Vardo Gypsy Wagon Build-modern

[Crusarius]

Spectacular. Just be careful, I always find myself pushing the end of the project because I want to be done and always regret it.

Sometimes its good to take some time off.

[aigheadish]

Yeah, Crusarius, that's what I do! Just take some time off... Not procrastinate at all!

[DMcCoy]

Thanks for the comments, I fear I'm getting sloppy, and it concerns me.  I ended up rebuilding a door, after I had it installed.  I have backed off a little to get myself settled back down, making sure I do my work correctly first.  I don't really have a required schedule and it's no fun redoing work.  I feel something like chopping firewood with a maul would be helpful, some simple physical work.
The roof is starting to dominate my thoughts.  I have some structure to finish, then finish the sheathing.  It's my concerns about the putty and sanding that's giving me fits.  The roof is Western Red Cedar, 2nd growth, so it's pretty soft.  I'm considering using Bondo to fill the cracks and it contains fiberglass so it could also help stabilize any knots that have dried and cracked.  My fear with using bondo is that dries really hard and may make ridges and bumps during the sanding, because the cedar will sand off first. I need a fair amount of putty to fill the screw holes and gaps.  I wonder if a caulk would be better.
The sanding process has also caught my attention.  Wood boat builders sand their hulls with long 3-4' flexible sanding boards. Basically strips of thin plywood with emery cloth attached and 2 wood blocks for handles.  I may get some help with that process.
After it gets puttied and sanded, or sanded and puttied I was going to use canvas,  poor mans fiberglass they call it.  Our teacher recommended a rubber compound for roofing but the problems associated with it fill pages of the internet.  

[Follys Hero]

I have thoroughly enjoyed your build, your artwork and humor. Thank you. As far as the roof goes, a few suggestions. As an old boat restorer from the 80's, I have rebuilt a few canvas and epoxy decks. You are correct in the putty issue with sanding. A few considerations. First, your roofing would be considered a planked deck, and fiberglass or canvas with epoxies do not work well with this. However painting canvas is the norm, and some decks done this way have lasted 50 years or more. If you are going to use epoxy over your planked roof, please consider a thin plywood (Hope this doesn't add too much weight) to prevent cracking. Second, if you are epoxying, Spread a thin coat over your wood surface and Bondo first before sanding. It will soak into the wood and harden everything up. You would have to sand before placing your canvas down, but you were going to do that anyway. Look into boat deck repairs for further insights and good luck.

[DMcCoy]

Thank you for the kind words, your experience is exactly what I was hoping for.  Thanks for the added insights. I have watched a good few Youtubes by a nurse in AZ who has built a few teardrop trailers using canvas. She has had better luck gluing down the canvas with Titebond 2 than Titebond 3.  After the initial glue and smoothing she adds 2 roller washes of 50% titebond 2 and water to the top, to fully impregnate the fibers with glue.   After this dries she uses exterior latex enamel paint.  What she has done looks pretty amazing.
I believe it will be best for me to sand first and then fill. I agree with your planked decked analogy, I will look further in the boat/sailing world.

[Follys Hero]

Watched a few of those vids, interesting approach, should work. But before committing, you might consider looking into a boat decking technique utilizing Dynel and epoxy. Dynel is a bit stretchy, good for curved and odd surfaces, looks just like cloth canvas when done, and lasts darn near forever without any maintenance. Costs about $23/yard though, but way less than half the work. Doing my best to bog people down with options  

[DMcCoy]

After your comments I looked and found some interesting and current information about covering a planked (ocean) boat deck with canvas.  It does sound durable and my intended use will be much less harsh.  The instructor at Port Townsend mentioned the best storage place is an old barn which I can replicate well enough, should be a better environment than a marina. 
The canvas boat deck process described is the same as the nurse. Uses TB 2 as the base adhesive.  Cost is not the motivation so I will read up on the epoxy.  I want durability and to avoid de-lamination.  RV rubber roofs are held at the edges but the mollycroft looks like no go, it's a little to curvy.  I should look at old train roofing.
I also stumbled onto a couple of videos about fairing a hull.  I have my work cut out for me prepping the roof.  1) Hand plane 2) power sand 3) hand sand 4) fill 5) hand sand.  Then cover.
Currently I'm finishing my side windows and shutters then I will get back to the roof.  I'm going with leather straps to hold the shutters open.  Finding the names of hardware and tools from different trades can take some time.
I took a look the other day at the roof and did a little test planing.  Went okay, boat builders obviously use better grades of lumber.  There are some cracked knots that I will likely fill before getting started so they don't break out.  

