Norse/Igland or Farmi/Wallenstein style?

[wisconsitom]

Thanks Corley5.  Fransgard look like great rigs, just seem to need $$1500 or so more per tech spec than equivalents.  Maybe not the case when you got yours, but sure seems to be the case today.

It is good to have all this time to ponder, as whatever winch I may eventually end up with, it seems likely the iron ore has not yet been mined👎.

[John Mc]

As I stated I have never had no problems with the fixed pulley on top. This winch has seen a lot of action too.
I would not be concerned about the fixed top pulley.

How would you know if you are pulling through the lower swivel pulley and said yourself you never change it?  

Mike, because I have never had any of the problems that you said a fixed pulley have.
If it ain't broke, why fix it.
Winch is set up with the lower pulley, why take it off.  ???

Ray, If you are always using your lower pulley, then you are correct, there is no need for the upper pulley to be pivoting. The cable is always running on the same line to the lower pulley.

I'm not familiar with all of the details on your winch. My winch, and others I have used, is set up for it to be very easy to remove the cable from the lower pulley. I'm assuming they did that for a reason. It would probably have been easier to design a pulley that was closed on both sides, and the only time you would remove it is when replacing the cable.

I do pull from the upper pulley regularly when I need a little lift on the logs I am dragging out. At longer distances, the difference in the angle of pull is so small that it makes no noticeable differences in pulling.

However, when I get the logs up closer to the winch, that extra bit of height can make all the difference in the world. For example, if I'm winching from the trail, and my trail has a ditch along side or if it was cut into a side hill, that lip at the edge of the trail will often catch the end of the log, making pulling in that last few feet difficult. If there are large rocks or roots along there, I'm not likely to be able to just force the log through. Taking the cable out of the lower pulley gives me more lift height, allowing a much easier final pull to the tractor. 

The other place I use just the high pulley is when I want to lift the ends of the logs a bit if I'm hooking the chains into the slots on the winch, rather than pulling them out on the cable. My lower pulley is too low to do that lifting.

[thecfarm]

@wisconsitom ,I think you asked the height.
Mine is not quite 6 feet tall, 71 inches, raised up it's 89 inches high.
But mine is kinda on the big size. 
I've seen some for a 25 hp tractor, those are small.
Mike, the Norse does have pins to put in so can drag with it. When backing up and not pinned the butt plate will not pivot, kinda would be a bad design if it folded up when winching in.

[mike_belben]

john does your top pulley swivel or is it stationary?  

tom dont worry, i can still make booger welds without those finger nails. 

corley, do you do anything small time, or is it strictly supersize?   ;D

[wisconsitom]

Veddy goood...at least if I should find a Norse or Igland, I won't have to modify my building to back it in!

[thecfarm]

Don't modify. Build another one!!!
If saw what mine is in right now you would know I don't know nothing.
I built it before I started to live here. Built it out of 2 x trees.  ;D Not a spelling error, trees. It looks awful.  :( Has a wide rubber belt for the roof. Does not leak. Cedar trees for rafters with a few maple thrown in too. Tin roof for the siding. Oh well does not leak, I know I said that all ready. Has to have at least one good point.
 It's kinda out of sight.

[wisconsitom]

Too funny Ray.  I've been responsible for some interesting architecture too!  

Without dragging you thru a decade or so where some other stuff was going on up at our tree land,  about 3 years ago we got one of these Amish sheds on skids units dropped off.  Great value at that time,  40-footer, we cut it nearly in half, for a bit of shed and a bit of cabin.  Overhead door on tractor side, I just clear with rops down.

We like our snug and efficient little scene there, but are in fact thinking about another shed, to relieve overcrowding in the shed.😁

[bitternut]

I have the same winch as thecfarm. I purchased mine in 2005 for $2900 shipped to my barn including shipping and 3 additional chokers ( 6 total ). At that time I shopped around with Farmi and Fransgard. The Norse 450 that I bought turned out to be a great purchase. It has served me well all these years with not one problem. A great purchase. I have no idea why other makes cost so much more but they do. In my opinion the other brands are over priced. Some might be just as good but definitely not as great a value when price is considered.

