My new saw

[doc henderson]

I respect my dealer and he cannot compete.  I thought the low price was at a big farm store that somehow is offering them at a lower price than my dealer can afford to sell them.  I like a deal like the next guy.  this seems more like a big corporation running a mom and pop out.  I was telling him to pass it up the line to his regional rep to let Stihl know.  I feel bad for the little guy.  Doc.

[dad]

I agree. Up until the last sentence I typed, I forgot it was a bigger outlet store. I honestly am saddened by the loss of so many small shops. It is a severe disservice to everyone involved ( except maybe the manufacturers bottom line in sales or something ) to run out the good, small, service shops that are personable, knowledgeable, and members of the real community. I honestly very much dislike big chain stores and sadly we are all forced to shop there more and more just to get things we want and need. Sad times we live in for sure! 

[rooster 58]

dad,
       And to all. Yes, I bought the saw from Rural King, which is akin to Tractor Supply, only much larger. When I bought my saw, the store had just received five of them. I bought the 3rd or 4th one.
     Yes, I do agree about box store pricing. I usually try to buy locally from the mom and pop stores. But as I am trying to get a sawmill operation off the ground, inflation  and all that, I just couldn't resist.  And at the time, the 220.00 price difference was exorbitant,  in my opinion. In my research, I saw what reviews claimed you could buy one for, and the lower price that I bought for was more in line with those claims

[dad]

Rooster, I am not bashing you AT ALL! I would have done the same thing if I saw prices that low. Sadly, money does not grow on trees. We are all being crushed with higher priced everything. Just part of the plan I guess. I do think that when we do have weak moments, or buy things with limited funds in a big chain that we should at least try to help the small shops afterward somehow to help them stay afloat. Maybe we should boycott bigger places? I do not know the true answer, only that we all like to get the most from our dollar and we all SHOULD support the small local businesses if they have proven worthy of our partnership by being honest and helpful.

Maybe some former shop owners can chime in and let us know if there are minimums that they have to sell for equipment. I am sure that they make more off servicing the equipment than anything that is sold as new product. At least small things like saws. I think that may be a way to keep them afloat? Anyway, I'll stop rambling. I am unqualified to do as much of it as I do ha, ha. Congrats once again on your purchase.

[sawguy21]

In a past life I sold Stihl among other products. At one dealership I was getting beat up on cutoff saws, the rental yard was buying them direct ostensibly for their fleet but was blowing them out the door below our cost. I asked the rep about it and was told that was a corporate decision so suck it up cupcake. I responded by not ordering any but he didn't like that, threatened to review our dealer status so I stocked one TS350 which was pretty much obsolete by that time and made no effort to sell it.
With that kind of favoritism Stihl is going to have the mom and pop stores tell them to come by and pick up their stock and signage or it's going to the auction, the independent dealer network is is a major reason why there are only three major manufacturers left. The local and successful dealer told them as much when he learned the rep was talking to the nearby rental yard, the logging market is no longer big enough to worry about.

[doc henderson]

I think I would have bought the cheap one esp. if I thought my dealer could do the same but choose more profit over selling it as cheap.  the issue is I saw my dealer and asked if he was selling at that price.  he said you I will always work with you, and I could sell you one in the mid 1400 range.  that was the best he could do.  It is an Amish shop.  has been passed through 3 owners in the past 20 years.  this guy has his whole family are working there.  many employees have worked there longer than I have been in this town, 22 years.  so if I thought he was being greedy or I was uniformed, I would have done the same.  I feel he is being set back by the corporation and the bigger store getting better treatment.  I also do not blame rooster.  Keith the owner invested his money to buy the store and has his wife and kids all working there.  they should not be at an unfair advantage.  used to be they could not give a discount, so you got 2 extra chains, ect.

[Spike60]

Well I got another take on this. And it frequently irritated other dealers in my area. I sold all my saws at discounted prices, never at msrp. I'd make $100 on a 372 and be happy.

For me, the money in the saw biz wasn't in the sales of the saws, but in the huge parts and accessories that went with it. Especially with the pro users who come in for "a few supplies" and spend $800 on high margin stuff. I mostly only worked on saws I sold and never any other brands. (No parts). And I couldn't handle the extra work besides. We had guys driving really long distances to us. Got a kick out of the different area codes I'd see when we got their phone numbers.

The reason is we actually focused on saws, and no other stop stocked the parts we did, or turned around the saws as fast. Our repairs were measured in 5 to 10 days. Other clowns around here are weeks and months. Back to saw pricing, as we saw more and more of these guys coming in, the actual saw prices weren't that important. I just wanted them to KEEP coming in. The more the better. Here's another way to look at it. Our labor rate was $90 and hour. Takes me 10 minutes to set up a saw. So, yes I'll sell that 372 for $100 over cost all day long.

So when I see stories like this about box and hardware stores and online sales driving shops out cause they can't compete, my answer is that you need to compete with YOUR game plan, not theirs. The Huskys in the box stores were mostly the 400 series homeowner stuff that wasn't important to me, therefore it never bothered us in the least. There's no money in those low end saws like the God awful 440 anyway. The situation with stihl and all the hardware chains, co-op's, and all the Deere stores would in my mind make it far harder on traditional dealers. For one thing these businesses are full line, not just the 10 or so low end SKU's that Husky puts in Lowes or TSC. But according to stihl, none of those operations are "box stores", and they all have service........somewhere. The degree to which stihl has peddled that no box store/dealer loyalty kool-aid is truly amazing. Guys are still drinking it too. Stihl must have a good still. Get it! :

I'm getting as tired typing this as you guys are reading it, so that's all folks.  :laugh:

[doc henderson]

I guess my assumption was that Stihl gave the big store a price break.  if they sell the at a loss so be it.  but the dealer that has been around for 50 years gets undercut, that is not right.  esp. when they (Stihl) used to not sell but for servicing dealers.  now that they are made in the USA, maybe they have changed the rules.

[Old Greenhorn]

Glad you weighed in on this Bob. I have been reading along and hoping you would jump in. My thinking and assumptions were pretty much along the lines of what you say. I think you laid it out pretty clear and it supports what Doc was thinking also. (BTW, Doc, aren't you supposed to be enjoying family time with your gals tonight? :D)
 My take on this at a higher level (company level, not intelligence level) is that these corporations are run by highly educated and degreed folks that have never worked a day in the woods in their life. Further, through their education they have learned their jobs is maximizing profits in the short term so they can each work their way up the ladder. Long gone are the times that someone built a business based on making the best product they could, building a (somewhat) devoted group of customers which they would service and support, thereby growing a long term business. The new concept is profits TODAY! They have lost the vision that built these companies in the first place and they will, eventually, suffer the consequences of their decisions. When they fail, they will wonder what happened and try to hire folks to figure out how to fix it, NOW! The folks that got them in that shape will have taken jobs with other companies another step up the ladder. I've seen it a thousand times.

 In my life I have only bought 2 new saws. All my others were hand me downs or resurrections of the dead. Both of those saws I bought from a dealer I knew would service them. 

[rooster 58]

dad,
     I know you weren't really berating me for my purchase.  I did feel a little guilty about my decision,  but that was just too much savings not to pass up. Hopefully  I can give the local shop business with stihl products and of course, service. I'd like to try that 2 in 1 file holder. And I'm going to need a case of bar oil too!