Daily Fabrication Thread

[tacks Y]

Mike are you putting some braces on it also? Seems like you are asking a lot of that tubing, over time may twist?

[mike_belben]

yes, many.  Thats just the initial mount to hold the thing so i can figure the rest out. 

[Jkauffman]

I do have the pdf on my phone. Thanks.

This is only when cold.  If its running mine will always go forward immediately but reverse will not engage in any gear at any rpm until it wants to.. Generally once warmed.  If it stays warm itll always work but i have to park for moving forward when cold.  Going forward helps get reverse sooner.  

Once it works its flawless and strong.  Its not in the linkages or the gear/direction selector valve on top, ive been thru all that.  Seems a servo piston or some spring loaded or pressure balanced control spool has leakage.  Warming probably seals it up enough to function.  I knowits some sort of shuttled control spool blocking fluid to the reverse planet until the spool shifts, not the actual reverse planetary.  Itll pull a house backward once the planetary gets full pressure.  You can feel it starting to tense the track while waiting for it to engage and then bang shes in gear and off to the races strong as ever.


Someday itll break all the way and force me to find it. Hopefully a long ways off!

Maybe weak springs in the modulating valve?That wouldn't really make sense if it goes into forward gear fine though.
I've got my modulating valve apart right now as I was having some shock going into gear sometimes n thought maybe I had a blocked passage somewhere but it was all clear.Going to put in new springs and o-rings but I'm thinking now my trans pump is weak because of a clutch release problem I have.It'll release 1 side at a time 90%f the time but can't release both at once when you push both pedals

[mike_belben]

one of us has the system layout figured wrong and its been too long since i read the theory of operations for me to really say.  i am under the impression the selector valve blocks the transmission pump's path back to tank and forces it with regulated pressure to the selected planetary direction and speed, and also pressurizes the friction clutches to clamp and turn the finals.  i think that pressing the steer pedal moves the spool in the steer valve and opens a path to tank for that side, which unclamps the clutch and allows it to freewheel.  


if im right, and if you cant uncouple a clutch its because you have a failure to route that pressurized oil to tank.  not a case of a low pressure. its a high pressure.  

i would be going over the linkages for the 20th time to see if they stroke.  maybe rig up a camera to watch them while you operate and call out verbally when its messing up so that you can actually see if the spools have fully stroked or stopped short. that will tell you if its in the linkages or in the steer circuit.

[Jkauffman]

I tried to post a screen shot of my manual but it's being rebellious :-[

I may be wrong but it says that when the steering control is not pulled,no oil enters the booster cylinder so the clutch is engaged.I rebuilt the clutches so I kinda have a idea how they work,they're held together by I think 6 springs so they are always engaged until the booster cylinder pushes the yoke over pushing the one flange out and thereby disengaging the clutch.I know,clear as mud but can't think how to describe it.

Maybe your dozer is different?

[Jkauffman]

 

 

[mike_belben]

Mine is a D31p-18 whats yours?  I will see if i can find time after work tonight to look up the book again.  Ive never been in the clutches so i trust your word on it. Either im wrong or theyre different. 

[Jkauffman]

D37e-2

[mike_belben]

ive been lugging these 3/4 x 6 inch metric threaded CNC transport plates around the country since i fished them out of a dumpster and their day finally came.  just right.





this is not finished, i have a hydraulic braden wormgear winch in mass that will probably live ontop this perch once i have all my stuff and i can plumb it and brace it for real pull.  for now 12v electric is all i have to work with.





the lower mount is the base for draft tools.. probably a root ripper i have already made the 1" hardfaced and toothed tines for years ago, and maybe a bog plow for firebreaking and runoff redirect.   i welded on the 4x4 angle wings with about 3/16 clearance from the final housings so that if the thing gets too much sideload, it will touch them and stop bending.  





this is how i laid out the stabilization of the bottom structure, and linked the attachment to the top structure, using 3/4" bolts.  the yellow brace tubes also capture the 1" trunnion and lock it in the quick hitch type saddles.









once the brackets are unbolted piece by piece, its a one hand job to remove.  put a beam or limb onto the roof, lash it to the limb risers up front, cable the winch over the expedient beam and just lift it out of the saddles.  one hand on remote, one hand on attachment.  swing it back, set on ground then stand back and let the cable lay it on the ground flat. its easier to put on the dozer than the tractor.