Now all this talk about upper pulley and lower pulley can get kind of confusing.  Yes my winch has an upper pulley at the top of the winch that is fixed and it has a lower pulley that swivels. The difference with mine is that it has two positions that the lower pulley can be mounted. There are two sets of stout horizontal ears that you merely pop a large pin out and pop it back in to remount the swiveling pulley at the height desired. Easy peasy. I use the upper position for very large diameter logs mostly or if I have a bunch of polewood hooked onto the notches.

As for pulling logs in on an angle that definitely is a bad idea. Line your tractor in line with the log unless you have a snatchblock. That snatchblock just might save your life or a flopped tractor. I run the tractor engine just above idle and stand on the tractor side that appears to be the greater angle of pull. I stand near the rear tire with my arm extended and my hand on the rear tire and watch the log as it is retrieved. If the log gets caught on some thing I can usually see that. If I happen not to see it get caught I will feel the tractor tire move and can react by releasing the pull rope. Anyways that's how I do it.

Its your money and your choice so look at all of them and make your choice, but definitely get one. You won't regret it.



 

[thecfarm]

I just noticed after all these years of looking at the winch side. We bought ours back in '93. That was when they came with 6 chains. But as I say, you won't be needing six 8 foot chains with a 40hp tractor.
 There was a piece of tubing that ran across the back of it, maybe about a foot below the other adjustment for the pulley. It was about 3 inches thick. Seem like 4-5 times a day a log would get under that and we could not winch it higher. My Father drove the tractor and I was the grounds guy. He would have to get on the tractor and drive forward a few feet and I would winch it back up higher. We had a piece of plate steel welded on it to make it flat, like yours. 
When you get one, watch what is coming at you too. I was cutting a lot of small dead stuff, there was a lot down too, and a few times some of the dead trees would come right at me.

[wisconsitom]

Thanks bitternut (and great tree BTW!).  Yeah I'm totally sold on the value of the Igland product-it has become my hoped-for item.  I get the pulley setup on them and it's fine.  The big deal seems to be that nobody has anything right now 

[wisconsitom]

Yeah I get that.  Used to rope many large limbs down on lowering lines and every now and then another usually smaller branch would fall onto or get tangled up on rope. Down she comes a-zinging on that line, straight at you.

[Corley5]

corley, do you do anything small time, or is it strictly supersize?   ;D

Go big or stay home  ;) :D ;D

[bitternut]

Having the two locations to mount the bottom pulley comes in handy when you need to winch larger trees like this red oak. You need to have room for the hook and the three sliders on the end of the cable. The Norse hook cable end is attached with a swagged fitting that takes up very little room unlike some others that have three cable clamps attaching the end hook.
 
I heat my camp and house totally with wood dragged out of my woods so the winch gets used quite often. My cable is original and still in good shape so they will last a long time. I have a neighbor at home that leaves his Wallenstein sitting outside next to the barn. I would not recommend that you do that. ???

Here is a large oak hooked on mine.



 

[thecfarm]

What I meant by the dead trees coming at me, is at my feet. What I was winching in would push a dead tree laying on the ground and that would try to take me off my feet. I had a lot of dead fir in one area. Most was only about 6 inches across.

bitternut, a big one!! I noticed it looks kinda low. The 3 foot pines I was talking about would come out like that. I did not have enough power to lift them all the way up.
I had a longer chain for those. That 8 foot chain would not go around them. Only need one longer chain.  ;D

[wisconsitom]

No I got that Ray.  I was comparing it with another tree activity where the object at the end of the line of force is you!

[thecfarm]

Gotcha.
I drive by the place that I am cutting every time I go up or down the road. It's on a slight hill, I could almost have started on it again, but I did not want to fall while doing it due to the ice. Summer will be here in a few more months. Just have to wait. Then I have to wait for it to dry up some too. The water collects in one part and just seems to sit there until late June.

[wisconsitom]

You guys do realize the trees I'm mobilizing to thin got planted mostly in 2013!?  So, what I'm saying is that in one sense, I've got time.  But the larch are in need of continued thinning now already.  Then too, there's the slightly earlier sections-2008 thru 2010-that are much larger, although I'm mainly leaving that area as a seed orchard.  Plus the swamp, if I mess with anything in there.  Nuff stuff to do👍.  

All's ya, now you be sure to yell in my ear if you hear about anything available in this size class...or maybe better whisper 🤫.