 

[Follys Hero]

Auto body hand sanders are cheap alternatives to a Fairing long board, especially for your smaller roof, around 18" should work. Old train roofing? That puts you onto a metal roof? Aluminum or something to match your beautiful bay window roof, copper. No sanding, no planing, no painting, no delam. Maybe it helps reflect the sun, keeps the vardo cooler? I am not up on the cost of copper sheeting, maybe there is some sort of glue that would hold it to the wood with some screws? Beads of caulk or French seaming the sheet metal at joints? (French Seaming, another seamstress term) I had a friend do something with aluminum sheeting on a covered trailer, he used some kind of sticky rubbery sheeting and sheet metal screws. Sorry, I do not have any long term results on this. Of course the soothing sound of rain on a metal roof may not be to the Missus' liking?

[Soteric123]

FWIW - Wood Station wagons -1930s/1940s had wood slats running front to rear: a layer of light canvas, then batting for insulation, and a waterproof rubberized fabric top. Metal gutter/drip rails along the sides. The "leading edge" had a metal cap to deflect "road flak" ( stones etc.) (at least mine did). Always thought the design was to save weight.

[thecfarm]

Soteric, good to see you posting.
I also bet it was cheaper too.
This is a great thread to follow.
The roof I kinda don't understand, but I'm not building one either.  ;D 

[DMcCoy]

I have been working on the side windows and shutters.  I will need to give the roof more thought.  I can't get off my wallet enough to go with copper and the thought of rain and metal roofing won't get to first base.  I'm leaning towards canvas but the curves on the mollycroft slopes might be too much.  There are fabrics that can do the job and then some judging from the young woman standing in front of me at the dentist office, o.m.g!  I'm feeling old and out of date.  "Excuse me but I'm building a vardo and I was wondering what kind of fabric are your pants made from?" Anyways...
Shutters- I decided to continue with the drawer theme with the shutters.  I find over and over sorting boards can make them look better next to each other.


 
Shutter frames with weathered wood slats.  Flood brand clear stain applied.  I'm waiting on a couple of latches.


 
The shutters must be fully open to allow the window to swing open.  Tolerances got a little tight and I had to router a pocket in the shutter tops to make room for the window hinge barrel.  I put a very thin piece across the middle to help keep the vertical boards aligned.  I rounded the corners of the vertical boards instead of squaring up the rabbet.  This is all held together by glue which I've avoided so far.  I fear I may be revisiting the shutters at a later date with some nails.


 

[DMcCoy]

Holding the shutters open was another journey into crafts I'm not familiar with.  I considered very briefly hook and eye but didn't want that swinging around going down the freeway.  I cut some leather strips and wanted some brass round head bolt thing, called a button latch.  Bought these from Weaver leather craft.  In that category of never throw anything away I used some of my scraps from the copper roof.  The button latches come with a wide head brass bolt to fasten them.


 
Sits on the side rail.


 
I cut some old elk hide for straps but the color wasn't right.  I considered old welding gloves, new work gloves, ended up going to Goodwill thinking I could buy a cheap leather purse and cut it up.  My wife thought this was hilarious.  Well, cheap and leather purse or worse kinky leather boots don't go together.  She went along to save me the embarrassment or to laugh at me I'm not sure which.  I walked out empty handed.
I went back to the shop and dug out an old leather boot lace that was soaked in automatic transmission fluid per recommendation by my father-in-law.  A little copper wire and I have my shutter holders.  


  

[dougtrr2]

Nice looking project.  Could you take a few steps back and give us some overall pictures of the build so far?  

