Almost overdid it today

Patrick NC · August 21, 2021, 09:16:26 PM

Yesterday I cut down, limbed , and bucked about 2500 bf of pine logs. Sweated more than I have in a long time. Drank a bunch of water and several Gatorades to try to rehydrate last night. Apparently it wasn't enough because today after I sawed for about 6 hours I was done. I made it home and when I got out of the truck I got the worst leg cramps I ever had. I was immobile for at least 30 minutes. I couldn't even walk up the 3 steps onto the porch to get in the house. Wife brought out some potassium pills and a bottle of pedialite. I felt pretty bad for a couple of hours, but several bottles of water and a Gatorade later, I'm starting to feel better. Could have been much worse, but bad enough. I think ill take it easy tomorrow and push the rest of this job off until next week.

farmfromkansas · August 21, 2021, 09:43:31 PM

When I was in the building business, always enjoyed having a big day. The next day was another story, usually had trouble lifting my hammer before noon, after one of those really fun days.

Southside · August 21, 2021, 10:15:02 PM

It's been stupid hot and OMG humid. Take it easy for sure. I hate August.

Ljohnsaw · August 21, 2021, 10:18:40 PM

Working on my cabin up at 5,600' elevation and in the heat (90's), I make it a habit to drink about 4 or 5 quarts of water. Yet, I would still get leg cramps in my calves and, on occasion, my thighs were I couldn't walk and extreme pain. Tried calcium (Tums) and pickle juice but no relief. I don't cook with salt but I started eating 2 or 3 snack bags of popcorn or chips at lunch and a couple more at dinner (when working hard up there) and no more cramps! Not even a hint of a cramp.

Don P · August 21, 2021, 10:37:31 PM

It was a sweat producing day. I had big plans when I got home, the porch and multiple glasses of ice tea won out.

mike_belben · August 21, 2021, 10:38:32 PM

Saltines and pickle juice.

Few months ago i guess, woke up thrashing around in agony for my first simultaneous double hamstring cramp.

Was all i could manage not to shove both heels up my butt cuz thats where it felt like they were headed. Could not straighten either one.

Man that was scary. Was panting like a sprint yet hadnt moved a step! I guess i should probably expect to need a colonoscopy soon too just to embrace middle age.

Southside · August 21, 2021, 10:43:12 PM

I will get those Mike, nerve related from getting busted up, no rhyme or reason, they drop me to the ground. Just focus on getting through it, they won't kill you even though it feels like they will. They do pass, just get through the next second and repeat. Eventually they let go.

mike_belben · August 22, 2021, 12:24:18 AM

its only happened that bad once and did kinda feel like "okay just kill me now.. I cant wait"

i got real in tune with how my legs are feeling since. Im a lot more proactive with any leg wierdness now.

thecfarm · August 22, 2021, 05:23:07 AM

Water, liquids or something is very important. And working slow and taking breaks are too. I know I don't get the heat you do, but I can and do work in the heat we have here. Work slow helps a lot.

Old Greenhorn · August 22, 2021, 06:15:11 AM

There was no "almost', you did overdo it and sounds like you almost went over the edge. Believe it or not Tums will help with those leg cramps big time. Chew up 3 or 4 when you 'think' it may be coming on. I keep a bottle by the bed since Doc recommended them 2 years ago and it made my issues go away. The humidity here has been a killer these last few weeks. You've got to take care of yourself first.
I am not a big gator aide fan, in fact I really don't like the stuff at all, but on those really heavy days a bottle or two through the day with water the rest of the time seems to make a big difference also in my recovery time.

customsawyer · August 22, 2021, 07:13:57 AM

My go to for preventing and during a cramp is V8 juice. I drink one every day at lunch and if you feel the cramps coming on, go chug a couple of cans right quick.

dougtrr2 · August 22, 2021, 07:36:32 AM

You have got to stay ahead of the dehydration. Drinking a gallon of water at the end of the day isn't going to help. You need to take in plenty of fluids during the day, before you feel the need.

When I was much younger, I was sent to Florida for a military tech school. One weekend I went on a 200 mile bicycle ride. Five miles from being done, I quit sweating. Luckily, I realized it and stopped, took a long break in air-conditioning and rehydrated. I did the exact same ride the next week, same weather conditions, but I stopped every hour for liquids and had no issues.

If you once go down with heat exhaustion, it can take years to fully recover.

Doug in SW IA

Sixacresand · August 22, 2021, 08:35:37 AM

Quote from: dougtrr2 on August 22, 2021, 07:36:32 AM
If you once go down with heat exhaustion, it can take years to fully recover.

Very true.
It hit me in my twenties while I was mowing grass. I thought I was a though guy. By that time the medical society had demonized salt tablets which my coaches made us take for years. That particular day, I failed to drink enough water, quit sweating and got severely hot and sick. Took me over ten years to be able to sweat again and tolerate heat again,

Magicman · August 22, 2021, 09:02:27 AM

Just a medical question that I wonder about and I guess know what the answer would be.

