more now than when I was doing it in the 80's.
You can put up notes around the area and generally let people know you will remove swarms of bees for free and get them that way.
There was an old saying I learned as a kid:
A swarm in May is worth a load of hay.
A swarm in June is worth a silver spoon.
A swarm in July isn't worth a fly.
The way I did it, the glue and staples and nails were what cost the most. The bees really cost the most and have the most risk.
I will get it right one of these days.
Thanks
gww
Ps I did not put myself on any swarm list or craigs list. I did tell my family to call if they saw a swarm. I have never saw a swarm in my whole life and mushroom hunt every spring. I am watching closer now.
If you see a swarm flying clap your hands and it will confuse them and they will normally land close by
then you can get them into your box.
You can subscribe to http://www.americanbeejournal.com/ It is a very good educational paper that come out once a month I thing. When I had my Bees I could hardly wait for the next issue.
That was very good. When I had bees, I read it every time it came.
Ford...
I will check into that, thanks
gww
I imagine it's an 'association' type of journal or magazine to keep everyone informed. :)
SD
See reply #116... for the link to http://www.americanbeejournal.com/
Dadant & Sons is a major provider of beekeeping supplies. FYI ;D
If I actually lived in MO, i think I would have bees again. Lots of wildflowers, a big stand of black locust, honey locust, redbuds, wild cherry, wild plums, blackberries and all pretty close. Also corn and soybeans nearby. Would be even better if somebody close grew alfalfa. That one is a great honey plant. I wonder how much honey my invasive lespedeza makes?
Unfortunately, beekeeping is not something that works from a distance. If you want them to do well you have to check them regularly. :(
I haven't got a subscription but am looking at the web content of the link that was posted.
Thanks
gww
Back at it in MO. My nephew and son, Thomas. He has grown a bit since last time. Here he is with his first log. ;D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2313~0.JPG)
Seems like Missouri is the tick and chigger capital of the universe. Fortunately they seem to be asleep at the moment, but we are also known as the sticktight capital of the universe.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2315.JPG)
Here are just a few. :( :snowball: :snowball: :snowball:
Cutting/thinning/pruning black locust.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2316.JPG)
Lichens are purty.
A bunch of these poles will become a tree house/deer stand. ;D 8) 8) 8) :snowball:
More stuff.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2318.JPG)
It's purty here.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2317.JPG)
Here is that hedged and popcorned walnut from spring of 2014. Was going to put before and after pruning. Saw won't start. I'll get back to you. ;D 8) 8) 8) :snowball:
Well, that hedged and popcorned walnut was one of them there white walnuts and the leaves smell like a hickory, as in it is a pecan. :-[ :-[ :-[
Actually, turns out all the walnuts I planted there didn't make it but a bunch of pecans did. ;D 8) 8) 8) :snowball: That's ok. We should start to see nuts in a couple or three years from how big they are now. Anyway here is that tree all pruned up so we can get some veneer grade smiley_devil smiley_devil smiley_devil smiley_devil smiley_devil smiley_devil smiley_devil smiley_devil smiley_devil
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2320.JPG)
View of the CRP planting from my dad's old deer stand. Sorry, the trees are getting so big it is hard to see.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2319.JPG)
And a nice Misssouri sunset.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2321.JPG)
Until next time.
More photos from the 1999 CRP planting. The trees that didn't get pounded too bad are mostly 10-25 feet tall now.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2323.JPG)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2325.JPG)
Nice walnuts coming in between the cedars.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2324.JPG)
Pruning up.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2326.JPG)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2322.JPG)
Those fine textured trees along the skyline are the thinned and pruned black locusts. About 40 feet tall now.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2332.JPG)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2336.JPG)
Multiflora roses are bad. >:( Some of them are 15 feet tall and as wide.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2337.JPG)
But pie is good.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2366.JPG)
I have mentioned a pretty good sized elm in the woods, probably around 24" dbh. Here it is, still growing.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2335.JPG)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2334.JPG)
There is a usable cherry right next to it so they will likely come out together when the time comes.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2333.JPG)
Growing clear cedar.
Here is a pair of field edge cedars that were first pruned at maybe 6-8 feet tall in around 1995 or 1996. They have been pruned higher about 3 more times since.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2327.JPG)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2328.JPG)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2329.JPG)
If you look at the bottom photo, you can see the pruning history of the larger of the two trees. The lowest part is now growing clear lumber. About 2 feet of the trunk is obscured by branches and foreground. The just healed over branches about 1/4 of the way up is the second pruning. Third pruning in the center and just pruned at the top. The gradual pruning process results in a cone of knotty wood largest at the top and smallest at the bottom. I think to get full length clear lumber you need another 6-8" of additional growth,which would make the log around 20" at that time. There are no signs of any rot or conks. The tree is maybe 12-13" dbh now.
Got a little milling done. One dead cherry, a few old rotten walnut logs from 2011 and some cedar. I'm trying to develop a market for short stub cedar for fireplace mantles, coat and hat racks, etc. These are a couple of my grand nephews, 7 and 9. The 9 year old is expected to be taller than his 6' 8" dad and stockier. Maybe he'll be a famous linebacker or at least help in the woods someday.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2338.JPG)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2342.JPG)
Adam is happy.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2340.JPG)
Cutting knobby cedar.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2340.JPG)
Some old man doing stuff.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2344.JPG) ;D
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2356.JPG)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2363.JPG)
And a picture of a dirty old man just for fun.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2365.JPG)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2373.JPG)
Got this old shed over at another sister's house that she lets me use to store lumber, but rain blows in the windows. Fixt with surplus greenhouse plastic from the saguaro hill. Should work for a few more years.
