Watcha Makin'?

[Tom King]

A note about "crown staplers".  All staples have crowns.  The crown is across the top that connects the two legs.  They're called names like narrow crown, medium crown, or the crown width will be listed in their name.

For instance one manufacturer may call staples with 1/4" or narrower "narrow crown staples".

Medium crown staples, depending on manufacturer mostly have 7/16 or 1/2 inch wide crowns.


Here is a picture, from left to right, a narrow crown stapler, two medium crown staplers, and a wide crown stapler.

The difference between the two medium crown staplers is that one shoots 15 gauge staples, and the other 16 gauge.

The other picture shows, narrow crown staples, both gauges of medium crown staples, and wide crown staples that the different guns shoot.

If I asked you to hand me the "crown stapler", which one would you grab.


 

[Old Greenhorn]

Well, going from one (complex, long running) extreme, to another (simple, quick and dirty). I whipped up 3 of these today, inspired by both Howard and Don P's efforts. I picked up a 1/4" stapler at HF for 25 bucks or so and a box of staples. We don't do canning anymore, but I did think of this:



 

 They hold a 6 pack of your favorite canned beverage nicely. All made with scrap or leftover material. The slats are made from a 3/8 x 12" x 12' piece I milled off a cant to hit the size I needed, the ends were left over 1x6 pine from a project 4 years ago. The handles were cut-offs from those log carriers we made back in the winter. The main expense was labor. Sue I could jig these things up and knock out a bunch in not time, but for just a few, the assembly was a 'one at a time thing' and each one was put together just a little bit different to test some theories out.
 I am doing this little show over at the FD on Sunday and I thought maybe these might sell better than my benches. I figure a sign explaining I can make any size to order, with our without a handle. What do you guys think I could charge for these? Maybe 15 bucks? I will sell two (if I'm lucky maybe) and keep one for 'field testing'. I thought it might be a novelty for summer party season or something.

[beenthere]

FYI OGH
The bud light and anything associated with Bud ain't selling these days..  :    ;D   8)

[Old Greenhorn]

Well, I ain't selling beer and that's not Bud Light (aka flavored water), but it is just a tiny notch above.  :D ;D Guess I gotta make a sign that says "beverages not included".

[Don P]

I'm right certain I lose money at $20 per so you ought to be right in there at 15  .

I picked up one of those HF narrow crown air staplers too, I think the 2 boxes of staples cost as much as the gun.

I sold 2 walnut trays fast, the third hasn't gone yet. A mahogany canning jar box and a couple of pine trays in the last month but i think I've saturated for awhile again, need to shift gears, maybe some OGH 6 pack/ garden totes  ;D

[Wlmedley]

My DIL requested a new mantle and said she wanted a rustic look.I told her she came to the right place,rustic is all I know  :laugh:

 

[WV Sawmiller]

Tom,

   Maybe you can advertise them as "Working Man tool chests" and sell them okay.  ;) Good luck.

   I'm debating whether to return my 20V stapler or return the staples and buy some 1-1/4" one and see if they work better. I liked the weight and speed but the staples just didn't drive up far enough.

[Larry]

They hold a 6 pack of your favorite canned beverage nicely. All made with scrap or leftover material. The slats are made from a 3/8 x 12" x 12' piece I milled off a cant to hit the size I needed, the ends were left over 1x6 pine from a project 4 years ago. The handles were cut-offs from those log carriers we made back in the winter. The main expense was labor.

I made some of those.  The making was the easy part for me.  Sales were a struggle as is normal.  I did sell a lot in a gated community where most of the homeowners have a pool.  Somebody posted a picture of one on a neighborhood app and than everybody had to have one.  At a craft show or market sales were slow.

I have two of the Dewalt narrow crown pneumatic staplers.  Most of the time they work well but in hardwood with long staples I've had trouble.  I may have turned up the air pressure above max once or twice to solve the problem. ;D

[Old Greenhorn]

Well I am only trying to hold on a 5/16" thick slat, so I just went with the 1" staples and they sink in fine.  Nice thing about pneumatic is that you have a regulator to turn up. Not so much with battery. ;D If it's a strictly shop tool I buy either wired or air powered. If it might need to be used in the field, I think about batteries, at least so far.
 I went out after dinner and knocked off two more crates just for my small table products. I figured I could use them for transport, then put them out for talking points. I'd rather just take orders and make what folks want rather than try to build and guess what people want and have them hanging around. I don't have the storage room and I am working on another table that will bring me close to filling up my space. Gotta sell some of this stuff... soon.
 Howard, I like that "working man's too chest" and I may just use that. If nothing else, it's a talking point.
 Don, thanks for the encouragement ;D. If you lose money at $20 then that confirms what I was thinking. I brought in the prototype in at dinner time and the wife was barely impressed. I asked what she thought on price and she said "I dunno, 7 bucks?" I told her it was worth more as firewood with less labor involved. The two that I knocked out this evening took about an hour, so 1/2 hour a piece, which seems fair. About 10 bucks in labor, plus materials. I don't see how I could do these regularly for much less than 20 bucks. I settled on $15 just to have a cheap sale item. If I sell two, it pays for the stapler and half a box of staples. I expect this 'show' I am doing will not generate a single dime, but what the heck, you never know, right?
 I need the 'exposure', right? :D :D (if you are a performing musician, you will understand the reference.)