@doctorb @doc henderson

We all get muscle cramps in our extremities. The heart is a muscle, so is it subject to muscle cramps?

farmfromkansas · August 22, 2021, 09:16:22 AM

When I have a muscle cramp in my calf, just grab my toes and pull, usually can pull it right out of a cramp. Not always, but most times. Also have just stepped down on my toes to force things back, and it goes away.

doc henderson · August 22, 2021, 09:25:53 AM

all muscle needs energy to reset, and electrolytes to run the system. you need sodium and potassium. calcium can relax muscle. it is used to stabilize the heart muscle. Magnesium can stop certain arrhythmias like tor sod de points. the body is 98% water. so any loss that is not replaced can change the chemistry of the whole mechanism. your body regulates the water and electrolyte abnormalities, to an extent, but not at the extremes. being conditioned for work in heat, is helpful as well. your body can learn to manage the fluid and electrolytes and the muscle becomes more efficient at working if done on a regular basis. when we are young, we can get conditioned to work, and amaze even ourselves. the hard part is recognizing when we are old and deconditioned. It was quite a lesson to show up first day to a job. go home tired and sunburnt. could barely go the next day, but by the end of the summer, we could go to work early due to heat. get off early, and go play tennis in the mid afternoon. when a muscle contracts, it is the sugar or energy that releases the contracted fiber, for the next pull. with no energy to reset, the muscle stays contracted. the electrolytes actually go through channels to cause the contraction. think electric current in a nerve impulse (chemical)

doc henderson · August 22, 2021, 09:30:22 AM

if the electrolytes are off, it can be from losses of salt or water. both will change the concentrations. there is a range that will work. calcium will help relax/stabilize muscle cells, not matter the actual abnormality. we use water to cool ourselves, so in the heat, things can get crazy. If you are working hard, you need salt and water. as well as sugar to pay the debt to reset a muscle fiber. most foods are good in moderation. the problem with all forms of nutrition, is consuming in excess of what we need. not as many people do physical work, and need less calories, despite having more than they need.

Magicman · August 22, 2021, 09:37:40 AM

smiley_dizzy

doc henderson · August 22, 2021, 09:37:52 AM

heart muscle is a bit different. it is designed to work a little all the time. It can fibrillate if it does not get enough energy from the blood supply relative to the work it is doing. fast heart rate or high blood pressure makes it work harder. the pain you feel when the cells are not getting enough supply of calories and oxygen is angina. if cells die as a result, that is a myocardial infarction, or heart attack. major electrolyte abnormalities cause arrhythmias like v tach. the qrs changes as potassium level go up, till the heart stops.

Magicman · August 22, 2021, 09:49:57 AM

That sorta kinda 'splains what I was wondering, especially about the "little all of the time" bit. Thanks.

doctorb · August 22, 2021, 10:03:00 AM

Skeletal muscle is different than cardiac muscle, and both are different than the smooth muscle in your gut. Skeletal muscle, the stuff that can cramp, works at very high tension and expansion parameters. While it has endurance, it's function is to perform at a very high level for a period of time. A relatively short period of time.

Cardiac muscle contraction is involuntary, and is designed to work constantly over your lifetime. While you can make your heart work very hard, it has to work 24/7 as well.

Lots of electrolyte issue and even some unknowns with regard to skeletal muscle cramping. No such thing for cardiac muscle. They are different animals.

Tom the Sawyer · August 22, 2021, 10:27:38 AM

I, too, am not fond of the taste of Gatorade and have found that drinking a quart of an electrolyte drink (like PowerAde Zero) the night before working outside on a hot day seems to significantly reduce the effects of working in the heat. Still drink water or other fluids when working but loading the electrolytes in my system has worked pretty well.

Magicman · August 22, 2021, 10:36:29 AM

Thank You doc henderson and doctorb for your easily understood explanations.

I thought that I was having an 'event' but only needed to loosen a button. :D

moodnacreek · August 22, 2021, 11:17:23 AM

When I was young I could go between meals with out water. I have learned that you have to replace the water faster than you loose it. The part I don't understand is that I have to drink more in cold weather. Another thing is that I don't notice the taste of [good] water unless I am working really hard and not drinking any and then it tastes so good. The leg cramps come during the night if I have not drank enough. Very, very painful.

doc henderson · August 22, 2021, 11:38:10 AM

you can sweat, but you also loose water in other ways. called insensible losses. you make urine, and have moisture in stool. but you also sweat and loose water in your breath. you notice it in the winter more, as you can see the condensation. but the air is also dryer. you warm each breath up to body temp, and humidify it to 100% at body temp. if you are low on water, you kidneys can conserve but to do this it must concentrate things like waste and electrolytes. this can be hard if you are on medications for blood pressure as an example. this can be why as you dehydrate, your sweat may smell strong. you also may stop sweating and overheat, and have weakness and confusion from this. It is like running an old truck, low on water in the radiator, and low on oil in the crankcase. It may fail.