Doug in SW IA

[Follys Hero]

Or..... Wait till the end of your build for some full shot reveals! Patience Grasshopper.....

[Old Greenhorn]

I think that is up to DMcCoy as to when and how. This thread has enough active followers (well over 14,000 reads at this point) that he knows we are all interested in this adventure greatly. If you haven't read the hole thread from the beginning, this is a good time and there are lots of photos. Many of us have been following since the first post through all the different skilled trades he has demonstrated. I personally am savoring it quite a bit and will almost (I said ALMOST) be sad when he finishes it. Every time he makes a new post it's like a little present that cheers up my day.
 Be patient, this is a long road. I am sure he will have great photos when this is all done and as long as there is no spandex, I am sure we will all be very pleased and impressed by this massive project and the skills he is displaying.

[DMcCoy]

Thank you Old Greenhorn.  I don't mind posting a couple of pictures.  I have just spent $60 on 2 sets of shutter latches and neither works.  I'm building some today, which will work out better I think,  I'll post those pictures later.
So...I'm not going to clean up or dust, you get the "as is" tour, junk, cobwebs(!!!) and all.  It's a little tight, my main woodworking space I'm standing in.  Welding etc. takes place on the other side.
This is the right side.  The contraption hanging from the ceiling is an old Wade drag saw.  It's from my wife's family and still has compression. I've been told it is to stay looking like it does so it gets the ceiling.



  
This is from the back looking forwards.


 
Inside, dust, dirt, and misc parts.


 

[DMcCoy]

Left side. not much room on this side because of the loft.  So much dust!


 A peek through the shop doors.  Black door is water hook up/fill.


 
A few questions I get commonly;
How much does it weight?  I don't know, only by looking at other vardos I can guess at 3,500 lbs. + 500, -1000.
How am I going to get it out of the shop?  Either skids or rollers or both and a tractor.  This doesn't concern me much, my son will likely help.  After that it will get lifted and set down on the trailer- a 16' flatbed.  Hopefully after adjusting it to get the proper tongue weight there is a back porch.
It's mostly 12 vdc and propane, really meant to be off grid.  There is 1 - 120 vac outlet.
I had a gal from Tennessee up here with a group of my son's friends last weekend.  She looked me square in the eye and said 'you are going to get pulled over'...

[DMcCoy]

I have struggled on how to build the mollycroft end windows, and waiting didn't help.  I came to the conclusion that I needed a more traditional window frame and trim.  To make all the windows match I removed all the windows in the mollycroft and started over.  Despite being a set back this will solve all other issues.  I had planned on making the rear windows this way, why that plan didn't transfer I can't remember.
I'm not quite finished but the method is clear.  The glass gets installed in the window frame like my other windows including the gasket.  The flange covers the gap between the window frame and the mollycroft frame.  The flange will help with making a seal using caulk.  
Here is a picture left to right- Inner trim piece, the frame, the outside flange.


 
I stacked the trim piece under the flange.  Using clamps and small wood blocks I kept the inside faces aligned during cutting.  I'm removing excess material before routing.


 
I set my router table up with a straight bit and a rub block above it.  The gap is about 1/4".  The black mark gives me an idea of where the bit is which is helpful while doing the curved portion.  It was important that the working face of the rub block was long enough to catch the overhanging portions of the flange,  Again, the trim is under the flange and clamps/blocks are used to hold the inside faces in vertical alignment.



This gives the edges a nice smooth finish and eliminates saw marks and eliminates a ton of sanding.  

[DMcCoy]

Here is one of the center windows.  I put a 45 degree bevel on the flange to relieve the edge.


 
I used a laminate flush trim router bit inside to get the flange cleaned up.  This left an issue at the corner.  I picked up these "adorable" (son's wording) little planes up at HF.  They came in a 3 pack and I really only wanted this one.


 
I happened to see Leo on the 'Tally Ho' Sailboat U-Tube using one.  They work amazingly well for cleaning tight into a corner where a chisel is awkward.  They do come in a 3 pack...this one which I initially thought was useless happens to work really well for smoothing the tang on a brindle joint.


 
More later...