[aigheadish]

Look great Tom and Wlmedley!

Tom, those should be listed for 20 bucks but negotiated to 15. Maybe make a few that are legit tool boxes with the side and bottom slats that close the whole thing, so you can toss a bunch of small tools in there. My wife uses them a lot when she's gardening (also a good staging tip for the show), she tosses some gloves, a little shovel, maybe some shears, etc. Edit- A gardening kit box, staged with that stuff, then sold brings another 10 bucks or more.

You could also make a kid version and go get some cheap painting kits to sell with the crate, for a fun project for the kids (or for the kids to make for Father's Day).

I think if you stage a couple well it'll help them move.

[NE Woodburner]

People often don't have a good grasp of material and labor costs for small woodworking items and the cheap foreign stuff available doesn't help.

I built some cutting boards with scrap pieces of maple and cherry one winter to clean up my shop and have something to do. I gave them all away to friends and family. SIL sees one and says "can you make me a round cherry charcuterie board - the one I was looking at was $50.00!!!" I didn't have enough scrap left so had to buy a cherry board. With the time and material I had into the board I should have asked her where she saw the finished board for $50 as I could have saved money...

[Old Greenhorn]

Pricing is a never ending problem (for me). I am no longer allowed to ask my wife's opinion on pricing because she comes up with some really low prices on things  that won't even cover materials sometimes, let alone return something for my time. I just can't go that low and make anything on it. She never complains when I bring home 3 grand on a custom dining room table though.

 Here's a case in point, let's call it a poster child for discussion. I have a show tomorrow and just completed this one this morning after the proper brass screws I ordered arrived.



 

Those legs are original (old) Singer Sewing machine legs, which I wire brushed and repainted gloss black.



 

 The shelf and stretcher are Sycamore which I bought for too much. Shelf is about 6/4 and the stretcher is octagonal stock I made from the same board.



 

 The top was a badly cupped RO slab with 2 live edges. To remove the cup I ripped it down the center, planed the 2 halves to (nearly) flat, jointed it and re-glued them back together.



 

 In the photo above you can see the temp screws I used for fit up. The screws that are on the shelf and stretcher were replaced this morning with brass flatheads I had to order (5/16-18 ) and look great. The screws in the top are now 1/4-20 black steel socket head cap screws because of random hole location that existed on the legs before I got them and side clearance issues. I used threaded inserts in the wood at all connection points and those 5/16 inserts were more pricey than I thought (3x what I pay for the 1/4-20's). The finish all over is oil based polyurethane. Total time on the project was about 5 days between all the other work I have to do. So lets say I actually had 12 hours on it actually working. Perhaps it was less.

 So there you have a test case. How would YOU price this? I know markets are different everywhere, but let's just say you price it for what YOU think you could/would sell it for. If you have a good or poor market location, maybe mention that in your comments just for balance. There are no wrong answers here. I think I wrote down a price for this on my inventory list and it was based on comparison to my other work with similar materials, but I can't remember it right now and it's not cast in stone. In any event, I'd like to hear what others say before I weigh in. No, you can't hurt my feelings on this, so don't worry about that. I really want to hear about how others think this stuff through. Given all the constant conversation on what to charge for a BF of rough sawn lumber, I think this would be a worthy conversation.

[Wlmedley]

Tom, I wouldn't have any idea what price to put on it.If it's like my area if you price it high people will think it's really nice but they can't afford it and if you price it low they think it's probably not worth anything.Now if you give it away they will gladly take it and then tell you that you could have got a small fortune for it if you had put it up for sale  :laugh:

[doc henderson]

It is cool, and everyone will think it is cool.  the problem with  rustic, is many think they can go out to the yard and grab a log and make one in and hour.  I would want at least 30 bucks an hour so that is about $400 including some for materials.  I would take a thousand if offered.     the finish and proportions are fantastic.  you really are a woodworker!

[beenthere]

My wife is a sewer and quilter, and I know what I'd pay for it if I found it at a shop. 
But I do think I would insult your craftsmanship and hard work if I said that price "out loud". 
However, I would pay the same for just the old sewing machine frame too with original patina. 

[Old Greenhorn]

Beenthere, as I said, you can't hurt my feelings here. It's a discussion. I think it's safe to agree that 50 bucks is a bit low and these legs often sell for that or a little more. (But if that what you think, say so.) I have even see the original tables with the treadle sell for that, just missing the machine. My wife (a quilter too) has a complete, restored working one in her room. Don't dance around it, tell us what you think.

If it helps, go back to the last bench I posted in this thread with the white Rite Legs on it (Reply #1029). I bought those legs at a deep discount because they were old stock with some dings and wear and were painted a 'no longer used' color, plus I get a 'builders discount'. The slab was also pieced together drops from another job. The overall quality is good. Because of that I priced it at $250. maybe that will give you a comparison, but I don't want to sway this in either direction. I'd like a discussion, not a 'feel good'.

[jaciausa]

Very nice. i think 450 wouldn't be to much for some markets.
150 materials. 100 for legs so you can buy 2 more sets and 50 for wood.

[Crusarius]

around here I would price it at $250.

That would be reasonable unless you wanted to sell it quick then you would have to give it away and offer delivery and installation at your cost. even then you would have to tape a $50 bill to it just to get rid of it.

Wish I was joking but thats how it is around here.

[rusticretreater]

Price it for what it needs to be for your efforts, get it placed with a gallery.  You will have to pay the consignment fee, but you don't have to deal with the sale.

[GAB]

Price it for what it needs to be for your efforts, get it placed with a gallery.  You will have to pay the consignment fee, but you don't have to deal with the sale.

And the tire kickers.
GAB

[WV Sawmiller]

 

 


 
At our local flea market today I picked up the old Singer sewing machine legs from a vendor. I have had my Lichtenburg contractor who is there every week looking for them for me as he mentioned he saw several come through last month.

This is the first Singer stand I have seen of this style. Always before the style I had seen were the heavier cast iron style as shown on Tom's table above. This set of legs seems to have been stamped and is lighter weight than the cast iron. I am speculating Singer went to this model later in their career as a cost saving measure as I do not see them as the same high quality as the cast iron legs like Tom has. They will still make a nice little table when a pretty Live Edge Slab is added.

I had already planned on brushing and painting this a glossy black. I am not planning on removing the the treadle and wheel. The Singer Logo is hard to see in the picture but it on the plate in the middle and on the foot treadle.

I had not read this thread yesterday after Tom posted his table and I am a more than a little concerned to find us thinking along similar lines. : :D :D

I am interested to see what kind of price this piece brings so I have a better idea what I may be able to expect from mine even though I am sure Tom's is better quality than what I will be able to produce.

There is an old singer sewing machine in a local flea market style venue I have been watching and thought several times about buying it. Unfortunately it does still have the machine and woodwork and could be restored to working order if the right purist comes along. I don't have the heart to destroy it just to use the legs to make a table. Maybe I should be more heartless and more business minded.

My mom has one or two of these at home in Fla but she put a thin sheet of granite on as a top instead of wood.

  BTW - purchase price for these legs/stand was $12.

[21incher]

I'm with Crusarius.  Up here you would be lucky to get $250 for it unless you rented a space at a tourist trap like the Windmill Farm market that has many high end visitors mixed in with the tourists.  One thing that would distract me from buying  something  like that is we all have different tastes. For some reason I don't  like the wood spindle across the bottom because  it distracted me from the legs and probably would have gone with a thin matching black steel rod that doesn't draw your eye to it along with leaving the original patina on the legs. Once you get over a certain  price items are no longer an impluse buy so a local flea market will probably draw lower offers. I feel in the end you should  be able to get $50 an hour for dedicated time spent on a project like that and just have to find the proper clientele to market to. The Chinese and Indians are getting good at creating cheap rustic that will draw away many customers  that have no knowledge of what it takes to produce a beautiful custom one off item. As we all know inflation has also become a problem on both ends. 

[Old Greenhorn]

Interesting set of legs you've got there. I have never seen that style around here. Looks like the treadle parts are unchanged form the older ones though. After my post this morning I checked CL and found several sets available, none were less than $85.00. Some had tops I wouldn't use anyway, junk. In any event, what you have should clean up nicely and make a nice easy able that looks great. Yours should be just as good as mine all day long, I think.

 Which brings me to the one I built. Took it to a show today and saw little interest in any of my stuff from actual buyers. BUT one woman was really taken with that sewing machine table. SHe came back twice, asked for dimensions and wrote them down. She took my card, but really I don't expect to hear from her, but at least it was a response.

[Crusarius]

I have a friend that does high end cabinetyry and stuff like that. he said if they come back to look at it 2 times then take measurements. then come back a third time to measure they will buy but if the third time never happens its a dead deal

[Wlmedley]

I did pretty good today.My SIL and brother came up today for a visit and she really liked a red oak bench I made awhile back.I told her to take it home if she wanted it.Wasn't getting much use sitting in my woodshed.My brother inherited our old home place and there is an old stone wall there that is falling down and built out of large cut stone. I need a few of them to repair my barn foundation and they said I could have all I wanted so we both got what we wanted and all are happy.