Get a load of this...

jpgreen · January 21, 2006, 02:08:03 PM

I just got my new Kawasaki 27hp engine for my LT40 yesterday. Look what the nice folks at UPS offered.. >:(

The driver asked, "You mind if I roll this over", while he was trying to get it out of the truck.. :

Would you open this box? I'm contacting the company who I purchased it from, before I open it. The air cleaner came in a separate box and it was fine.

Sheesh.. >:( >:( :

>:( >:(

http://www.westcoastminisplitter.com/Kawadam1.JPG

http://www.westcoastminisplitter.com/Kawadam2.JPG

http://www.westcoastminisplitter.com/Kawadam3.JPG

http://www.westcoastminisplitter.com/Kawadam4.JPG

Tony · January 21, 2006, 02:19:15 PM

I think I would start contacting all involved and show the pics!!!!!

>:( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:(

Good luck

Tony

VA-Sawyer · January 21, 2006, 02:21:40 PM

I hope you didn't sign for it. I would have refused delivery if they brought it to me that way. I have seen quite a bit of such lately while helping a friend that sells gym equipment. He accepted two different shipments with similar damage. We took pictures and noted damage on bill of lading. He is still trying to get the trucking company to pay for damages. They seem to have the attitude that you have to sue to get your money... very few will sue over a few thousand in damages. Wish the courts would wise up and award 10 times damages + court and legal fees.
VA-Sawyer

jpgreen · January 21, 2006, 02:28:48 PM

I didn't have to sign for it Rick.

I should have just refused it, but then- I didn't have my camera. How could I show how bad it was without these pics? They tell the story. I wonder how much damage internaly could be done, if nothing was bent or broken on the outside?

We live in a very small comunity, and there's one UPS driver. He saw it. I'll leave the battle up to the company I bought it from, and they can pick this one up and send me another.

I Hate UPS.. >:(

Part_Timer · January 21, 2006, 02:38:22 PM

While I understand your anger I also have to say that some of the blame falls on the person packaging the item that is being shipped. The corners are mangled and busted in which means lack af padding in the box which allows the items inside to move around.

Soemthing as fragle and heavy as an engine should be crated and shipped freight not put inside a cardboad box and wraped in tape.

I'm just suggesting that you raise cain with both of them.

Tom

jpgreen · January 21, 2006, 03:44:29 PM

It is thrashed.

I peeked inside the top, and the radiator is slamed into the crankshaft, and the engine has been swimmin' inside of there.. >:( :

There is no way it can even be shipped in this box again.

beenthere · January 21, 2006, 05:43:00 PM

Sure doesn't look like a UPS delivery size box. Isn't there a size and weight limit? My UPS delivery truck doesn't have equipment to move something like that around other than to push it or roll it. How much does it weigh?

I sure wouldn't be happy one bit if that showed up at my door. Is the first pic of the UPS delivery 'truck' or after it was loaded into an SUV?

Another sad 'delivery' tale. Is it a 'secret' who packaged and shipped it UPS? Just curious. I don't 'have' to know.

jpad_mi · January 21, 2006, 06:03:43 PM

Ouch! UPS is the worst. I had someone tell me that the folks at the distribution hubs are disgruntled and intentionally damage anything that says Fragile on it. I realize that's just hear-say, but it happens frequently enough that I'm starting to believe it. Hopefully TEW or UPS will make good on it.

Bibbyman · January 21, 2006, 06:12:16 PM

I bought an Onan engine from northern toolhttps://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=position"> Note:Please read the Forestry Forum's postion on this company and it came bolted down to a wooden pallet and then had a box over it and padding around it. As I remember...

At least I remember it came in in good order - by UPS.

Kelvin · January 21, 2006, 06:24:30 PM

UPS won't touch it. Every cardboard box is coded by how much it will hold, about 25lbs mostly. Nothing over that would even be considered covered. Shipper is completly at fault. Same with all shipping companies not UPS, FEd-Ex, USPS, nobody would cover that. I've tried. Talk to the guy who sent it to you.
KP

beenthere · January 21, 2006, 06:58:36 PM

Kelvin
I don't quite understand what you are saying. :

"UPS won't touch it" ???

Seems UPS did accept it, and it did have a 'fragile' label which states 'shipper is responsible for damage, as it was in perfect condition when it left the dock' or something to that effect.
I'd agree that shipper is completely at fault, the shipper being UPS, not the company selling the motor. I'd guess UPS pays for a new motor, being that they accepted it from the company shipping it.

jpgreen · January 21, 2006, 07:39:26 PM

Yes UPS ships packages that heavy. Bout 122lbs.

I bought it new from Tulsa Engine Warehouse. It looks like a factory carton inside. TEW seems very professional, and helpful. I don't think I'll have a problem with them, but won't know until Monday.

It's totally not my fault. I didn't choose the shipper or pack it obviously.

I also think a business would be crazy not to take care of something like this, unless they were non existent, or fly by night rip offs. Reason being is they could not buy/pay enough good money for worse advertising than a guy that knows how to post threads on industry forums that use their products.

This is a new venue (the net) and it's powerful. Companies like Mobile Dimension have know idea how damaging threads like the one posted here about their service can be.

I'm sure what they also don't realize is these threads come up on Google and other engine searches. They live for years and years. They don't just get buried on the forum.

Multiply that times 10- which is what I would do if these guys tried to burn me on this deal. I would start with Kawasaki Corp, and work my way down. They don't want to get a guy like me going on the internet... ;D :D

Part_Timer · January 21, 2006, 07:54:57 PM

What Kelvin is saying is that UPS will probably say that it is packaged improperly. I'd have to agree with that. However they (UPS) should have never accepted the pickup. I have had them refuse to pick up packages where I work if the contents "rattle around" inside the package.

The company shipping a product has the responsibility to make sure that a product is protected during shipment. I'm not saying that UPS doesn't have some responsibility here but come on you might as well have wrapped that thing in a grocery sack, it would have done as much good.

I bought my wife a hand blown glass bowl 18" across last year for her birthday. It came UPS and was not damaged at all. If thay had just thrown it in a box and shipped it I sure could not blame UPS. It came packaged in that spray foam stuff with ply wood on all 6 sides to protect it from someone at the freight terminal dropping an engine on it.

Tom

Part_Timer · January 21, 2006, 08:00:59 PM

JP

Your not the only one with shipping problems though. There is a thread on here about the mills that get shipped from New Zealand. They come packaged in 2x6"s and 1/2" plywood and they are getting destroyed also. Hter doesn't seem to be anything safe.

By the way I worked 2 years for Burington Air Expess while in college. little over minimum wage, part time no benefits. I can tell you that very few of them care one bit about what is in those boxes.

sad aint it

Kirk_Allen · January 21, 2006, 09:17:08 PM

We ship Fire Nozzles all over the world UPS and the boxes we use are standard 65lb boxes from ULINE. Our shipments are between 8lbs and 75 lbs. We have never had a problem and that is probably becuase we take the time to properly package them and fill the box with appropriate packing material.

Now, if the shipper is smart, he insures the shipment with UPS for the full retail value of the shipment. That way, no matter what, if the shipment gets damaged the shipper pays the insurance on it. They HAVE to becuase they excepted the shipment in the firstplace.

If TEW did not insure the order and give you a hard time about this I can only say I hope you used a credict card for the order. You can stop payment on the transaction and even reverse the charge if they already made the transaction by calling your CC company and telling them what happen. You have the evidence to support doing this.

The tough part is trying to get another motor from them. Chances are they will make it COD if you stopped a payment in the past with them.

Another thought, and not sure if it can be done to your mill but after talking with Sparks from WM today I found out I can upgrade my standard 25 hp Kohler to a 35 hp kubota, which is actually more like 38 hp. IF my engine every gives up the ghost that is what I am going to do. The two things that have to be upgraded when you switch to the deisal is the key panel and the up/down gear box.

Kelvin · January 22, 2006, 10:46:38 PM

What i meant when i said "UPS won't touch it", is there is no way they will pay anything for it. I had a similar experience. Just look at the code on the box, and if the item in the box exceeds the allowable amount UPS will not pay. THey simply send someone out with a digital camera, they snap a picture of the code on the box, and they say "sorry" not gonna pay. Thats it for them. However much you insured it for doesn't matter. The shipper, is the person who sent you the engine. They are at fault unless, i didn't quite understand your wording about the double box thing, they used the right boxes for the weight. Then you have a case, but i don't think it was the right box based on the pics. Hope the guys who sold it to you care about making it right for you. Its a pain, but all in all they ship millions of packages w/o too much problem. Just like the post office. Sure they're gonna loose some stuff, but they don't loose much considering. Good luck
KP

VA-Sawyer · January 23, 2006, 10:09:36 AM

Kelvin,
Are you refering to your shipping experience with your sharpener ? I remember part of that story.
VA-Saywer

jrokusek · January 23, 2006, 11:28:21 AM

I bought a Chinese copy of the Honda 13 HP engine. It came shipped in styrofoam and cardboard. So it made it from somewhere in China, to a dock somewhere in the US, to the southern part of the USA, to Sioux Falls, South Dakota. It was beat up bad but it looks like most of the beating was done by UPS. The holes & dents were through the UPS shipping labels! Strangely enough the little engine was in fine shape and ran well. Not bad for cardboard and styrofoam.

Jim

Tom · January 23, 2006, 05:20:01 PM

My last box of bandsaw blades was shipped UPS and apparently run through with a forklift. They aren't the most careful folks in the business, though I've found them to be relatively prompt. Lately they are switching delivery drivers around a lot. We used to have the same driver all of the time. We knew him and he knew us. I've had him stop me on the road and give me sawmill parts I was awaiting.

Now there is a new driver every time. They are only concerned with the amount of time it takes to deliver their cargo and don't know their customers from Adam's house cat.

My wife was hot.....I wasn't home. (I probably wouldn't have said anything)
She was upset that the driver (turns out the supervisor was in the truck too) was rolling the box across the yard and blades were on the verge of falling out of the hole. They were also parked on her lawn (the worse thing anyone can do) and the driver smart mouthed her back when she yelled "Don't roll that box?".

I came home as they were leaving the driveway and both employees were laughing. I didn't know what had transpired at the time.

The blades may or may not be damaged but Cooksaw has assured us they would stand behind them. I'm pretty sure the blades will suit me because I'll fix them if the set is gone. I'm still amazed that UPS's customer satisfaction is on such a border-line. This isn't the same company that I'm used to dealing with. I'm just glad that the things they deliver to me are a little more difficult to damage than the stuff they deliver to my wife. One of these days they will have to "deal" with her. I hope I'm visiting a neighboring state when that happens. :D

LeeB · January 23, 2006, 09:21:55 PM

and i thought my wife was an only child :D LeeB

metalspinner · January 23, 2006, 09:44:34 PM

The UPS counter lady I ship with has refused to deliver and insure packages of customers in line in front of me. She will tell them the proper way to package the items and if they don't correct the package she refuses it. I showed up late in the afternoon once and was behind a fella that was there for the fourth time that day. He was shipping car rims and showed up the first time with a label on each rim - no box. It all starts with the first person from UPS to come in contact with the package. In the case of the engine it was probably a pick-up from the store by a driver. If the deliverer did not insure it, then he is out of luck. I hope all works out for you.

VA-Sawyer · January 24, 2006, 06:02:26 PM

Hey JP, What have you found out ?

rebocardo · January 25, 2006, 12:00:01 PM

> had someone tell me that the folks at the distribution hubs are disgruntled and intentionally
> damage anything that says Fragile on it

True, plus, they have big ramps leading to the truck to slide packages down and sometimes they will just launch them and let them land at the bottom of the ramp, falling a good 15-20 feet horizontal.

jpgreen · January 26, 2006, 07:37:00 PM

UPDATE...

I was drift boat fishing for steelhead on the Smith River the past 3 days. Sorry for the delay.. ;D ;D

Tulsa explained to me that since the engine was a clearance item, they could not afford to repair, or send me another one at that price so they have offered a full refund, and will issue a call tag to pick up the heap.

I guess that's fair, not what I wanted to hear because it's gonna cost me more for another engine. I've got a friend that's a dealer and siad he can get me the same engine for near the same price, so I'm looking into that.

I commend Tulsa for a remedy to the situation, and not trying to stick me with a problem. That's fair for sure..

VA-Sawyer · January 26, 2006, 11:41:28 PM

JP,
Glad it worked out OK on that almost disaster.
Why don't you call WM and talk to their engine man. I think the name is Greg Brock... and look hard at the 28Hp Fuel Injected Kohler. They can put a whole package together, correct size pulley, fuel tank, altenator mount, engine mounts, etc for a pretty nice price. You may have gotten a cheap price on that other engine, but you will still have to spend money and time befor it is up and sawing. Going with the WM upgrade has other advantages like an engine installation parts manual and improved resale value.
VA-Sawyer