HAs anyone ever been inspected by OSHA on a small mill operation

[gspren]

In my years of civilian machine shop employment I saw OSHA come through a few times and cause problems but during 26 years in the machine shop supporting the Army Reaserch Lab none. I was told no one at OSHA had a high enough security clearance to enter our building so I suggest you all start doing all "highly classified" sawing, no admittance without "need to know" papers from the supervisor, which is you.

[Southside]

I suspect you had a resident DCMA employee there which is the DOD internal version of OSHA, takes care of the clearance issue. 

[Ianab]

We have an OSH debate going on at work currently. 

One of our rural mail clients has moved their mail box. Doesn't sound like a big deal, but they have moved if from the side road (corner section) to their main driveway, on the main highway. At the old location, you could pull off on to a quiet dead end street, drop off their mail, do a couple more boxes on the short street, and drive out again. 

With the new location, boss has to pull into their driveway to access the boxes, then reverse out onto a 60mph highway and then do a U-Turn. Around daylight, and in any weather. Boss has said "Stuff that, it's an OSH hazard, and there's been enough crashes on that stretch of road (true), I'm not doing it." 

Currently management are picking up this guys mail and delivering it themselves while things get sorted. But if they tell the boss she HAS to deliver to that box, OSH will get involved. 

NZ version seems both stricter but more flexible. As in "notice to fix", is more common. They find some minor problems, tell you to fix them, check back next month, OK. That keeps the inspectors "busy" because they have found some minor things to fix, so their numbers look good. And we also don't have exceptions for Ag or number of employees. If you hire someone, OSH rules apply. 

And if you think the cost of complying is steep, the cost of NOT complying, and then having an accident is x100. 

[WV Sawmiller]

Ian,

  I don't think our mail carrier ever leave the main roads except maybe to get a signature on a registered mail piece or deliver something too big for the box or such when they may pull up in a drive and I actually think that is more courtesy than required. I think by law they can just leave a notice of attempted delivery and you have to go to the main post office to get it or call and set up a time to be there at the box to collect/sign for the mail. Our boxes have a standard height (window height to a vehicle) we have to comply with and they have to be within a certain distance of the road. (I suspect they are in NZ too.)

  The mail carrier has a big notice on the back of their vehicle and generally have a flashing yellow strobe they use when delivering mail.

  When we would be driving to town if we saw the mail carrier coming on our county road we'd stop beside her and she'd hand us our mail out the window. The last time I tried that she said somebody saw her do that and complained and almost got her fired so she could not do that any more. We have very little traffic and most people know each other and don't mind. In fact it is common to see 2 neighbors meet and stop their cars and talk in the middle of the road. If you pull up behind them they will usually quickly finish their conversation and go. Sometimes they will pull up, let you pass then back up beside each other and continue their conversation. My wife gets mad and tells me to toot the horn and I refuse telling her at least one of them sees me and they will move in a minute. Evidently someone saw the mail lady stopping to hand out mail (actually we normally just pull up beside her at one of her regular stops and she'd look in her box and hand us ours) and was in a hurry and made a big deal of it.

  This lady ran over a rattlesnake several years ago on her route and wanted the  hide so she and her dad brought it to me to skin which I was happy to do for her. You need to stay in good graces with your neighbors and service people.

[just_sawing]

It appears that my safety at the mill is fine. the problem is I don't have Paperwork of the times that I have met with the guys working here. It appears that I need a paperwork trail for everything.  

[TreefarmerNN]

In my years of civilian machine shop employment I saw OSHA come through a few times and cause problems but during 26 years in the machine shop supporting the Army Reaserch Lab none. I was told no one at OSHA had a high enough security clearance to enter our building so I suggest you all start doing all "highly classified" sawing, no admittance without "need to know" papers from the supervisor, which is you.

Sounds like a lab where my brother worked.  Much of their work was routine testing but they also did work for the CIA, DOD etc.  At one point they had the Presidential limo, "the beast" on premises, complete with secret service agents watching.  The agents stayed with it overnight as well, even though the facility  was locked.  My brother could tell me about some of the testing, some he just said it was an alphabet test. 

[Ianab]

It appears that my safety at the mill is fine. the problem is I don't have Paperwork of the times that I have met with the guys working here. It appears that I need a paperwork trail for everything. 

That's about the best possible outcome. They find some minor issue and give you a "notice to correct" and life goes on. You have a diary called OSH meetings and make some notes in it when you have "toolbox meetings", maybe that quick chat you have on Monday morning where you lay out the plan for the week (whose doing what that day etc) Anything that needs fixing or looking out for gets noted down, and ticked off when it's fixed. Basically what you do on any well run worksite, just you make a note of it. 

It's a better visit than this one... 
https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/360458414/auckland-businessman-pay-4m-court-settlement-after-workplace-death

Summary, guy ran an oil recycling operation. Told one of his workers to weld up a large tank with oil residue in it. Tank exploded, blew the guy 100 yards and killed him. Basically the ole "welding up a car's gas tank" mistake X 1,000. Obviously the company was prosecuted and fined 6 figures. He ended up with a home detention (ankle bracelet etc), AND an extra fine for resuming work on the site before it had been cleared (stop work order following the accident). The cops then decided that they could chase him for "Proceeds of Crime" as the OSH violations were so blatantly criminal, that made the profit the company had made over the years "Proceeds of Crime". Usually that's reserved for drug dealers / fraudsters etc. If you can't show how you legitimately paid for those fancy things (lottery win / left them by a rich relative / had a high paying day job etc), then the police can basically impound or lien them, and apply to the Court to keep them. Anyway, the guy settled the case for $4 mil. I assume less then the properties actual value, but that's one heck of an individual "fine". 

Might have been cheaper to spend some $ on some basic OSH compliance?

[Ianab]

I don't think our mail carrier ever leave the main roads except maybe to get a signature on a registered mail piece or deliver something too big for the box or such when they may pull up in a drive and I actually think that is more courtesy than required. I think by law they can just leave a notice of attempted delivery and you have to go to the main post office to get it or call and set up a time to be there at the box to collect/sign for the mail. Our boxes have a standard height (window height to a vehicle) we have to comply with and they have to be within a certain distance of the road. (I suspect they are in NZ too.)

One difference is that we don't run modified vehicles (steering wheel on the other side). So often we are delivering on the wrong side of the road. There are basic guidelines for mailbox height etc, but location is more flexible. Obviously we have to be able to drive up to it, and it needs to be in a "safe" location to pull in. That's the argument here, it's safe(ish) to pull in, but it's as dodgy as backing out again into 2 lanes of 60 mph traffic. Other main road boxes have more sensible wide driveways where you can access the mail box, do a 3 point turn in the driveway, and drive out again. My part of the run is mostly backroads, with no where near the State Highway traffic, but one section is a "default" bypass of town, so logging trucks etc are always using it. Keep a good eye on the mirrors there and let them know what you are intending to do. But maybe 1% the traffic on the SH.  

As for the driveways, long drives aren't common. Maybe 200m is a longest I've got. So if it doesn't fit in the box, we drive in, unless the gate is shut. If it's shut, it's either sling it over the gate (carefully, and in a plastic bag if it looks like rain), or leave a card. Gates are usually shut for either dogs or livestock, and we don't mess with either. The regular online shoppers generally have a spot to leave things that we know, or at least haven't complained about the "bag over the gate" delivery. Others, the dogs are well trained, and happy to see us as they know we deliver dog food.   

But we are increasingly becoming more "Courier" than "Post" 

[Percy]

Up here in British Columbia, we have WCB(workers compensation board). They seem reasonable or I'm just lucky. Had a "surprise inspection " a few years back. Had to add a railing and cover some drive chains a little better than they were. In the course of conversation, I picked up the reason for their visit. A  Sawmilling competitor tried to throw me under the bus during his inspection which didn't go that well. 

[customsawyer]

I think there is one of two reasons for my surprise drop in. The first and most likely is that, I have a lot of dealings with the two biggest hardwood mills in North America. They have both recently had some major accidents, one including a death. I figure OSHA might have went through their books and found my info. The second is that I hurt someone's feelings on Facebook. There is some local sawing groups that I belong to and I'm not always the most tactful when I'm explaining the same thing for the 10th time in two days. I know I'm just as shock as you guys, that as sensitive as I am, that I could hurt anyone's feelings.
The fact that this guy came from Savanna, and he would have been involved with the inspections at the two big mills, is part of the reason for the first being one reason.

[TreefarmerNN]

I think there is one of two reasons for my surprise drop in. The first and most likely is that, I have a lot of dealings with the two biggest hardwood mills in North America. They have both recently had some major accidents, one including a death. I figure OSHA might have went through their books and found my info. The second is that I hurt someone's feelings on Facebook. There is some local sawing groups that I belong to and I'm not always the most tactful when I'm explaining the same thing for the 10th time in two days. I know I'm just as shock as you guys, that as sensitive as I am, that I could hurt anyone's feelings.
The fact that this guy came from Savanna, and he would have been involved with the inspections at the two big mills, is part of the reason for the first being one reason.

I suspect the first reason is correct.  Inspectors are like everyone else and tend to follow trends. If there is a death at one sawmill, then all sawmills are suspect.  It's not an unreasonable thought except there's a huge difference between a high volume mill with lots of employees and a small operation with just a few employees which runs at a lot slower pace in total even though each person might be working hard.  I visited one mill and while I didn't time it, it seemed like a log went through about every 20-30 seconds. 

[Percy]

I know I'm just as shocked as you guys, that as sensitive as I am, that I could hurt anyone's feelings.  

[Ianab]

I suspect the first reason is correct.  Inspectors are like everyone else and tend to follow trends. If there is a death at one sawmill, then all sawmills are suspect.

True. Sawmills tend to be dangerous places, no matter what the size. A small sawmill operation can be a death trap if it's run in a shoddy way. If you are running a safe operation, then expect a couple of "notice to fix" / we check back in a month sort of issues. No one gets 100% on the OSH tests. 

OSH don't hassle office business, because they are low risk, and those risks are covered by building safety folks. (you got fire escapes? etc). Paper cuts and stapler injuries don't register on the radar.  Now machinery, heavy materials, sharp moving cutty things do. 

They have numbers for serious injury / death accidents for various industries, and foresty / fishing / farming is up at the top of the list. 

[teakwood]

I think a fully automated big mill is way safer than a small operation because the handling of the logs and lumber, stacks and everything is more of a manual labor. 
Although the more employees there are the bigger is the number of idiots also