Too bad, but the drought from a few years ago did in this old cottonwood that overhangs the shed.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2370.JPG)
Looks little but it is about 36" dbh and of unknown rottiness at the time. It was in waist high poison ivy and had come up in the midst of a disk harrow, which it later overgrew. I had to cut it at waist height. Also plenty of tires to avoid. What a mess. Her father in law was not a neatness counts guy. :( I think they will be cleaning up the mess for at least another 5 years.
Anyway, the bark was loose and scary, unknown solidness and questionable whether it wanted to go the right way. Face cut it and drove 2 ten inch wedges into the backcut, ran out of wedge, so started cutting out the center of the holding wood for more fun. Down it went perfect. Whew.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2371.JPG)
Here is the butt of the log floating over the stump.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2372.JPG)
I know the rings are hard to see but a lot of them are an inch wide. I don't think this tree was much over 20 years old. It came up where the roof runoff ran down the hill and got regular irrigation right up to when it stopped raining in 2012 and 2013. Then 2 real skinny rings and out.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2368.JPG)
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_2367.JPG)
Until next time. ;D 8) 8) 8) :snowball:
MB,
Are you still out there? I'm a newbie, just wanted to let you know how much I enjoyed this thread. Great pictures, thank you
Yes, as a nature lover, I loved it, cuz I read the whole thing in one sitting! Wonder where he is!
Still kicking and just returned from Missouri to Tucson. We milled one of the red cedar trees pruned at least 20 years ago which provided some interesting information about the effects of pruning on wood quality for this species. Now I have to figure out how to make my photo files small enough to post.
Welcome back, I've been wondering where you were. ffwave
Trying to post a picture again. Posts 63, 66, 67, 68, 69, 73 (late in the post) All about red cedar pruning. Well, quite a few years have passed and my greenhouses at home need substantial repair due to rot and aerial termites. Hoping that using red cedar lumber will give them a tummy ache. This 2X4 contains lots of information regarding results of pruning. If you take a look at the lower knot which was alive at pruning, the grow over was very clean with no rot. I thing the upper knot was a dead branch. Note the included bark which was already present at pruning. Also clean overgrowth post pruning. I didn't count the post pruning rings but lots of these trees got pruned from 2005-2008. It's been a while. The knot free wood was around 3" thick. The outermost boards were clear or nearly so. This tree was probably around 10"+- at pruning. We like to get to them when they get like 3-4" thick and prune in lifts as the trees grow. The beneficial effects of the pruning decline with increasing height of the tree since it is not possible to maintain both a narrow trunk and to keep the tree alive and growing. This results in the knot pattern being small near the tree base with a gradually increasing diameter with height. Rot was noted in this tree going up from the stump and following the pith up the tree trunk center. It was a rot that left fibrous punk as a residue. The rot was conical in shape and about a foot long and perhaps 2" in diameter at the base. It also extended through the log full length and was about 1/4" in diameter along the pith line. It was so minimal that it could be ignored. I'd say it is a sign it was time to harvest the tree. No rot at all was associated with the pruned branches.
well, that didn't work. I'll try again later.
mesquite
You need to put your pics into your gallery, and then link to those in your gallery to your posts. None are showing up in your gallery, that I can see.
This is the way you used to do photos, back in the day.
I get a message the file is too big..
It's in my gallery but I can't figure out how to get it here.
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_1915~0.JPG) (https://forestryforum.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=356665)
Quote from: mesquite buckeye on November 06, 2024, 10:27:36 PMIt's in my gallery but I can't figure out how to get it here.
I have found that, for me, it's easier to open two tabs; one (1) with my normal posting window and the other (2) to upload and select pictures. I select the picture and copy the BBCode (normal) in (2) and paste it in the posting window in (1).
I use a laptop, not my phone.
Quote from: Ljohnsaw on November 06, 2024, 11:25:05 PM(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/31219/IMG_1915~0.JPG) (https://forestryforum.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=356665)
Thanks for moving it. Sure seems more complicated than I remember.
Quote from: Magicman on November 07, 2024, 08:32:11 AMQuote from: mesquite buckeye on November 06, 2024, 10:27:36 PMIt's in my gallery but I can't figure out how to get it here.
I have found that, for me, it's easier to open two tabs; one (1) with my normal posting window and the other (2) to upload and select pictures. I select the picture and copy the BBCode (normal) in (2) and paste it in the posting window in (1).
I use a laptop, not my phone.
Thanks for the suggestion. Long time no see. How are you holding up?
Da old man is still kicking and still sawing although I am being selective about my jobs. I want smaller and closer to home. I sawed last Friday and should finish that job today and tomorrow if the weather/rain holds.
Where in central Missouri is the 80? I am (relative to this thread) new here just interested, spent a few years of my life in Columbia.
Quote from: Nebraska on November 09, 2024, 10:40:58 AMWhere in central Missouri is the 80? I am (relative to this thread) new here just interested, spent a few years of my life in Columbia.
What years at Mizzou? I graduated in 1962.
1990-1994, they made me leave, said I was a Dr then. :wink_2: