Timber ordering question

[bigshow]

Getting ready to order my timbers....

Any guesses on how much extra length i should have per timber?  i currently have 2ft extra per timber.  but wow..the board feet add up quick.  I asked the sawyer...he says allow for some wiggle room.  I asked a timberframer who buys from the same sawyer and he said it doesnt matter to him since he keeps quite a few timbers in stock.  So is 2ft a good rule of thumb...do i dare go a foot where i can (timber lengths are done in 2ft increments from sawyer)?

Jim and others..the floor is yours....

[Jim_Rogers]

Well, it really depends on your actual length needed.
For example if you have a timber that will finish end to end with tenons 12' 7" long then you need a 14' blank to start. I won't waste money on buying a 16' one.
If you have a timber that ends at 15' 4" end to end with tenons I wouldn't by a 18' one, I'd just get a 16' one and try my best to use that.
Usually logs come in with 4 to 6 inches over the even foot mark and I don't cut them back here, I mill them in log length and only charge for the even foot length. I only pay for the even foot length and I pass it on.
If your sawyer is doing the same then you should gain a few inches on each stick to make it possible to slide your layout one way or the other to try your best to get away from some defects that will effect your joinery.
Two foot over is a good standard rule but you have to watch the pocket book too....

Jim Rogers

[bigshow]

Ok, cool..i'm gonna go back and see where i can tweak.

I gotta say though.  I thought Timberframers made alot more on their frames...I think i'm getting a good deal on my timber and if i was doing this for someone else for profit..it would just barely be worth the hassle.

[mudburn]

Jim's advice sounds good. I've only ordered timbers for one project. Most of the timbers for my needs fit within the standard lengths. I did end up with some that were slightly more, but the log lengths allowed the little extra I needed. For instance, I needed a couple of them to be 16' 8". I'd ordered several 16 footers, and they ranged in length from 16' 4" to 18'. I used the longer ones for the timbers that needed to be a little longer and didn't have to pay for extra board feet. Very few of the timbers I had, whatever length, were less than 4" over the nominal length, and most were about 8" longer.

Darryl

[bigshow]

by  being more conservative with the timber length....~$2k shaved off....
I'm not freaking out so much now.

[blueduck]

As a general rule of thumb from a mill standpoint I try to leave 2-6 inches of trim length on my lumber, boards and timbers.  If I happen to have someting in the yard that is ordered short that will fill out an order and is a couple feet over i have been known to toss it on the unit and ship it as a shorter piece.  I have also been known to just dock myslef for pieces i did not think as best quality which made the end user happy and they probably used them ful length anyway.....

I had a fella bring in a few l oads of logs one time and want me to saw 21feet 6 inches  but only wanted to pay for 20 feet cause that is usually how its done on the 2 foot increment and he did not want 22 feet only 21'6...... but he had about 12Mbdft or just shy of 600 2x6's I ended up cutting..... I knew what he was building and we finally came to the agreement for him to pay me for 21 feet, which at the time really didnt amount to much cause i was cutting for ten cents a foot [$100/M] but he really didnt want me to trim off the boards to 20 feet and understood it takes time and dollars to run that extra couple feet each pass..... so I understand the desire to get the most you need for the least trim you have to have, but from my perspective you want to order what you need, and if possible inspect each timber for possible defect and if needed order a couple extra just to save on shipping and cost of waiting.....   As a mill owner and builder I know what people need, and wont sell anything if i can help it that i would not build with myself [I have sold items that i would not build with, but did so at a discount and with the understanding that the buyer would not tell anyone where they got the material from! but he took everything i had in that category and was willing to cut between defects and he was happy and i got more customers out of the deal anyway cause folks found out what i did for him]

In the end it boils down to dollars and sense, it dont make sense to spend dollars you dont have to, but it also makes sense to budget in a few dolars extra and get EVERYTHING you need upfront even if it means trimming off a little extra.  It is where a broker comes in handy, and I am looking for a broker to deal in timbers of size and length in case anyone has not read my post in the main forum.

William
Central Idaho

[Tom]

Good post, blueduck. Most of us feel the same way about our product too.  It's only right to give a customer what he needs and that's what custom saying is all about.  You're right about getting paid for the full foot and I agree, six inches gives 3 inches of trim on each end.  That's the fair way.

Oh!  The whole forum is the main forum.  Most of us read the whole thing, so duplicating posts isn't necessary. Matter of fact, it could get confusing.  Be sure you read some of the stuff in this Timber Framing section.  The joinery is fantastic. 

[bigshow]

All:

thanks for the comments.  I saved a couple $K on my order.  I did talk with the sawyer and to one of his clients, and feel pretty good about what i ordered.  Since this is my first timber order - i didnt want all these sticks laying around that i couldnt use.  All the above info is gold..hopefully it helps anyone else with apprehension.  I'll be the first to say though, that you gotta talk to the sawyer and a reference or two.  Before i pay up, i'll be going up to visit the mill and take a closer look at his product.