the gear holding capability is the best part.  it declutters the cab and saves my knees climbing up and down or losing stuff since there really isnt any great storage, like a tractor.  the stupid hodgepodge attachment is on of the ugliest things i ever made but it has interestingly morphed from lawn mower to tractor to dozer attachment and still fits all 3.  mostly it is a tool carrier with a lot of chain attachment points.  (milk crates that go in the rectangle tray not shown)






the electric winch situation not so great.  i made an interesting discovery there yesterday.  machine is a 24volt DC charging and starting system.  obviously thats a pair of group 31 batteries in series.  + - + -

for the lights and winch i have tapped into the plus and minus of just one battery.  they are still in a parallel string with 26ish volts when charge is passing through the whole string, EXCEPT when i am using the winch because that shorts the string.  i knew this.  the winch is only seeing 12volts when contactor closes and works fine.  but i wanted to balance the battery loads and set up 2 different anderson quick connectors, one on each battery.  figured i would swap back and forth periodically to not drag down one battery ..which always ruins the partner.  

well.. for some reason you can only do this with one of the two batteries.  it may be the headlight lead or it may be the alternator feeding into the ground side.. i have to thing about that.  anyway,  when you switch over to the other battery, the ground voltage reference goes up to 12v and the winch gets 24s.  there is only 12volts differential going into the winch but it turns the chassis into a resistive load by energizing the chassis metal and obviously itll drain the battery.  id not have noticed if a little ground wire for the remote contactor hadnt melted in a fury of stink and smoke.  which is the reason why i wanted anderson connector instead of hardwiring, so i could rip the plug off in an emergency instead of watching it burn. 

cant have this toaster situation, so i can only use the one battery.  and when winching, it gets zero alternator help.  so this is not gonna last.  i set up an anderson quick connect whip so that i can plug into my charging when i get back to rescue the working battery but its not a great setup.  a 24 volt winch would be the solution but i dont have one and will not invest in such a silly method when i have a hydraulic winch i hope to retrieve and switch over to before long.  in the meanwhile i will see if i can trade into a 24v.  then the alternator would be carrying some of the load for the batteries instead of resupplying after the work is done.

so for now, i am gonna use the winch as simply a retractable chain.  i will hook a choker, take up just the slack with the winch, then latch the mechanical hold brake, pull forward and backup then take the slack in again until i have the log right behind me.  the tractor will do the hard work and the winch motor will only tend slack.  this will be 100x better than me jumping out to shorten chains over and over like i have been, which only makes sense when you are desperate or bored.

[C5C Tree Farmer]

Would it be simpler to change to 12v charging and use a Mack series-parallel solenoid switch for starting? Basically the two 12v batteries would be in parallel for charging and auxiliary 12v loads and temporarily connected in series by the activated solenoid for 24v starting.

[mike_belben]

I made a trade offer on a 15k# 24v winch.  Will see what happens.. Im not gonna make it a bigger project.. If it just reels in slack and holds thats good enough for now. 

[mike_belben]

Tried it out for a bit today.  Has its quirks but its a big improvement, im pretty happy overall.  Top portion flexes a bit but the bottom that i drag logs from is rock solid, no movement in any direction pulling whole trees.

 Dont think junior will be riding on the tank with me for much longer.  Gotta savor the moment.

[Walnut Beast]

Now your talking 💪👍

[Nebraska]

Looks good Mike 

[mike_belben]

Thank you guys.  I put the saws inside over the hydraulic tank when theres logs or the cable/chains/logs would smash them.  That was just to walk out to the job from my house.

The top structure will need braced a bit to the cage so it doesnt twist up sideways but with no fairlead on i dont sidepull anyway, it would wreck the cable dragging it over C channel.  I need to get one. 

 Fortunately a dozer can just turn in place like a skid steer so it positions for strait winching so much better than the tractor.  

I didnt anticipate how evenly i would be able to spool in.  With the tractor it was positioned in the one good spot then the log starts coming in. As it turns or shifts the cable angle changes.  cable starts piling up on one end of the spool, line pull drops, and the thick pile of line jams into the spreader bars that join the motor and planet ends.  Id have to reel back out, flex the cable over to the empty side of the drum and start over several times. 

 From the dozer seat i just twitch the chassis angle as i go and its great.  Not a real winch but so much better than what i had to do before with this on the tractor or chains on the dozer.  

I pulled two sawlogs from across a ditch and up a bank last night.  About 50 foot away from closest point i could get.  maybe 12 foot elevation change.  by driving forward with the drum hold brake engaged, then backing up to wind in the slack a few cycles.  Took a few easy minutes but worked.  No way on earth it coulda cabled those in as the noses plowed furrows up the bank dirt and caught other downed logs.  I figured if the winch chassis is gonna explode i want to know now.  Without the pawl brake i fabbed it woulda ruined the internal hold break again for certain. 

It woulda been a much easier job if id felled them instead of this meth monkey thief who tangled ever tree into another 2 or 3.  Salvage harvest is so slow and dangerous, i have to start remembering to say no. 

[aigheadish]

Looks good Mike! 

Your boy driving that or anything you've got? My kids are 15 and 13 and they haven't really even asked to drive or operate the backhoe, though I've encouraged it a few times. 

[mike_belben]

he has in the yard.. not really pushed dirt or anything, just travelled.  he can run dozer, bobcat, kubota, all the lawn tractors, big forktruck, 950 sized wheel loader, backhoe etc.  excavator only thing i havent had him in. drove a loaded peterbilt on a backroad once. i did pedals and helped the shifting.  trying to make my own little bargemonkey so he can fund my retirement someday!   ;D

i did some research and put the 8k winch on 24volts to the motor, but only 12v to the control solenoids.  the line speed doubled and it works fine, maybe at a little expense to the motor bushings but i accept that.  the line speed compares to a PTO winch now. the solenoids still drain down that second battery by shorting the 24v charge i guess, so i ordered a $20 step down regulator to take the 24v down to 12v to power the control section and have the alternator at full output every time i click the remote.  i also added a 2awg charge wire from alternator to battery.  

last night i met a guy in knoxville, traded my way into a new in box, never used 15,500# electric winch. much deeper gear reduction, much bigger motor, better freewheel mechanism (those break often on chinese winches) and 2 more electrical horsepower.  i actually think it will be too much load for the dozer electrical system and am gonna put it on the old ford, which i will have the option to put in as huge of an alternator as necessary.  i will probably add another one to make the truck my mobile stick welder, it takes 2 alternators to do it right.  i really really need a wheel skidder and the truck is gonna be it.

yesterday in 2 hours of piddling i pushed in a loop road through 10 acres of woods im harvesting.  but itll take me 5 days of skidding at a snails pace to get it all out and i just dont wanna wear out a now $20k dozer when i could get a zillion turns out of a ratty $2k truck.  the dozer can make the road and bunch the butts to the edge of the road where the truck can snatch them.  once i build a mechanical brake into the drum i think this winch will take 3 slides. 

  so i guess thats next. think i have the details figured out.    

[aigheadish]

I love it! He'll be helping all over the place with you in just a few years! 

[mike_belben]

fingers crossed.  trying to build a useful man for the workforce.  i cant afford a classroom education for him so ive tried to create a real world learning environment. 

[mike_belben]

Pie cuts from a 12" center line radius bent tube, press formed into cable slides.

[mike_belben]

Makeshift floating fairlead roller and cable retainer pin.  





Experimenting with chokers.  Made some up from cable and arborist rope to see how i like them.  I made the rectangular aluminum crimp blocks on the chokers so that the terminal grab on the mainline would work for cables or chains.  Im expecting the unbraided choker eyelets to pull out of the rectangular aluminum crimps or tear the crimp apart, but wanted to know what theyll take.






Im pretty good at braiding eyelets into arborist rope but will never try wire braiding again. Lot of work.  A real choker is well worth the money, i just dont know which system i want to invest in yet.

[g_man]

Mike have you ever seen this - looks like you are making it to hard maybe ??

Flemish Eye | Thimble Loop Spacing - YouTube

OOPS that wasn't the one I thought - will look again

gg

[mike_belben]

That actually might work a lot better if i can come up with some crimps. The one i tried was the west coast 3 tuck loggers splice or something like that and it was a pain to keep track of the 6 wires plus core x 3 tucks each at different interval.  I think the point was field spliceability without a press because it became a fingertrap braid. 

[g_man]

This one is better - Still not what I was looking for. Take 3 strands in left hand and 3 strands plus core in right hand. Unwrap 7 loops to come even or more for a tag end like in the video. Wrap the left hand under when making the eye.

Flemish Eye | Thimble Loop Spacing - YouTube

another

3 different ways to make a Flemish Eye in wire rope - YouTube

[g_man]

Having problems tonite - This one

Wire eye splice. 6 strand wire eye splice. Flemish Eye splice. Captain Wild splicing eyes. - YouTube

gg