[Walnut Beast]

Having the two locations to mount the bottom pulley comes in handy when you need to winch larger trees like this red oak. You need to have room for the hook and the three sliders on the end of the cable. The Norse hook cable end is attached with a swagged fitting that takes up very little room unlike some others that have three cable clamps attaching the end hook.

I heat my camp and house totally with wood dragged out of my woods so the winch gets used quite often. My cable is original and still in good shape so they will last a long time. I have a neighbor at home that leaves his Wallenstein sitting outside next to the barn. I would not recommend that you do that. ???

Here is a large oak hooked on mine.

Looks good 👍. What size winch and cable run on your outfit 

[wisconsitom]

While we're waiting for responses to WB's question, here's my latest, tee hee....

If'n I get a winch, I will probably use it in winter quite a bit.  We've got Heterobasidion root disease pockets within 25 miles of our land, which makes me want to harvest pine family members during cold weather.  I know about the stump treatments and yes, those will come into play in another twenty years, when much larger trees and larger scale thinning will be involved....so..we don't have to talk about that😆...
...so here's the question..how does running your rope or cable back and forth thru the snow and winding it back up and putting away wet or iced up affect winch performance/maintenance?  I know some of you also routinely do winter work with your machines-just wondered if that becomes an issue.  Even with my tight shed quarters, I should be able to keep the winch inside, but lots of snow etc can come in with it if it acts anything like any part of my tractor that has been physically in contact with the snow where some always accumulates.

[g_man]

My Farmi 290 does not have a lower pulley and I use the chain  slots on big trees for skidding out. If they are to big to lift off the ground like this maple I put two chokers on the tree with the chains coming up from the bottom, one on each side of the butt. That way I can pick up high enough. That's a 30 hp tractor with a 290 winch.





gg

[g_man]

I maybe should have added, and this is from my personal experience, if you are skidding a heavy hitch from a high point on a small tractor like the top pulley in my case or a lower pulley set up high to accommodate big logs you better be mighty careful. It is the turns that will get you. Flat straight going may feel like there is nothing to it - no struggle, no danger and you get comfortable with it. But if you make a sharp turn and the hitch gets out at about 45* or more it can pull you over in a heart beat. If you are coming up hill the turn does not even have to be that sharp because you are moving into a side-hill position. Look at the picture above and imagine the log up near the top of the winch

By using a hitch on your log with a chain on each side up from underneath it you can always pick it off the ground no matter what the diameter is - as long as the 3ph can lift it that is.

gg

[47sawdust]

Yep, I've had that heart attack moment you just described.

[wisconsitom]

Great pointer, Gordon.  If I end up doing what I think I'm gonna be doing, I should be able to winch out from the edge of blocks, on lanes I've established, from both directions, then invite neighbor over with the mini Gafner and pick up.  Time will tell on that.

In other news, a dealer in VT that one of you kind souls mentioned to me is now saying that maybe the littlest Igland could in fact still be coming, possibly in April.  Time will tell on that 😜. too!  Hey, I know a guy that has a birthday in April.  Unfortunately for that guy, it's his wife's turn to get something....

[thecfarm]

That good news on the winch.
Others can answer the winter logging better than me. Yes, I did and do it. But not for 6-8 hours steady day after day. Probably the longest I ever really did much winter work, in snow, was when I cut the bog off. That was an adventure. I got it in my head I was going to cut off some of the bog. This is floating land, no way to get a tractor on it. I had to winch everything to me on the trail. Most of the "trees" was really no bigger than 6 inches across. Stubby and dead stuff was the norm. I would lay down a chain and pile wood on the chain. I would twitch out a bundle of wood. I would pull out 150 feet of cable and had another 100 to add to that. Was a slow process, but I wanted you to know I would pull out all the cable many times in a day. Never had any problems with the snow on the drum or any ice problems. 
Just had problems with breaking through the snow and putting my foot into a hole and getting my foot wet. 
The deer enjoyed the limbs!!! 

[g_man]

On the winter work - I have never had a problem with the cable or drum icing up or freezing. I work a lot in the snow and my tractor stays outside. I do tarp it but not the winch. If there is an ice storm the chokers hanging on the winch will get iced up of course but the cable and drum stay good.

gg